# Climate on Extraterrestrial Planet



## Snelbrouler (Jul 14, 2018)

A huge part of my story takes place on a terrestrial planet with liquid water and a breathable atmosphere. It has a 24 hour day, but its years are around ten times longer than an earth year, due to it being located further from the sun.

Its distance from the sun causes the planet's climate to be significantly cooler than ours. During the planet's "summer" season, it receives daily rainstorms and violent winds. During the "winter" season, the temperatures drop hundreds of degrees, making its surface completely inhabitable. This is also why all of the planet's ecosystem resides in its oceans.

The protagonist is a human who has lived on the planet for five years, and is trying to escape it before winter, when she will inevitably freeze to death.

Science has never been my strong suit, so I would just like to confirm if this at all seems plausible. I have done minimal research (Wikipedia, two YouTube videos, and 6th grade science).


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## Phil Istine (Jul 14, 2018)

Snelbrouler said:


> A huge part of my story takes place on a terrestrial planet with liquid water and a breathable atmosphere. It has a 24 hour day, but its years are around ten times longer than an earth year, due to it being located further from the sun.
> 
> Its distance from the sun causes the planet's climate to be significantly cooler than ours. During the planet's "summer" season, it receives daily rainstorms and violent winds. During the "winter" season, the temperatures drop hundreds of degrees, making it's surface completely inhabitable. This is also why all of the planet's ecosystem resides in its oceans.
> 
> ...



I can't be certain but is it possible that seasons will be far less noticeable at that distance from its star?   Bearing in mind that seasons are caused by a planet's tilt (23.5 degrees in Earth's case) which alters the angle at which light/heat are received, would 10x the distance still produce that effect?

I'm not certain myself, but it may need to be considered.

ETA:  Sorry, I misread.  You referred to the year being ten times longer, not the planet being ten times farther out - a huge difference that could be accounted for by orbital speed, so ignore that rubbish above


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## Ralph Rotten (Jul 14, 2018)

Snelbrouler said:


> A huge part of my story takes place on a terrestrial planet with liquid water and a breathable atmosphere. It has a 24 hour day, but its years are around ten times longer than an earth year, due to it being located further from the sun.
> 
> Its distance from the sun causes the planet's climate to be significantly cooler than ours. During the planet's "summer" season, it receives daily rainstorms and violent winds. During the "winter" season, the temperatures drop hundreds of degrees, making its surface completely inhabitable. This is also why all of the planet's ecosystem resides in its oceans.
> 
> ...




I like where you are going with this, but you sound like you are making many assumptions.
Not all suns are created equal.  No need to move your planet farther away, just give it a different sun.
Then have some fun with it: lower the gravity, thicken the atmosphere, and your characters could fly under their own power.
If the moon had an atmo then you could strap on wings and fly around under your own power.


$0.02


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## Jack of all trades (Jul 14, 2018)

Snelbrouler said:


> A huge part of my story takes place on a terrestrial planet with liquid water and a breathable atmosphere. It has a 24 hour day, but its years are around ten times longer than an earth year, due to it being located further from the sun.
> 
> Its distance from the sun causes the planet's climate to be significantly cooler than ours. During the planet's "summer" season, it receives daily rainstorms and violent winds. During the "winter" season, the temperatures drop hundreds of degrees, making its surface completely inhabitable. This is also why all of the planet's ecosystem resides in its oceans.
> 
> ...



Let's start with our own solar system. Mars is further from the sun and has a year that is about twice as long (1.88 Earth years). But it is significantly colder. Part of that is the lack of atmosphere. Mars has little atmosphere, so there's nothing to store the Sun's energy. Nothing to warm. To get to a point where the year is 10 times longer, you would need to either : have the planet very far away from its sun; or have its orbit be much slower. Now if it's very far from it's sun, it would likely need to be a bigger, brighter and / or hotter sun than ours.

The bigger issue I see is the MC preparing to leave before winter. Crashed on a world, there's not a lot that would tell the MC that winter is lethal. Also, I imagine the desire to get back to civilization would be strong from the beginning. Now it could be that the work to leave is finally coming to fruition, and just in time! The MC could be noticing the increasing cold and getting worried.

How much is known about the planet before the crash? I hadn't thought of that initially. The MC might know from probes that the weather is extreme.

I suggest you learn more about our own solar system, with an eye to using the info to create your world. Use the Internet, but don't rely on Wikipedia. That info is not always the most reliable. (One person who has a Wikipedia page noticed incorrect info about himself. When he tried to correct it, the powers at Wikipedia deamed him an unreliable source and removed his correction, restoring the invalid info.)

