# How bad is your first draft?



## bookmasta (Jul 20, 2013)

Mine are usually terrible to be honest. For example, the climax to my book and journey to the Underworld are to excerpts from my first draft I recently posted. Riddled with errors, misuse of certain words, an occasional hole in the plotline, ext...... It takes me up to three or four revisions before I think its decent. I was looking back on my first draft of journey to the Underworld I had posted on the forums and my first impulse was to torch it because of the numerous flaws. Does anyone else ever feel this way about their work?


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## InkwellMachine (Jul 20, 2013)

Of course. All the time, in fact. 

Don't, though. Giving up one rough draft for another is a tremendous waste of time. You _must_ finish the piece before attempting to re-write, or your second draft is as good as a first, stumbling and trying to find it's way in a different direction because the first didn't work.


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## bookmasta (Jul 20, 2013)

I finished the book a while ago, I went through and revised it twice in most areas and three in some other parts. Ironically I'm revising the prequel to the book now while working on the third in the series. Personally I don't think I will ever be finished editing all these books in the quest for perfection.


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## OurJud (Jul 20, 2013)

bookmasta said:


> I was looking back on my first draft of journey to the Underworld I had posted on the forums and my first impulse was to torch it because of the numerous flaws. Does anyone else ever feel this way about their work?



Yes, just as Inkwell says, all the time.

I've never actually reached the end of a first draft, but I find it impossible not to re-read what I've so far written whenever I open a WiP. I try to kid myself I'm doing it to get myself back into the world I'm creating, but in reality I'm doing it to see how it sounds with fresh eyes, if you get my drift. I usually cringe at what I've written, even though I know it's a first draft, and have given up on so many stories and novel attempts because of how badly it reads.


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## Ghosts of the Maze (Jul 20, 2013)

Reading my first draft is directly related to how well I felt about it when it was written. If I loved writing it, I'll hate reading it later. When I struggled and didn't love the process, it'll be better That's all about my unrealistic expectations. 
I'm told that you shouldn't stop when you're writing a longer piece to edit until after you had finished a first draft. I stop anyway. I couldn't imagine the pain of reading an entire draft of what I had done all at once. So I never really have a "first draft." By the time I'm finished with the end, my first few chapters might be on a 4th or 5th draft.


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## J Anfinson (Jul 20, 2013)

God yes. I'm always battling the urge to rip what I've got to shreds and start back at square one. But I'm not going to do that (this time). Instead I'm trying to get the basic plot figured out and I'll keep writing until I have that first draft done. Then I'll set it aside for a few weeks, as suggested by many, and go to town with a red pen. That's the plan, and I hope it'll work for me.


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## Skodt (Jul 20, 2013)

I love my first drafts. They are the best thing I have ever done. Nothing could be better. Then I read them. :-( I wish writing were easier. As I do hate to edit. Though editing is just as important. I usually find my first draft is a very long outline. Now I need to strengthen the story. Write my characters with what I know worked in the story. I now know that part A fits and part B does not. So I can change my reactions to these situations. It is a long process, but when you get finished it is a great relief.


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## Grape Juice Vampire (Jul 20, 2013)

My very, very first draft of my current WIP was awful, I mean it has substance and its moments but is pretty bad. Of course, that had a lot to do with the fact I had never written anything beyond poems and a couple short stories before. As such, I never finished it mainly because I had no clue what I was doing and just kept hacking away at it. Now, I'm still writing the first draft, but I feel its far better than its predecessor. It has problems, sure, and I do on occasion stop and edit.

Edit: I want to add that I don't really believe in bad first drafts as a general thing. I say that experience, among other things, has a lot to do with the quality.


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## Sam (Jul 20, 2013)

The title of your thread doesn't leave much in the way of choice. 

There's a common misconception that first draft equals crap. That may be so for some writers, but it's not a definite by any stretch. If you're a good writer, you don't become bad because you're writing a first draft. My first drafts are as good as anything I write. 

Everyone thinks that way about their work at some point. It's inevitable. The only way to improve is to keep writing and not beat yourself up. Good writing won't happen overnight.


