# Poll: New forum for collaborative brainstorming, idea development, stuck plots, etc.



## Pluralized (Jul 2, 2013)

Would you like to see a new sub-forum in the Workshop that is specifically geared toward helping one another develop ideas, unplug the clogged plot and dead-end stories? 

By placing this sub-forum in the Workshop, where members help one another with their writing, we would have an exciting new resource for improving storytelling and plot coherence. There are some powerful imaginations lurking around here, and I'm sure some of them would quite enjoy helping members develop their ideas. This isn't to take the place of your own rumination, hard work, and thinking for yourself, but something to use as a resource when you're stuck and need fresh input.

I'm a proponent and I think it would be great fun to help each other create. Please vote!


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## Lewdog (Jul 2, 2013)

Ha this is exactly the thing I'm best at.  If only I could become a good writer...:dejection:


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## Staff Deployment (Jul 2, 2013)

I think the Writing Discussion board is perfectly fine for that stuff, but if this subforum did exist I would undoubtedly use it anyway.


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## Pluralized (Jul 2, 2013)

Staff Deployment said:


> I think the Writing Discussion board is perfectly fine for that stuff, but if this subforum did exist I would undoubtedly use it anyway.



Obviously you're right, but threads get buried quick in the WD board. Something purpose-built would be supremely enjoyable.


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## Skodt (Jul 2, 2013)

I'm really with SD on the fact this is what writing discussion is sort of for. Would kind of blur the line of what goes where.


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## Jon M (Jul 2, 2013)

Writing Discussion isn't a private forum, though. That's why this is a good idea.


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## Staff Deployment (Jul 2, 2013)

Jon M said:


> Writing Discussion isn't a private forum, though. That's why this is a good idea.



Jon raises a good point. If members wish to collaborate in private, they're limited to PMs or off-site solutions such as Google Docs.


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## Foxee (Jul 2, 2013)

I think Writing Discussion is more for some of the technical aspects of writing (at least that was the original idea) where this is actually more of an idea-swap and 'help I'm falling down plot holes' forum. I could see test-driving it since so many people want to do this anyway.


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## Cran (Jul 2, 2013)

Writing Discussion started out as a catch-all for both specific (the sub-text was _discuss your work in progress_) and general story development; more so into the second when augmented with Hints and Tips. 

We can set up a members-only board or sub-forum in Writing Discussion just as easily as adding another board or sub-forum to Workshops - we've done as much before, we have the technology ...

That said, there is an argument for distinguishing between brainstorming specific points and collaborative building of a story. The first would more properly belong under Writing Discussion; the second in the creative areas (ie, Workshops).


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## Robert_S (Jul 2, 2013)

I would be there.


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## FleshEater (Jul 2, 2013)

This sounds like a great idea. Sometimes I feel like House M.D., like I need those few people (Randy, this could relieve your burden of me ) to talk to me about my work until I receive the epiphany through the mighty and powerful Muse.


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## Leyline (Jul 2, 2013)

I'd have to say no to this, sadly.

I've seen three forums now shut down because of 'brainstorming' threads where one person screamed bloody legal murder at another because an 'idea was stolen.'

That's a horrible thing. I LOVE brainstorming story ideas. It's kind of an addiction to me. I'll brainstorm any idea you want to think of, whoever you are, and all you have to do is PM me.

But I don't think we need the owners having to argue the rights when it comes down to it.


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## popsprocket (Jul 3, 2013)

Leyline said:


> I've seen three forums now shut down because of 'brainstorming' threads where one person screamed bloody legal murder at another because an 'idea was stolen.'



Perhaps a Legal 101 sticky to warn people that 

a) they are posting their stuff online, albeit in a member's only board, but that they are effectively sharing their idea, and
b) copyright 101, an _idea _can't be copyrighted, only the execution of the idea can be protected, so there's no point in getting all angry over someone "borrowing" ideas

Borrowing ideas happens, sometimes by accident, and people should post only the details that they need to if that worries them.


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## Leyline (Jul 3, 2013)

popsprocket said:


> Perhaps a Legal 101 sticky to warn people that
> 
> a) they are posting their stuff online, albeit in a member's only board, but that they are effectively sharing their idea, and
> b) copyright 101, an _idea _can't be copyrighted, only the execution of the idea can be protected, so there's no point in getting all angry over someone "borrowing" ideas
> ...



Of course, PR. And well said. 

You'd be amazed.


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## shadowwalker (Jul 3, 2013)

I think the brainstorming part is worth trying, at least - with the proper and very prominent warning as above. I've often been involved in brainstorming ideas/problems with the members of my beta group; many times it actually leads to new ideas or avenues for my own writing. Of course, we've known each other for several years, so there's a built-up trust there, but I still think this is worth trying. If it starts to lead to problems, well, then it at least had a trial.

As to the collaborative thing, I'm a little less enthused about that. If it's truly collaborative, there are legal issues that would need to be addressed by the participants, and I'm not sure we want to get entangled in that.


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## Pluralized (Jul 3, 2013)

I hadn't really considered "collaborative" to mean co-writing; the intent is to "collaborate" in a very basic sense, helping unplug stuck idea streams. 

I'd recommend a big fat disclaimer as well and, frankly, if people have concerns about their ideas being so ingenious and original that they're destined to be the foundation of a magnificent and profitable work, perhaps this wouldn't be intended for them. But then again, the folks that generate big profitable writing projects usually aren't stuck needing help. 

