# Comments on a logline please?



## Mklangelo (Apr 2, 2008)

*When the aftermath of a total economic collapse brings the United States Government under control of the Chinese, a disgraced United States General struggles to restore not only the freedom of his countrymen, but that of the nation that discarded him.*


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## BOURBON (Apr 2, 2008)

A very topical apocalyptic!
I think your logline is missing a character element. You have him struggling for his countrymen and nation, but not himself. You need something that suggests the nature of his conflict.
Good luck.
BB


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## Wallmaker (Apr 2, 2008)

You know, I feel the first half is strongest, but this is where you lose me:
*restore not only the freedom of his countrymen, but that of the nation that discarded him.*

*...Restore...  *This isn't a clear word.  From here, I don't know exactly what he does to restore the freedom of his countrymen and to set the genre of the piece, I think you need to know what major action is going to take place.  He could bust in, guns blazing, or secretly, all spy like, or through political means, or dress up in a panda costume and hijinks ensure.  Say specifically as you the plan of action this general will take.

*Freedom  *Another tough word.  There are many examples of freed, but you  need to think specifically what American freedoms this general is restoring.  Are the Chinese an all controlling authoritarian goverment (ala V for vendetta?) have they taken away free speach and literature?  Basically, in the logline, get specific, what have the chinese taken away and what does the general want to bring back.  

Freedom of a nation... and freedom of country men.... kinda redundant.  First off, a block of land can't be "free" (maybe free of the Chinese, but that's not what the line says)  I'm much more interested in the country men.

Skip the second general discard.  We already know he has been disgraced.  If you want to bulk up what exactly happened, explain in the first line more (like: a general dishonerably discharge over an anti american conspiracy).

Okay, so I nitpicked, but hear me out.  Loglines are very important for the person you tell them to to get the CLEAREST most ACURATE details of your story across.  And if it isn't clear.  They will invent the rest (I'm a comedy writer... so as soon as I hear restore... I'm going to dream of a man decieving the Chinese in a panda suit.  It's the way that I am.)  And then if they do read your script, they'll be upset when it isn't what they assumed it would be.  However, if you're clear in the logline and then they read the script and it's exactly as logline described it... well then it sounds like a good match, doesn't it?


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## Linton Robinson (Apr 2, 2008)

I would say, trim the wordiness... and flip the front and back ends.

A disgraced General struggles to restore the honor and sovereignty of the United States after economic collapse leads to control by China.


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## Mklangelo (Apr 2, 2008)

BOURBON said:


> A very topical apocalyptic!
> I think your logline is missing a character element. You have him struggling for his countrymen and nation, but not himself. You need something that suggests the nature of his conflict.
> Good luck.
> BB



Ya, but isn't it his struggle too?  Maybe I could put something in there about his redemption, which is probably important to him but probably not his reason for the fight.  I see this as kind of a selfless struggle.


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## Mklangelo (Apr 2, 2008)

Wallmaker said:


> You know, I feel the first half is strongest, but this is where you lose me:
> *restore not only the freedom of his countrymen, but that of the nation that discarded him.*
> 
> *...Restore...  *This isn't a clear word.  From here, I don't know exactly what he does to restore the freedom of his countrymen and to set the genre of the piece, I think you need to know what major action is going to take place.  He could bust in, guns blazing, or secretly, all spy like, or through political means, or dress up in a panda costume and hijinks ensure.  Say specifically as you the plan of action this general will take.
> ...



I think "restore" is pretty clear.  As in "returning to a former state." Ie; No Chi-coms.  

I think a land can be free, don't you?  Of course it's not a person but it can be free.

I don't think I'm supposed to tell the story in the logline.  I supposed to tell what the story is about.  I will grant you that it certainly can be distilled though. 

As for what freedoms he will attempt to restore, I think the fact that the Chicoms are playing any hand at all in the day to day operation of the country pretty much says what the problem is.

I appreciate your comments though.  It's something to think about.


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## Wallmaker (Apr 2, 2008)

Of course you're welcome to write your logline however you like.   I  wonder if... mayhaps it would be helpful to help you with your logline if you provide a paragraph synopsis about your story.  I do that a lot to make sure they mesh up.  It also satisfy my curiousity about specifics--  Whaddya say?


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## Mklangelo (Apr 2, 2008)

Wallmaker,

That sounds great.  It's my first effort so I took the approach that if I could come up with a good logline, I could only then understand my story, which I really don't.  I do need to tighten it up.  

It seems now what I have is a really wide, but interesting concept.  I came up with the concept last night and spit out the logline just this morning.  Brainstorming is what it turned out to be.  

I need to define some things.