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## Jeko (Jul 20, 2013)

As I said in a thread a short while ago, I think that first drafts don't have to be bad, but they don't have to be good either. 

They should, I believe, focus more on the story rather than on how it is presented to the reader. If a writer is worrying about how their first draft reads, it's likely they're thinking less about their characters and plot, and so both can suffer.

I recently re-kick-started a WIP because of such a problem. The result was astoundingly pleasing, and I can still read it now and feel happy about it.


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## Sandy (Jul 20, 2013)

Perhaps a better way of looking at a completed first draft is _done!_  It's an achievement worth celebrating: you've laid out the whole thing in one big piece.  Now you can make repairs, improvements, tweaks, adjustments on several different planes to spiffy it up. You advance from_ done!_ to _wow, this is pretty decent!_


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## Greimour (Jul 20, 2013)

Same as many of the above. I hate many of my drafts, not just the first.

I have written the first four chapters of my favorite story so many times I actually gave up on the book as a whole. I got so far in then started reading the beginning again when I got a little stumped. I got angry with it and started over. Then because it was playing on my mind, I read it again at only ten chapters in. I saved and started over once more. Seven chapters in I did the same. 
-Read how it is so far; Save it... start again.
Eventually I had nearly twenty documents on the PC and over 15 handwritten A4 pads full, all containing the same part of the same story. Rewritten so much I can no longer write the first sentence, the thought makes me cringe.

I don't do that anymore. I write and write and write... I save. The next day, I copy and past the last chapter I wrote or even just ten-ish paragraphs, paste it into a new document, skim it enough to remember where I was up to and continue on.

I don't delete or torch any drafts... I went through all the hand written books not too long ago and in one, but none of the others, I found a small gem of writing. I instantly jumped back on my computer and threw it into an entirely different project I was working on.


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## alanmt (Jul 20, 2013)

Mine are very uneven.  Some parts seem so awesome when I go back and read them for editing that I am thinking "I wrote this? Wow!"  These tend to be depictions of my favorite plot points, crises, and climaxes.  But some parts are so horribly cringe-inducing I wonder how to fix them without just rewriting the whole thing.  These tend to be less glamorous parts of the work I just "wrote through" to get a draft on the table.


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## Blade (Jul 20, 2013)

Sam said:


> There's a common misconception that first draft equals crap. That may be so for some writers, but it's not a definite by any stretch. If you're a good writer, you don't become bad because you're writing a first draft. My first drafts are as good as anything I write.


I would like to support this perspective on first drafts. If you are patient and take the time to think a piece through before you actually start writing you can head off many eventual problems and put most of the content down on "automatic". Not that it is possible to write off a finished work on one writing but an extra effort on pre-planning can avoid pot holes of your own creation that you will fall into later.\\/


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## Robert_S (Jul 20, 2013)

Bad enough I scrapped it all and went back to outline.


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## shadowwalker (Jul 20, 2013)

I'm with Sam (and kinda with Blade, except I don't plan anything before I start). I revise/edit as I go - my first draft is my last draft, subject only to polishing.


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## Blade (Jul 20, 2013)

shadowwalker said:


> I'm with Sam (and kinda with Blade, except I don't plan anything before I start). I revise/edit as I go - my first draft is my last draft, subject only to polishing.


I think we agree then, it is just a matter of what exactly you mean by plan. For me it is a matter of projected content which I hope to fold in as I go along.:tickled_pink:


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## Terry D (Jul 20, 2013)

I write slowly, just a few hundred to a couple thousand words per session. That helps me to get the story right the first time. Rewrites are a matter of cut and polish.


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## Sam (Jul 21, 2013)

Blade said:


> I would like to support this perspective on first drafts. If you are patient and take the time to think a piece through before you actually start writing you can head off many eventual problems and put most of the content down on "automatic". Not that it is possible to write off a finished work on one writing but an extra effort on pre-planning can avoid pot holes of your own creation that you will fall into later.\\/



I don't plan.


