# Writing about creepy characters without making the story seem creepy



## DondreKhan (Sep 27, 2013)

I need to make sure I can pull this off.  In one main story that's being done as a series of stories, Kevin is really creepy but well intentioned, and he has an obsession with his friend Alex, who wants to help him, even though he's creepy, and writes what are interpreted as extremely disturbing stories about her.  I want to make sure that through all his weirdness, the creepiness stays confined to his character and doesn't make the story creepy.  Anything to keep in mind while doing this?  I'm going to constantly give the characters' reactions, including how Alex psychoanalyzes his stories as part of unconscious desires, even though he never actually would do anything to her.


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## Greimour (Sep 27, 2013)

That sounds incredibly difficult.

I think (though methods vary) there is only one real way to achieve this to the point you are aiming for.

People have their own methods of including thoughts, some object to it entirely and others just stick to whichever method they seen used first. My prefered method is italic writing for thoughts, but that's an issue for later. What is important for you to achieve this is a third person narrative.

If you go with first person narrative, it will be his story and if he is creepy, the story is creepy... because it is his story. On the other hand, if only his thoughts are creepy, the story itself could be anything from horror to extreme comedy... the options are much bigger.

Literal example from published work would include one of my favourites. But at this time I wont say the author or book, just the example...

One of the multiple Main Characters (Jezal) was incredibly witty and quick minded. He was a proud noble who had logical opinions based on his upbringing and views etc...
However, you only know that as the reader thanks to his internal dialogue. Everyone around Jezal thought he was a bit of an oaf - an idiot. A lazy lay-about with little actual worth.

Inquistor Glokta, in the same story, was a creepy and disugusting guy with physical disabilities. His internal dialogue (or thoughts) however, were often extremely funny. He was an amazing character, someone you might like as a best friend. To everyone around him though (with the exception of few), they wanted nothing more than to get away from him.

The same thing was done with several characters. Internal thoughts portrayed a character entirely opposite to the one perceived by everyone around them.


I suggest, to keep the story itself painting him in a specific light. Like as a well mannered, comely and harmless person... whilst his thoughts are the exact opposite. That should keep your story and him on opposite scales. Him creepy, the story not.

Also, your story will need to have a different direction to your MC's aim.

For example, if his aim is to be with her... her aim is anything except be with him. Then you tell the story ... but keep his thoughts out of the actual events. For example, if he thinks he will kill her off by accidentally on purpose have a stage light land on her - when the time actually comes - he ends up running to rescue an innocent bystander and ends up saving her too. She sees him as a hero, he sees it as a failure to dispose of her.


I don't think I have explained myself too well, but I hope I got across what I was aiming at explaining.


~Kev.


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## luckyscars (Sep 27, 2013)

If you are writing about a 'creepy' character and your story ends up being in no way 'creepy', then either you have divorced your character from the story to the point where they are no longer important, or you have simply contrived your way out of something you dont really have much business messing with anyway - that being your reader's reaction to your work.

Basically, what I am saying is that this question is absurd. While I'm not totally sure what you mean by 'creepy' (a generic and subjective term), it is clearly a paradox and paradox seldom comes about by design and rarer still works in favor of the writer. You might as well say "I am writing about a guy who loves to kill people, but I dont want my story to come off as violent". To which most sane people's reaction would be "WHAT?:

On the other hand, if what you are saying is how to keep the 'creepiness' low key, that is a quite different question. That can absolutely be done. Again, it's somewhat counter-intuitive (you are writing about a creepy character afterall) but if you want the creepiness to be subtle, language and pacing is your key. Perhaps consider starting him off as very normal and introducing the nefarious behavior gradually, as the story progresses? It will still be the same in the end, but it wont dominate the entire text to the same level.

My main question here is Why? Why do you want to do this? Fear, and the slow unmasking of terror, is one of the writer's most powerful tricks. Why not make the story creepy as heck?


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## DondreKhan (Sep 27, 2013)

@Grelmour
What you said is useful. :thumbr: With Kevin, he's harmless and well intentioned, but everyone around him thinks that he's incredibly weird because his stories all involve rape.  His reason of it though is because he's a desperate white knight who desperately wants to protect girls.  He hopes that though this, some girl will want to be his girlfriend and have sex with him.  Alex theorizes that his stories are just a defense mechanism to fantasize about rape, even though she believes him to be harmless and that he would never act out such thoughts.  Nonetheless everyone is weirded out by what he does.  Alex is also annoyed by his frequent requests to take his virginity.  From Kevin's perspective, it is everyone else who is weird because they are trying to suppress him from protecting girls, and so he suspects other people of being potential rapists.  I have a plan that this will eventually lead to him trying to convince Alex's parents that her boyfriend is dangerous for her; she interprets this as him just trying to break them up so he can become her boyfriend and have sex with her.