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## Mklangelo (Apr 2, 2008)

lin said:


> I would say, trim the wordiness... and flip the front and back ends.
> 
> A disgraced General struggles to restore the honor and sovereignty of the United States after economic collapse leads to control by China.



Thanks lin,

Good input.  It is wordy and undefined.  It's really just a concept, which needs to be pared down.  
I had a comment from another writing site that asked a good question:  What about all our SSBN's (Ballistic missile subs)  and all the rest of our Strategic defenses.  What happened to all those?  I went off half-cocked on this logline.  Back to it then.


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## Linton Robinson (Apr 2, 2008)

I certainly wouldn't start worrying about putting MORE stuff in it.

Listen, you know where you see loglines:  TV guide.  Or the Cable TV channel guide on Channel 99 or wherever.   They are like ONE sentence, very short.  But they tell you what the movie's about.   Think about it.


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## Mklangelo (Apr 3, 2008)

lin said:


> I certainly wouldn't start worrying about putting MORE stuff in it.
> 
> Listen, you know where you see loglines:  TV guide.  Or the Cable TV channel guide on Channel 99 or wherever.   They are like ONE sentence, very short.  But they tell you what the movie's about.   Think about it.



That's the thing.  I get these folks asking me what does this mean and what about this and what about that and I'm thinking I'm not telling the story in the logline, I'm telling you what it's about.  I guess if I'm getting allot of questions, the logline ain't working.  

It's too big a scope and it's undefined.  I get that part of it. 

I've been running around shopping and working all day and really haven't had opportunity to get my quiet time to think.  My time is early morning.  The wee hours.  I spit this thing out a little too soon.  Two weeks ago I didn't know what "Ext. Establishing Shot" was.  

I've read different ideas on how long a logline can be.  I was going off of what this Steve Kaire guy said.  At least he's sold some screenplays.  I see that he's optioned/sold 8 projects to the major studios.  Warner Bros etc...Now here comes someone in the next post in this thread telling me this guy has no standing...  Great.  

Any how, here is what he says about it:  Writers Store: High Concept Defined Once and For All by Steve Kaire

I've also heard that High Concept is one sentence that tells you what the movie is about with absolutely no room for questions. 

Now this Steve Kaire guy says a logline, pitch and High concept are all part of each other.  The terms are used interchangeably by him.  1 - 3 sentences.  Logline *is* premise and the heart of High Concept and it's your pitch too...
I hear it's one sentence allot too.   
I get one guy in Absolute Write asking me if the Generals struggle is about loaning money from Europe to bail out the economy so I crack wise and say there is no mention of Europe in the Logline/high concept/premise...

I'm thinking I just need to describe my movie in one or two, short, concise sentences so nobody who reads it has to ask me if it's about Europe when I
fucking talk about China... lol

Ok. Where was I?

Thanks lin,Wallmaker and Bourbon and for Christ's sake don't think I'm not appreciating what you tell me here.  Out of 20 responses on here and Absolute Write, precious few have been constructive.  
One knuckle head asked me if it was zany hijinks or straight drama.  

Yep, those wacky Chicoms are at it again...   \\/

Maybe it is a fucking comedy...   "Springtime for Mao"


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## BOURBON (Apr 3, 2008)

Mklangelo said:


> Maybe it is a fucking comedy... "Springtime for Mao"


 
for some reason that hit a funny spot this morning. spat coffee all over my jumper! 

BB


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## Linton Robinson (Apr 4, 2008)

> I get these folks asking



What folks?   Wannabes on websites?   No matter how much information you cram in there, somebody will ask some dum question.   What's the general's name?   Why is he disgraced?   This is not a treatment, it's a logline.

Read this article by a major Hollywood player, creator of the Logline Lottery  http://twoadverbs.web.aplus.net/loglinearticle.htm


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## Linton Robinson (Apr 4, 2008)

Hey, there are rom-coms and zom-coms...why not a Chi-com?  Commie-com?


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## Mklangelo (Apr 4, 2008)

Commie-com?  Communist Zombies from China.  There we go.  Now were cookin' with gas!  That's a new one.  

Ya, some of those questions were just crazy.  Somebody said the logline implied nothing at all.  I had to go off on that...  Did the line need work?  Lots.  Was it too big a scope?  Sure.  But don't tell me it was thin air.  

So now I'm an ingrate and a leper all wrapped into one.  

Time to break out the sock puppet.  LOL

I guess I was using the logline to define my concept, as if it had to come before anything else.  Something to keep me focused in my treatment.  Logline, treatment, script... in that order is what I was thinking.  

Ok.  The horse is officially dead.  I'll stop flogging the poor thing.


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