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## Jeko (Jul 21, 2013)

> _extra effort on pre-planning can avoid pot holes of your own creation that you will fall into later_



I don't try to avoid plot-holes - I let them appear and fill them in once the story is done. Like Sam, I don't plan.


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## Blade (Jul 21, 2013)

Sam said:


> I don't plan.





Cadence said:


> I don't try to avoid plot-holes - I let them appear and fill them in once the story is done. Like Sam, I don't plan.



:hi: Hmmmm. Maybe I will give that a go sometime. I think that what I like about the plan is that once I finally get around to inscription it seems like clear sailing and I am free to dabble with wording or sentence structure without losing the general direction of the piece. I find that enough "asides" and "reconsiderations" arise even with a plan to keep me busy. I also think the plan is somewhat of a safeguard against diversions which might take over the piece as I will just set them aside.


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## escorial (Jul 21, 2013)

1st draft for anything I do is what I run with.


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## sunaynaprasad (Jul 21, 2013)

My first drafts often lack certain literary elements, like character development. I tend to just get the story down before fixing the big issues.


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## Gamer_2k4 (Jul 22, 2013)

My grammar is exquisite, and my plotting is just fine.  The characters are good, too.  However, there's plenty of fluff that just doesn't need to be in there - scenes that need tightening, wordiness, sections that can be completely removed, etc.

To put it another way, the untrained eye would think my first draft was pretty good, but it certainly had room for improvement.


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## Sandy (Jul 22, 2013)

I always admire those who can conjure a scene, then sit down and in an utterly free way just crank out an entire book without a hint of a plan; it must be wonderful to have the skill to keep things on track, just making it up as you go.  Interesting, too, how people see the strengths and weaknesses of their first drafts and their priorities in revisions.  I'm just happy to get a couple of believable characters, a plot that doesn't seem terribly contrived, and grammar that doesn't cause my former English teachers to wince in dismay...and, trust me, it's a struggle!


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## shadowwalker (Jul 22, 2013)

Sandy said:


> I always admire those who can conjure a scene, then sit down and in an utterly free way just crank out an entire book without a hint of a plan; it must be wonderful to have the skill to keep things on track, just making it up as you go.



I wish it was as easy as you made it sound! :lol:


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## Sintalion (Jul 22, 2013)

I don't write bad first drafts, but I don't write good ones, either. I don't think in those terms. As I review I don't think anything is crappy or outstanding; I just manipulate the writing until my gut tells me it fits the story's requirements. I don't bother to classify anything; I just change what I need to when I see it. So, how bad is my first draft? To others it might be good, might be bad, but to me my draft just _is_.


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## dale (Jul 22, 2013)

my 1st drafts are as good as it gets. i feel like i would ruin the work with a 2nd draft, so i never do them.


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## Kyle R (Jul 22, 2013)

My first drafts usually have brief flashes of brilliance mixed in with heaps of oozing unintelligible muck. But I'm always grateful for the muck, it gives me material to mold and sear, like wet clay.

Oftentimes the muck turns into my greatest writing, and the flashes of brilliance that I originally was so impressed by end up being edited away. Funny how that works.


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## KarlR (Jul 22, 2013)

I wrote my second novel very quickly.  The story was exhilarating and incredibly fun to write.  I couldn't wait to find out what would happen next.  

The first edit showed massive holes in the timeline.  I had to build an excel calendar to be certain everythihng fit within the frame I needed.

Things I've written since have been much less complex, but the first edit almost always shows areas that need tweaking.


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## Sam (Jul 22, 2013)

shadowwalker said:


> I wish it was as easy as you made it sound! :lol:



It's not easy, but it's not terribly difficult either. At least for me. I don't how to explain it, but I can remember every major detail of every story I've written. I can tell you the characters' names, their bios, their traits, and I can recall every move they made in the novel. So I don't have plot holes very often, if at all, because the work moves linearly and everything I add builds on what came before. 