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## DondreKhan (Sep 27, 2013)

@luckscars
In the sense that you're talking about, I think making the story "creepy as heck" would be good.  What I want to avoid is being like Kevin in the story, who's just a weird guy who comes across as creepy because of what he writes about.  He should be a creepy character, but I don't want the story to make me seem creepy.


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## Sara Haasis (Sep 27, 2013)

So your concern is that people will think you, the author, are a creepy person for writing this? 

I'm not sure that will be a big problem. But I think you could avoid it by not showing the reader too much of what, exactly, Kevin is writing. The other characters' reactions to and discussions about the pieces are more important anyway, aren't they?


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## Morkonan (Sep 27, 2013)

Inquisitor Ehrenstein said:


> I need to make sure I can pull this off.  In one main story that's being done as a series of stories, Kevin is really creepy but well intentioned, and he has an obsession with his friend Alex, who wants to help him, even though he's creepy, and writes what are interpreted as extremely disturbing stories about her.  I want to make sure that through all his weirdness, the creepiness stays confined to his character and doesn't make the story creepy.  Anything to keep in mind while doing this?  I'm going to constantly give the characters' reactions, including how Alex psychoanalyzes his stories as part of unconscious desires, even though he never actually would do anything to her.



Errr.. What sort of story are you writing?  Everything you seem to be working on practically screams "Creepy Story!"

OK, first of all, "Creepy Characters" are just like "Normal Characters." The difference is usually because the Creepy Character has a different set of motivations for their actions than the Normal Character. Normal Characters have "normal" motivations, usually. (NOT always, though.)

Creepy Character is hungry. Normal Character is hungry. Creepy Character murders a baby and eats its toes. Normal Character goes to McDonald's and buys a Big Mac. Both have the same motivations - Satisfying their desire for food. But, they pursue different means in order to satisfy those desires. And, true to form, both the Creepy Character and the Normal Character believe that the method each has chosen is entirely valid, based on their own value systems or beliefs.

Now, you really don't have any sort of problem with a Creepy Character in a Normal Story, as long as that character's creepiness is not portrayed as being "Creepy" in the story. For instance, a Creepy Character who is a baby-eater would not seem creepy in a story that is about a society of baby-eaters, would it? Sure, the reader might get creeped out, but you could pull off a relatively normal sort of story in such a setting, minus the obvious conflict of values between the setting and the culture of your intended audience. (Unless your audience is all baby-eaters...)

How to ensure to make the story _seem_ normal, even though the characters _are_ creepy? Simple - The goals and the methods being used to attain them can not be "creepy." The series "The Adams Family" is somewhat creepy, but it's balanced by the fact that the family is presented as normally as possible. They love each other, don't actively desire to hurt anyone (unless in fun), seem to have similar values as the audience, but with humorous differences, and, in general, "Do No Harm." So, they're harmlessly eccentric and that is what makes their otherwise "creepy" behavior culturally acceptable.

Follow the example of "The Adams Family" when creating your story : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Addams_Family_(TV_series)

Lastly - Avoid the "Creepy" factor by ignoring it or refusing to allow any action based upon Creepy desires or motivations. Your character can write creepy stories, but shouldn't act upon them nor overtly "desire" them to be true. Your character can have creepy desires, but recognize these as being "Creepy" and then appear "Noble" as they struggle to avoid giving in to those creepy desires.


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## Greimour (Sep 27, 2013)

Inquisitor Ehrenstein said:


> @luckscars
> In the sense that you're talking about, I think making the story "creepy  as heck" would be good.  What I want to avoid is being like Kevin in  the story, who's just a weird guy who comes across as creepy because of  what he writes about.  He should be a creepy character, but I don't want  the story to make me seem creepy.



ROFLCOPTERS...
The amount of people I have heard say they don't like writing about things because of what reader may think.
It is a bit of a joke really when you think about it...

... I can assure you, no half intelligent person would believe you are a rapist because you write about rape. NONE.

Imagine how many rapists have not been caught already - all those authors that dared write about rape.
All  those murderers who are famous authors after writing about the murders  they commited... (actually, I do know of one man arrested for literally  writing everything down and publishing it as a Novel. He was even  planning a sequel... he even has his next victim lined up) - But that  guy was a moron and nobody knew, thought or suspected he was a murderer  until an officer who worked the case read the book (pure chance)

Writing about rape doesnt make you a rapist - if it did, this reply would have already made me one.

Wow,  I just realized, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle is a super-genius... he could  have captured Jack the Ripper if he tried! (He wrote Sherlock Holmes  btw, and he was a physician)




Get my meaning yet?