Seems like a great resource for us novices and hobby writers though.


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## popsprocket (Jul 3, 2013)

I wouldn't worry about trying to discourage co-writing anyway. I've never seen it receive much love on writing forums, so it mostly takes care of itself.


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## ppsage (Jul 3, 2013)

Oh great. Another interesting distraction where I can waste time listening to myself spout off without getting a darn thing actually written.


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## Folcro (Jul 4, 2013)

I imagine this to be a system wherein actual works are not submitted, but synopses of works. Synopses of characters and their role in these works. You can't really plagiarize an idea, so I don't think that would be an issue. It would be a sort of cloud, or a literary think tank, where an idea is thrown in for others to help expand your awareness as to the places your idea can go, the options you have. I can see this being a very liberating experience for those who desire it, and easily ignorable for those who don't. I see no reason to take a stand against this.


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## Pluralized (Jul 11, 2013)

There doesn't appear to be sufficient traction for something like this, but a few enthusiastic people who'd take advantage. The possibility of starting a group seems attractive barring an actual sub-forum... Anyone interested in that? I'll be more than happy to set it up and I have a few potential story ideas to get it rolling. They're all mediocre, of course, but you knew that.


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## Angelicpersona (Jul 11, 2013)

I'd be willing to take part =) (sorry it took me a while to get to this, been working and sleeping like crazy)


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## Lewdog (Jul 11, 2013)

I'm always more than willing to help out someone with their idea!  Buy ten ideas get the eleventh one free!


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## Pluralized (Jul 11, 2013)

*Here's the group.* Feel free to post up your ideas that you're looking for help with. Hopefully someone benefits from this.


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## Cran (Jul 11, 2013)

Leyline said:


> I'd have to say no to this, sadly.
> 
> I've seen three forums now shut down because of 'brainstorming' threads where one person screamed bloody legal murder at another because an 'idea was stolen.'
> 
> ...


Just the one owner for now, Leyline, and I have no problem with arguing rights and copyrights with anyone - especially someone who believes that ideas can be legally owned and protected. So don't be dissuaded on that score. 

What I am, though, is swamped with a growing pile of forum stuff to do. I can set up the sub-forum if somebody else can - 

- draft up the information and advice piece that should go with it; and 
- tell me who should or should not be able to see and/or participate. 

(now I desperately need sleep)


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## moderan (Jul 12, 2013)

(I) Don't care for brainstorming story ideas, usually. Not because of intellectual theft, but because I've seen (and had) perfectly valid ideas talked to death in such fora. But I don't speak for anyone else, and I get the idea that this subforum isn't pitched to folks like me who are actively trying to sell work.
Collaborative writing is a fine way to work but you almost always need some sort of distribution of authority, or you'll eventually end up either at loggerheads or at a logjam. Collective brainstorming can be profitable when there's a decent flow of imagination but that stream of thought gets polluted rather quickly when dissonance is introduced. Again, some judicious management can filter that idea pool readily.
You might use the shared-world thread from the tavern* as an example. It lies moribund only because the principals are otherwise engaged. Has more or less a story manager and a technical manager operating hand-in-glove, and the beginnings of story discussions. It could stagnate (likely won't) if it is left alone in perpetuity. There are more good story ideas already in that thread than in many full fora.
I believe the guiding hand is what Cran is looking for in this case.



*_that is, if you have access. Otherwise you only have my word for it._


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## Pluralized (Jul 12, 2013)

Some exceptionally valid points, moderan. Thanks for sharing your experience; some of us have never taken part in something like this, therefore have no real idea of what to expect. 

For the reasons you've mentioned and others, perhaps it's better to let this exist as a voluntary group, safe from the forces of dissonance that you've mentioned. 

Collaborative ideas sound like a recipe for confusion; seems as though this brainstorming session would be more targeted with helpful suggestions, rather than a collaboration on a specific project. Much respect for the work you guys have done in the shared-world thread, some seriously inspiring creativity there. 

The group for brainstorming exists for those who wish to use it, and for those who don't, no harm done.


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## moderan (Jul 13, 2013)

Indeed...to each their own. And best of luck with it.


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## WechtleinUns (Jul 15, 2013)

I'd like to change my mind from "yes" to "no". I apologize, but can a mod do that for me? Thanks.


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## popsprocket (Jul 15, 2013)

Nope, we won't change poll results.

It'd be too easy to tamper with them if that were the case.

It doesn't matter anyway, if you read above it was decided to make a group for the interested parties to join, but not to bother with making another board.


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## Cran (Jul 15, 2013)

Actually, we can, but we won't for the reasons pops indicated - vote rigging is not cool, and setting a bad precedent because someone changed their mind is just not going to happen on this forum.


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## Mr mitchell (Jul 20, 2013)

I vote yes as it could be useful, I think.


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## shadowwalker (Jul 20, 2013)

I bookmarked it, then forgot to subscribe to it, then forgot to check it! Good grief... :stupid:


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## Cran (Jul 20, 2013)

shadowwalker said:


> I bookmarked it, then forgot to subscribe to it, then forgot to check it! Good grief... :stupid:


I didn't think it was possible to catch my disease over the internet; sorry about that.


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## OurJud (Jul 20, 2013)

To have a dedicated forum where I could go and say, "Look, I'm having trouble with bla bla bla bla" would be very useful in my opinion, so a big yes here.


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