It's why I don't plan. I don't need to. If I have an idea for chapter fifty when I'm writing chapter forty, it'll be fresh in my head when I get there. I've only ever described the ability to two medical professionals and both of them called it a 'partial eidetic memory'. They told me my memory for the written word was incredible. I can memorise an essay and write it verbatim for a short period of time (sometimes a week, but usually a couple of days).


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## shadowwalker (Jul 22, 2013)

Totally agree, Sam. I just meant it sounded like the story just flowed out - which it doesn't. Still takes work to make it all come together. But yeah, everything that happens is based on what already occurred. Saves on second-guessing myself as well.


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## Sandy (Jul 22, 2013)

Dale and Sam are amazing!  I can't begin to imagine what it would be like to write a whole book without having to fix anything (hope that perfect draft excludes things like typos?)  And wow, to remember every detail from something written for more than a week?  What an astonishing gift that is!  I can barely remember a shopping list from this morning.


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## Kyle R (Jul 22, 2013)

I'd be filled with mixed emotions if I managed to write a perfect first draft. I'd be pleased, definitely! But also, dissatisfied. Much of the joy I get from writing comes with the act of revision, of tearing scenes apart and rebuilding them, of creating something magical out of something mediocre, or even atrocious. I look forward to tackling those poorly-written passages. There's a certain pleasure in finding small nuggets of potential scattered in the gibberish and gunk, and then taking the time to hack and rebuild, like a mad scientist, until the scenes come to life and stomp around the page like beautiful Frankenstein-ian monsters.

Dissecting and rebuilding original product into a newer, completely different finished product, that contrast is unique and enjoyable to me. Without that step I'd feel like something was missing.


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## Sam (Jul 22, 2013)

Sandy said:


> Dale and Sam are amazing!  I can't begin to imagine what it would be like to write a whole book without having to fix anything (hope that perfect draft excludes things like typos?)  And wow, to remember every detail from something written for more than a week?  What an astonishing gift that is!  I can barely remember a shopping list from this morning.



My grammar and spelling are exceptional, and I say that with the greatest humility possible. I never use grammar- or spell-check because they're unreliable and I don't need them.  I can assure you that it wasn't always that way, however. It's taken years of work to reach that level. 

I've never agreed with my doctors' diagnoses. I believe my memory is a by-product of extreme passion for the written word.


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## OurJud (Jul 22, 2013)

Sam said:


> My grammar and spelling are exceptional, and I say that with the greatest humility possible. I never use grammar- or spell-check because they're unreliable and I don't need them.  I can assure you that it wasn't always that way, however. It's taken years of work to reach that level.
> 
> I've never agreed with my doctors' diagnoses. I believe my memory is a by-product of extreme passion for the written word.



You have a rouge hyphen after the word 'grammar'.

And I can only assume you have more than one doctor, as you've placed the apostrophe after the S.

:tongue:


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## Sam (Jul 22, 2013)

OurJud said:


> You have a rouge hyphen after the word 'grammar'.



No, I don't. It's a 'suspended' hyphen and it's perfectly correct. I've omitted the word 'check' from 'grammar' and placed it after 'spell' in order to remove repetition of the same word. Look it up. 

By the way, it's 'rogue'.  



> And I can only assume you have more than one doctor, as you've placed the apostrophe after the S.



As I said above: 





			
				Sam said:
			
		

> I've only ever described the ability to *two medical professionals* and both of them called it a 'partial eidetic memory'.



It's also why I wrote the plural 'diagnoses' instead of the singular 'diagnosis'.


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## Deleted member 49710 (Jul 22, 2013)

Sam, just admit you're putting rouge on your hyphens and be done with it, we're all tired of this charade. 

Ahem, my first draft is of very uneven quality.


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## bookmasta (Jul 22, 2013)

I'm curious, do you go through your rough draft and edit or do you rewrite the whole thing over again?


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## Sam (Jul 22, 2013)

bookmasta said:


> I'm curious, do you go through your rough draft and edit or do you rewrite the whole thing over again?



Who are you asking?


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## bookmasta (Jul 22, 2013)

Sam said:


> Who are you asking?