You  shouldn't worry what readers will think. If someone says you  fantasize about raping people when you're done, write a story that  explicitly describes the method you use to brutally murder the person  who said it. He might think twice before he comes near you again. Lolz


~Kev


P.S. Without explaining, I disagree with everything Lucky said.

Your characters thoughts and motivations and aims etc... they dont mean jack all. A main character may want to raise pigs on his farm, but he is dragged into the story against his will... all he wants to do is return to his farm and raise his pigs, they are beautiful and the only thing he cares about... is pigs! Who'da thunk it?
Despite that, he goes on to save the world... literally - the story is called Blart. I enjoyed it...
Without Blart, the story wouldnt have been the same, it wouldnt have worked, it wouldnt have been as good... so no... the MC has to want to save the world if he is going to save the world - its a lie... the MC aims have to be reached... lie. The MC has to have motivations to achieve the goal intended for end of story - lie!

I have been told so many rules about writing, but I have found contradicting rules (or best selling contradictory stories) for pretty much every single rule there is. So, the real thing to be concerned about first is just finishing the thing and work the rest out later.


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## eggo (Sep 27, 2013)

> How to ensure to make the story _seem_ normal, even though the characters _are_ creepy? Simple - The goals and the methods being used to attain them can not be "creepy." The series "The Adams Family" is somewhat creepy, but it's balanced by the fact that the family is presented as normally as possible. They love each other, don't actively desire to hurt anyone (unless in fun), seem to have similar values as the audience, but with humorous differences, and, in general, "Do No Harm." So, they're harmlessly eccentric and that is what makes their otherwise "creepy" behavior culturally acceptable.



Morkonan, I think, hit on a perfect solution to your question. Humor.

Humor is a perfect foil for creepy or horror. It has to been done lightly and humor is incredibly subjective, but in small doses  it can tame even the most graphic scenes and people. Creepy is in fact 'creepy', but a little humor can move it to 'harmless' creepy.


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## luckyscars (Sep 28, 2013)

Greimour said:


> P.S. Without explaining, I disagree with everything Lucky said..



I'm confused. What did I say that you disagree with?


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## Jeko (Sep 28, 2013)

A creepy character in a not-so-creepy story? Sounds like an awesome challenge, and well worth it too. A non-creepy story would make a creepy character seem even creepier (possibly - depends how well you pull both things off) and give the story some memorable moments.

An easy way to do it, IMO, is have the narrator non-creepy; in fact, have the narrative voice relatable to the non-creepy characters in the story. Then this creepy character will stick out from everything else around him. The narrator, I believe, is a far greater contributor to the tone of a story than any of the story's characters.

Humour is also good; it offsets the creepiness, making the story feel more diverse and rounded while simultaneously enhancing the creepiness.

As long as you keep working on your characters they'll get more and more developed, and the reader will have a lot more to say about them than just 'creepy'. This will also help the story feel non-creepy overall, as your creepy characters will have non-creepy aspects.

And don't worry about how readers will view you - that'll limit your creativity to zilch. I think Stephenie Meyer is a total waste of authorial space. Does she know or care about what I think? No, and she shouldn't either. 

Let the story achieve its goals and people will say what they think. You can never estimate the full variety of reactions an audience can give.


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## Morkonan (Sep 28, 2013)

eggo said:


> Morkonan, I think, hit on a perfect solution to your question. Humor....



Humor is good. It provides the reader with a bit of comic relief and gives them "permission" to laugh instead of cringe at certain "creepy" things in a story. "Beetlejuice" would be a good example. There's a lot of disturbing imagery in that movie, yet it's digestible without discomfort due to the humor factor that is woven throughout it. Some of the most popular Urban Fantasy stories have a good deal of humor woven through them, as well.

But, humor is something that is very powerful. If used in large doses, it can turn a dramatic epic into a farce. If used liberally, it can undercut tension that is of necessary value to the theme. The reader is not going to pay much attention to the high-stakes gambit involving a main character who is laughing all the way to the guillotine, are they?

Humor, itself, can be creepy. Again, I raise the terrifying spectre of Evil Clowns... Everyone is scared of clowns. If you aren't, something is wrong with you and you need to get an MRI or something. So, throwing a bunch of clowns who are happily chopping up a woman's corpse wouldn't alleviate the "creepy tension" that you have built up, would it? Instead, some humor can make situations even creepier.

So, in the end, a few bits of humor, used very conservatively, could help to alleviate the "creepy-tension" when it gets a bit too much. But, unless you're going for an over-the-top "absurd" approach to dealing with your creepy elements, then you must use it sparingly. 