I suggest you read more scientific or university sites. Go to the library and read books. Read books at bookstores.

If you feel overwhelmed by jargon, try books or sites aimed at kids. Double check facts whenever possible to be sure the info is accurate.

Maybe look for a class you can take that's about planets or stars. Then you can engage the instructor in conversation and gain info that way. (Just respect the instructor's time and show your gratitude to keep the lines of communication open.)

This sounds like an interesting concept. It is ambitious, if you want the science to be accurate, but I think it's well worth it!

Good luck with it!


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## Ralph Rotten (Jul 14, 2018)

"Its distance from the sun causes the planet's climate to be significantly cooler than ours. During the planet's "summer" season, it receives daily rainstorms and violent winds. During the "winter" season, the temperatures drop hundreds of degrees, making its surface completely inhabitable. This is also why all of the planet's ecosystem resides in its oceans."

This sounds to me like an elongated orbit, or one that is not completely round. The whole planet heats up and rains (as a whole) or freezes solid (as a whole).
To do that there must be something wrong with the orbit, possibly elongated by a singularity or neutron star.
Here is something to read about how seasons on Earth are created. Remember that we split our seasons between hemispheres. Winter up north is summer down south.
https://www.timeanddate.com/astronomy/seasons-causes.html


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## Jack of all trades (Jul 14, 2018)

Ralph Rotten said:


> "Its distance from the sun causes the planet's climate to be significantly cooler than ours. During the planet's "summer" season, it receives daily rainstorms and violent winds. During the "winter" season, the temperatures drop hundreds of degrees, making its surface completely inhabitable. This is also why all of the planet's ecosystem resides in its oceans."
> 
> This sounds to me like an elongated orbit, or one that is not completely round. The whole planet heats up and rains (as a whole) or freezes solid (as a whole).
> To do that there must be something wrong with the orbit, possibly elongated by a singularity or neutron star.
> ...



You're basing the theory of an elongated orbit on ... what?

Rain is precipitation. So is sleet, freezing rain, hail and snow.

Heat does not cause precipitation. It only causes the precipitation to be rain.

Here on Earth there are places with rainy seasons. Earth also has places with very cold winters. The orbit is the same for both types of places.

Now Earth's orbit is not perfectly circular. I doubt any planet has a perfectly circular orbit. But I don't think you're talking about those slight variances.

Looking at our own solar system, the only planet, now classified as a planetoid, that has an unusual orbit is Pluto. Pluto is also very, very far from the Sun.


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## Jack of all trades (Jul 14, 2018)

Daily rain storms are more common in the tropics, which are very warm, OP. So being cooler might not cause daily rain storms.

High humidity in air with little particles forms clouds. When the clouds gather enough water that the gravity pulls the droplets down, there's rain.

Humidity without particles is just humidity. (If I can find a video demonstrating it, I'll post the link.)

The thing is, the more I think about this, the more I think there must be some kind of land life to put the humidity in the air. Maybe I'm wrong, though. You should probably research weather trends in the open ocean.


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## Ralph Rotten (Jul 14, 2018)

Jack of all trades said:


> You're basing the theory of an elongated orbit on ... what?
> 
> Rain is precipitation. So is sleet, freezing rain, hail and snow.
> 
> ...





Whew: I thought you were going to reference Harry Potter again. :icon_cheesygrin:

Yes, we have seasons on Earth, but the whole planet does not experience winter at the same time. We share the seasons because of our tilt. The original post indicated that the ENTIRE planet experiences winter at the same time.
For an entire planet to go from hot summers to freezing winter, it would have to have a problem with its orbit.  Possibly it's orbit is off-plane, like Pluto. 

_"Looking at our own solar system, the only planet, now classified as a planetoid, that has an unusual orbit is Pluto. Pluto is also very, very far from the Sun"_
We are not talking about OUR solar system.
Reading is key. 
Also, Pluto is a dwarf planet.


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## Jack of all trades (Jul 14, 2018)

Ralph Rotten said:


> Whew: I thought you were going to reference Harry Potter again. :icon_cheesygrin:
> 
> Yes, we have seasons on Earth, but the whole planet does not experience winter at the same time. We share the seasons because of our tilt. The original post indicated that the ENTIRE planet experiences winter at the same time.
> For an entire planet to go from hot summers to freezing winter, it would have to have a problem with its orbit.  Possibly it's orbit is off-plane, like Pluto.
> ...



Dwarf planet, planetoid. No big difference. It was downgraded, which was my point. 