 Everyone.


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## OurJud (Jul 22, 2013)

Just you wait, Sam. I'll find some grammatical errors in one of your posts some day


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## Gamer_2k4 (Jul 22, 2013)

bookmasta said:


> I'm curious, do you go through your rough draft and edit or do you rewrite the whole thing over again?



I go through and edit.  What's the point of rewriting the whole thing?


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## Blade (Jul 22, 2013)

Gamer_2k4 said:


> I go through and edit.  What's the point of rewriting the whole thing?


Exactly! :icon_colors: I leave the good stuff alone of respect for the work done well but also as an inspiration for the repairs. Re-writing the already finished is just a boring waste of time.nthego:


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## bookmasta (Jul 22, 2013)

Gamer_2k4 said:


> I go through and edit.  What's the point of rewriting the whole thing?



Some of the webpages I have read on writing tips suggest to rewrite your story once or twice. I personally thought it was ludicrous but on the other hand I could have been completely wrong. I'm glad to hear that  I wasn't.


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## Kyle R (Jul 22, 2013)

Gamer_2k4 said:


> I go through and edit.  What's the point of rewriting the whole thing?



I go through and edit, too.

Though, I've heard from some drafters and rewriters why they do it, and I can appreciate the merits of it, as well.

The main one, to me, is the avoidance of over-editing or revising. If a writer were to save all her drafts, for example (as some authors recommend doing), she could then go back to a previous draft if her editing or revising ever got out of hand. Perhaps she felt, on Monday, that Scenes 3 and 4 should be cut. So she deleted them, then spent the rest of the day writing a transition between Scenes 2 and 5.

Tuesday comes, and she reads her previous day's work, and concludes that, hey, Scenes 3 and 4 were actually necessary (or good reading). She shouldn't have cut them!

Not to worry! Since she's a drafter, all she has to do is open up the file with her previous draft and--voila--Scenes 3 and 4 are there, whole and untouched.

Had the same issue happened to a edit-as-he-goes writer like myself, Scenes 3 and 4 would be lost forever. I'd just have to rewrite them from memory as best I could, or figure out another solution.


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## Sam (Jul 22, 2013)

bookmasta said:


> I'm curious, do you go through your rough draft and edit or do you rewrite the whole thing over again?



I've done both.


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## Gamer_2k4 (Jul 22, 2013)

KyleColorado said:


> I go through and edit, too.
> 
> Though, I've heard from some drafters and rewriters why they do it, and I can appreciate the merits of it, as well.
> 
> ...



I don't think the two sides you present are particularly distinct.  When I finished my first draft, I saved it, then copied the file to make my second draft.  I'm now editing that copy, leaving the first draft alone.  However, I wouldn't say I'm rewriting the story; I'm simply making edits where they're needed.  I would argue that what you do with old drafts has no bearing on whether you're an editor or a rewriter.


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## Kyle R (Jul 22, 2013)

Ah.

Perhaps it's my own style then. I don't save drafts. I have one file and I work on that file until it's done, and I save over it with any changes I make along the way, erasing all traces of my earlier work.


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## shadowwalker (Jul 22, 2013)

I edit as I go - occasionally I'll copy and file some part that, while it no longer works for the current story, I'm still fond of and may use in something else. Otherwise, I don't keep what isn't working. I usually find that one's first instincts are the ones to follow anyway.


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## J Anfinson (Jul 22, 2013)

shadowwalker said:


> I edit as I go - occasionally I'll copy and file some part that, while it no longer works for the current story, I'm still fond of and may use in something else. Otherwise, I don't keep what isn't working. I usually find that one's first instincts are the ones to follow anyway.



That sounds a lot like what I'm doing. When I decide I don't like how a section is written, I cut and paste it into what I've dubbed my "Boneyard" file in the same folder as the story. That way if I want to take a look at what I've discarded for use in other stories, it's not gone forever. Most of what I've got in the boneyard is junk, though.


