# Just curious.



## Crowley K. Jarvis (Oct 7, 2015)

My WIP includes sapient species descendant from fish. 

Obviously, I'm looking to every actual species of marine life, fresh/salt water, worldwide. 

Just curious if anyone knew of any good books of species. 

Perhaps something pretty comprehensive, so I know, obviously, what the fish looks like, and enough about their behavior and population throughout the oceans.

Obviously, as fiction, I will take liberties and whatnot, but I wanted to be as accurate as I could, to make the world real, and make these species interesting instead of 'generic fish person number 3.' 

If not, don't worry about it. I'll probably find something. Just curious.


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## Riis Marshall (Oct 7, 2015)

Hello Crowley

Based on my limited knowledge of biology and human evolution, isn't it that _we_ are descended from fish? Whether we're, in fact, a sapient species may still be open to question.

All the best with your writing.

Warmest regards
Riis


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## walker (Oct 7, 2015)

It just so happens I studied fish in graduate school.

_Homo sapiens_ is an example of a sapient species descended from fish.

I would narrow my focus, if I were you. There are more species of fish in the world than all other vertebrates (mammals, birds, reptiles, amphibians) put together.

There are some good resources on the web. Maybe you could start with fishbase.

Seriously, looking at all species of fish will be close to impossible. I had a big thick book in college, strictly on the species of fish, and it mostly dealt at the genus level and above, and not much at the species level, with a lot of statements like, "There are 34 species in genus X." Again, this was a _thick_ book, with a couple of line drawings here and there, 99.9% text, like reading a newspaper, and it was incomplete as far as listing fish species, which was it's stated purpose!


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## JustRob (Oct 7, 2015)

Riis Marshall said:


> Based on my limited knowledge of biology and human evolution, isn't it that _we_ are descended from fish?



That's what occurred to me, but there have been so many species in between that it depends what "descendant" means. If these "people" have family trees going back enough generations then perhaps they can identify exactly who was the red herring as well as the black sheep in the family line.


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## walker (Oct 7, 2015)

JustRob said:


> That's what occurred to me, but there have been so many species in between that it depends what "descendant" means. If these "people" have family trees going back enough generations then perhaps they can identify exactly who was the red herring as well as the black sheep in the family line.



All life is related.

Humans are most closely related to anything descended from a tetrapod, which was a slimy four-limbed thing that crawled out of the sea 350-400 million years ago. 

If you look at birds, mammals, amphibians, and reptiles, we all have (or _had_, snakes, etc.) four limbs, and can be traced back to tetrapods.

Behind tetrapods, you're talking about fish.

However, just as four limbs tie tetrapods, mammals, birds, reptiles, and amphibians together, DNA and RNA tie all life together. DNA and RNA are a physical characteristic that all life on Earth shares. The answer to, "Am I related to a potted plant?" is, "Yes."


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## JustRob (Oct 7, 2015)

walker said:


> The answer to, "Am I related to a potted plant?" is, "Yes."



That's no good, a relative with a mobile home. We need relatives with real estate which we can inherit.


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## walker (Oct 7, 2015)

JustRob said:


> That's no good, a relative with a mobile home. We need relatives with real estate which we can inherit.



I would settle for one close relative with real estate I can inherit. I'm at zero now!


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## Crowley K. Jarvis (Oct 7, 2015)

I'm certainly not going to memorize every species, of course.Just, in this story, there are little to no humans. I invented a system of fictional gods, that cursed both the male gender and mankind, removing them from their relative position of power or dominance over the earth. Instead, every other species experienced rapid, advanced evolution, and many of them became sapient and interbred. 

The result is a world with but a small fraction of humanity left, and many cities/tribes of other species. 

However, my story will mostly take place on the coast, or in the ocean. There will be little land species involved. Mostly birds and any marine life.

Obviously, certain races will have claimed more territory/bred more, so I don't need to include an INSANE amount of variety...

...just enough to sound realistic and interesing, but not so much that it becomes a textbook info-dump.


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## walker (Oct 7, 2015)

Crowley K. Jarvis said:


> I'm certainly not going to memorize every species, of course.Just, in this story, there are little to no humans. I invented a system of fictional gods, that cursed both the male gender and mankind, removing them from their relative position of power or dominance over the earth. Instead, every other species experienced rapid, advanced evolution, and many of them became sapient and interbred.
> 
> The result is a world with but a small fraction of humanity left, and many cities/tribes of other species.
> 
> ...



I just put an intelligent alligator story on the members only prose forum. Maybe you could read it and give me some tips? It needs work.

I didn't explain the rationale for intelligent alligators, since everybody jumps up and down and points fingers and says, "Info dump!" if you do that. I'll try to figure out a way to work it in later.

The rationale is this: Humans were destroying the Earth. They created human-animal hybrids, which would have lower impact on the Earth. A human-alligator cross is awesome for Florida, because you don't need air conditioning, heating, lights, refrigeration (alligators eat spoiled food, no problem), you don't have to dump pesticides against mosquitoes, and more. If you cross an alligator to have human intelligence, then you get a creature which is relatively low-impact on the environment (where it is adapted to live), but which keeps advancing scientifically. Humans expected to control the hybrids, but lost out. Humans are known as primitives in the new world, and tolerated in small reserves as a genetic pool.

Similar crosses were made elsewhere in the world. Humans with rattlesnakes, deer, buffalo, polar bears, you name it, in order to live in harmony with the environment. The two heroes of the alligator story set sail at the end, and are going to land in a region with a different hybrid. They know none of this, of course.


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