I am perfectly aware that the tilt of the Earth is what causes the seasons!! But what is going on in the opposite hemisphere is irrelevant to the story! So I didn't take the meaning to be literally the entire planet, all at the same time. 

The difficulties the MC would face would be the same if the opposite hemisphere had the opposite seasons, which was my assumption. 

The OP will have to say which assumption is right. 


My point about Pluto, in case it was missed, is that it is at the outer edge of the solar system. I don't think a planet can have an elongated, or tilted, orbit further in.

There's mathematical equations for predicting orbits. The asteroid belt was predicted before it was discovered. So orbits can't be arbitrary. I think using an unusual orbit leaves the science on far too shaky ground to worry about science at all!

Our own solar system is the best known solar system, and an excellent place to start for getting an understanding of the science.


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## Snelbrouler (Jul 14, 2018)

So... I found that a larger axial tilt angle causes the range of temperatures a planet experiences to become significantly higher. If I wanted to have daily rainstorms on the planet, then they would have to be warm tropical rains, and not the cold rain/sleet I imagined. My bad :icon_frown:

As for the orbit and the type of suns, I've gotta look more into that. I remember during my awkward phase when I was obsessed with Isaac Asimov that he mentioned there were several types of stars, only a handful of which were habitable (I think that was mentioned in _The Stars, Like Dust_). He refers to them using different letters, but I never bothered to search them up to learn what they exactly were. I'm finding articles on that right now.

Finally, about the MC, she's supposed to be a young girl who's oblivious to the fact that she's on an uninhabited alien planet. She lives with her mother in a metal tower that used to be an older model of a rocket used for interplanetary travel (of course, she doesn't know that yet). Once she starts getting nightmares foreshadowing the impending winter storms, she realizes that she needs to save herself and her mother fast.

Hope that clarifies some things up, and thanks for your insight!


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## Cran (Jul 15, 2018)

Even limiting to Earthlike planets, there are many variables which can influence the weather, the seasons, and the climate. For a story, you need not worry too much about most of them unless understanding the environment is a key part of the story.

Assuming a stable orbit; that is, an orbit which doesn't decay within the normal life of the stellar system -
A planet's "year" or orbital period is a function of its average distance from its star*, as is its orbital velocity*. Its velocity at any given time of the "year" (orbital cycle), is determined by its distance from the star at that time. The more elliptical the orbit, the greater the variance in both distance from the parent star and the velocity at which the planet moves in its orbit.

For an orbit of ten Earth years, the planet would be orbiting roughly outside of our system's asteroid belt but well inside the orbit of Jupiter. Actually, an Earthlike body could well be a major satellite (moon) of a Jupiter-like gas giant at that distance from the parent star. 

If total escape from the planet is not possible, then, with the seasons as described for a surface dweller, the best option would be to imitate our larger hibernating mammals. Go underground for the winter.


*Kepler's Third Law: The square of the orbital period of a planet is directly proportional to the cube of the semi-major axis of its orbit. 

To find the semi-major axis distance (which works out to be the average regardless of how elliptical the orbit; that's a function of Kepler's Second Law (the equal area relationship)) in AUs - astronomical units (where Earth = 1= ~93m miles or ~150m km)- of a planet with an orbital period of ten Earth years (where one Earth year = 1, obviously), then we need to find the cube route of 10[sup]2[/sup] to see that our story planet has a semi-major axis (or average distance) of roughly 4.64AU (=~431m miles, ~696m km).


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## Jack of all trades (Jul 15, 2018)

Cran said:


> Even limiting to Earthlike planets, there are many variables which can influence the weather, the seasons, and the climate. For a story, you need not worry too much about most of them unless understanding the environment is a key part of the story.
> 
> Assuming a stable orbit; that is, an orbit which doesn't decay within the normal life of the stellar system -
> A planet's "year" or orbital period is a function of its average distance from its star*, as is its orbital velocity*. Its velocity at any given time of the "year" (orbital cycle), is determined by its distance from the star at that time. The more elliptical the orbit, the greater the variance in both distance from the parent star and the velocity at which the planet moves in its orbit.
> ...




Are you keeping in mind that the winter will be 2-5 Earth years long? Being without sunlight for that long can cause serious health issues, depending on how dependent the beings are to sunlight. Do we know what happens to humans who are kept in the dark for 2-5 years? I bet some would die. Lack of sunlight would prevent Vitamin D creation. Vitamin D is needed to convert beta carotene to vitamin A, isn't it? I think it's needed for the creation of bile, which is needed to digest fats. D is also needed for calcium absorption and bone health. I know that's humans, but an alien species could need more OR less sunlight.