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## Sjonak (Jul 23, 2013)

Very bad, but REWARDING. My first draft is pen and paper, writing large sections without pause. After that it's that easier computer stuff.


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## bookmasta (Jul 23, 2013)

I've tried writing my first draft and then typing it, but it's too much work for me. I have a notepad I carry around  jot ideas on how to improve my first draft when the moment strikes. Besides that, I purely type 99.99% of my stories.


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## Sparktheunknown (Jul 24, 2013)

My stuff looks like its written by a pretentious, dyslexic, 3rd grader the first time around. There are VERY few people on the planet that get to see those drafts.


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## Greimour (Jul 24, 2013)

Gamer_2k4 said:


> I don't think the two sides you present are particularly distinct.  When I finished my first draft, I saved it, then copied the file to make my second draft.  I'm now editing that copy, leaving the first draft alone.  However, I wouldn't say I'm rewriting the story; I'm simply making edits where they're needed.  I would argue that what you do with old drafts has no bearing on whether you're an editor or a rewriter.



I have decided to quote this one as it is closest (based on conversation) to my method.
I think I may have written my method somewhere before - but not in this thread.

*I ... *create a file - usually title of the book. In that file I make and save a new file called draft one. There; I save every chapter in its own document + the first draft as a whole. Thats when I move on to edits and re-writes.

Depending on the size of the thing, my edit is almost literally a re-write.

Due to a; "read the paper copy to computer" job I had in the distant past... I ended up with certain habits that I tell myself are "abilities" :

Reading paper that is off to the write, whilst typing on a keyboard infront and being sure the words on the screen are correct is a skill. Seriously. I wanted to watch the screen, to make sure I didn't make a mistake - or read part of the paper and then type it... but then I would lose my place on the paper. I tried many methods... but the only way I managed to hit 80wpm (as required or else fired) was to type what I read as I read it. The "monotony?"(checks if right word later) of the job left my brain empty. I didn't need to think, just act like a machine and do. That's where the "ability" was born. Able to think about one thing whilst reading and copying another.

With my edits I do it like this: 
Firstly, I know everything in it, as I already wrote it... but at the very least I read that chapter again anyway (or the whole thing if it is just a short story)

I then:
Put cursor above first paragraph.
Read the paragraph as I re-write it... (and there is my ability) ... as I read/write it, I reword it in choice places. Change the grammar if it needs doing or if it reads better another way. Sometimes, this method turns me away from the paragraph I am reading and I write the rest of the pragraph fresh. Once the paragraph is done, I highlight the original pargraph, press the del button and move on.
The next Paragraph will usually fit in and I continue on, reading and rewriting and editing as I go. 
Sometimes the story changes so much as I run down the  paragraphs, I am only keeping the paragraphs ahead as reference. Before I know it, I have re-written the entire chapter. Usually it says pretty much the exact same thing - but now it's four hundred words longer... the next chapter is four hundred words shorter, the next is nine-hundred words longer, the next chapter is no longer needed thanks to the chapter before... etc... 

Eventually I have draft two. A completely re-writen edit of the first one. I will compare them and decide where to go with edits/re-writes etc... from there, but I will save it in a file called draft 2. 

I keep everything because you never know... sometimes, an edit, rewrite or whatever has discarded a hidden gem you never noticed in the past.


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## Monster (Jul 25, 2013)

Folcro can attest to the fact that my first draft is all over the place (at least a couple chapters).
I have 20 chapters done in the first draft and I keep looking over, adding, taking away, and still, it's only first draft. 
I don't know what I'm going to do when It comes to the finish.

So to answer that in short: My first draft is a mess.


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## Tettsuo (Jul 25, 2013)

My first draft is just a mash of grammatical failures.  Although the story itself was rock solid, I just had a terrible time seeing the errors.  I cannot trust myself to edit any of my own work.


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## J Anfinson (Jul 25, 2013)

I'm *trying* not to obsess over fixing things as I write the first draft. That's been my downfall many times. But it can be difficult to keep myself from wanting to edit things.I think I'm starting to find a good balance though. Its readable, but will need polishing.


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