Absurdity is one form of humor that has been used a great deal. For instance, in the often panned (But, well done, IMO) movie "Starship Troopers", absurdity was used to undercut the theme and make it palatable for the viewer. Everything in that movie relied on absurdity in order to make it work and it was done very well. (Though, die-hard fans of the book were not very impressed. I prefer to see it as a separate work.)

One could use absurdity to dilute the creepy-tension by using it throughout the setting, even when creepy elements weren't in use. In much the same way as "Starship Troopers", absurdity could be raised in all aspects of the setting, including political and cultural elements. Even relationships could be tinged with absurdity, making certain sorts of creepy-tension easily palatable without necessitating using humor as just a distraction away from creepy-tension.

(Yes, I'm using creepy-tension as _A New Word_.  )


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## Whimsica (Sep 29, 2013)

Focus on the "growth" of them finding hidden feelings maybe? Coming of age? Figuring out love? Behind those twisted actions are strong feelings that symbolize his capability of feeling love to such an extent?
Whatever I'm a sappy person.


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## DondreKhan (Sep 30, 2013)

These are all good suggestions!

The main thing I wanted to avoid was seeming creepy, which is understandable that there is a character who is creepy because he writes weird stories about rape.  That requires writing a weird story about rape.  The obvious difference as is pointed out is that the story is about a creepy character, whereas his story is about really weird stuff.

The story itself can be mildly creepy, but I will use tactics to keep it under control.  There is one story that I want to have be really creepy, which is where Alex goes missing and Kevin is suspected.


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## Tettsuo (Sep 30, 2013)

A creepy person does not see themselves as creepy.  Their actions are reasonable and justify to them.  It's a matter of perspective.


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## Morkonan (Sep 30, 2013)

Inquisitor Ehrenstein said:


> These are all good suggestions!
> 
> The main thing I wanted to avoid was seeming creepy, which is understandable that there is a character who is creepy because he writes weird stories about rape.  That requires writing a weird story about rape.  The obvious difference as is pointed out is that the story is about a creepy character, whereas his story is about really weird stuff.
> 
> The story itself can be mildly creepy, but I will use tactics to keep it under control.  There is one story that I want to have be really creepy, which is where Alex goes missing and Kevin is suspected.



One thing you're going to have to do is to create some sympathy for the character of Kevin. "Creepy" characters that don't come off as distastefully creepy to readers/viewers generally have some sort of element that can be empathized/sympathized with. For instance, the "monster that eats people" is a thorough turnoff. But, when it is revealed that the monster is only trying to defend its young, it gains sympathy from the audience and, therefore, loses some of its creepy factor.

Now.. How are you going to create sympathy for a character that likes to hide in the dark and write rape stories. Moreover, how in the world are you going to justify to the reader your revelation of this character's most personal sexual fetishes? You are breaking down that barrier and the reader is going to demand that you explain to them why it's necessary for you to do so?

What were Captain Kirk's sexual kicks? What sort of perversions did he partake of? Don't know? There's a reason why you don't know - It was NEVER necessary for any plot or story for those very personal things to be revealed to the audience.

If you reveal Kevin's sexual fantasies and you don't explain their necessary inclusion in the story to the reader's satisfaction, your story is going to fail horribly.

How should you include them? Well, I wouldn't.  But, if you must, then link them to a means to "rescue" the girl from the clutches of her kidnapper or something. Make Kevin a psychic, not a psychopath. Instead of just writing rape stories for masturbatory fantasies, Keven is just a plain writer and has been writing for the school paper, or something. But, for some reason, Kevin has started writing these disgusting fantasy stories about the girl he likes. Kevin is horrified at the words that his hands are creating on the page, but he can't stop. He tries to stop, but blacks out and, when he comes to, he discovers he's written twenty pages of disgusting stuff... Later, it starts to interfere with his life, causing him to break into spontaneous writing of disgusting goings-on and his daydreams start to become centered on these themes. (There was a movie in the 80's with George C Scott and, later, the movie "8mm", IIRC, with Nick Cage that showed how someone could get caught up in such things and start thinking like a pervert.)

So, you have Kevin, now, as a victim of some unknown disorder. Maybe he's going crazy? Instead of being crazy, it turns out he is picking up on the fantasies of one of the girl's teachers, who is the kidnapper/sadist. Now, Kevin is a sympathetic character for the audience, but the cops in the story consider him a prime suspect, since they discover his writings. Kevin must prove his innocence and rescue the girl (Major Plot Goals) by delving deep inside his psychic powers and by channeling the thoughts of the dastardly kidnapper in order to divine his intentions and the location of the girl.

See? Now you get to have your rape stories in the plot, but you don't torpedo your story by not being able to explain why they're there in the first place.


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## tabasco5 (Sep 30, 2013)

A good example of this is No Country for Old Men by Cormac McCarthy.


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