But let's step away from the sunlight issue. How does one store enough food? It's unlikely that a species not evolved for hibernation can simply choose to hibernate.

If the planet tilts, and the opposite hemisphere has the opposite season, one solution could be to move to the opposite hemisphere, if such a long journey is possible.

Just kicking around ideas for the OP, and anyone else, to consider.


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## Snelbrouler (Jul 16, 2018)

So far, we have a planet that's orbiting a sun much brighter than ours at a distance that allows for it's 10 year... year (haha).

For the setting:
The MC has always been living in the "summertime" of the planet for as long as she can remember. During the morning, it's dangerous to go outside due to the intensity of the sun. During the afternoon, heavy rain clouds form above the skies, making it safe to go outside (yes, this is relevant to the plot, we gotta have the daily rainstorms). At night, the skies are clear, allowing for the MC and her mother to look up at the stars and tell stories about the constellations they see (aka foreshadowing).

I've already written an outline for the ending, which goes a little something like this:
The MC notices something is wrong only until the temperatures on the planet suddenly drop below freezing, as the climate change is eerily similar to what she experiences in her nightmares. The rocket she lives in doesn't have enough fuel to escape the planet's atmosphere, so the MC must send an FTL signal towards an interstellar civilization for them to come rescue her. It sounds weird and kind of goofy, but I might change it later.

As for the planet being a moon of a gas giant, I am actually really intrigued by that idea! Though I'm not really sure how life would be like on that type of environment, and would probably have to rewrite hundreds of words for that to work :shock:. But I will be searching up stuff about habitable moons nevertheless.

Anyways, I like the response this thread is getting. Thank you all so much for your thoughts on the topic!


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## Jack of all trades (Jul 16, 2018)

Snelbrouler said:


> So far, we have a planet that's orbiting a sun much brighter than ours at a distance that allows for it's 10 year... year (haha).
> 
> For the setting:
> The MC has always been living in the "summertime" of the planet for as long as she can remember. During the morning, it's dangerous to go outside due to the intensity of the sun. During the afternoon, heavy rain clouds form above the skies, making it safe to go outside (yes, this is relevant to the plot, we gotta have the daily rainstorms). At night, the skies are clear, allowing for the MC and her mother to look up at the stars and tell stories about the constellations they see (aka foreshadowing).
> ...



Questions : 

Why would it suddenly be freezing? That doesn't seem realistic. There would be a cooler fall season, that would last a couple years, most likely.

What have they been eating? If there's no animal life on the land, what meat do they eat? Fish? Are there plants on land? 

How can the weather be so regular and predictable? That doesn't quite seem realistic either. 

Why is it so dangerous to be out in the morning? Personally, I find that pretty believable, but the "experts" warn about the dangers of the midday sun on Earth. Every burn I ever had happened in the early morning and just before sunset, never midday, so I don't quite believe the "experts" on that one. Still, I wonder what is so dangerous in the morning on this world.

Have you considered how long it would take for the signal to be received and the pickup made? Why didn't they signal sooner? Did they like being on the planet? This doesn't bother me. I'm just curious about it.

It sounds intriguing!


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## Snelbrouler (Jul 16, 2018)

1. Sorry, I misused the word "suddenly." Of course, it's a gradual transition, but the MC finds it concerning, because it mirrors the events she sees in her dreams. Again, my bad.

2. Yes they eat fish, crustaceans, algae, etc. They live on a beach. Sorry, should have made that clear :shame:.

3. Actually that's a pretty good point! Might have to fix that.

4. Not really life threatening, more unpleasant. Again, my crappy word choice is really evident in my replies, which is making me concerned about just how many times this issue plagues my writing. By "morning," I mean the hours leading up to noon, though I might have to rethink about how that works as well.

5. She didn't know her home was a rocket until she was told by another character during the time when the planet is freezing over, which means it's already pretty late into the story. Given that they were away on the planet for five Earth-like years, I'm going to explain how technology has significantly improved back home, allowing for more efficient FTL travel. I might not explicitly state how long it takes for the signal to be received, as I feel that isn't really necessary to the plot; all that matters is that rescue does arrive on time. Also yes, they do enjoy living on the planet. The mother is not accustomed to living on another planet, and is not familiar with the concept that the days, years, and climate conditions of other planets can vary drastically from her own. The girl has been living there for almost her entire life, and is completely oblivious to the idea of interstellar travel, let alone the concept of other habitable worlds, until the other character gets introduced.

I'd be happy to answer any more questions you have!


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## Jack of all trades (Jul 16, 2018)

I guessed they lived near a beach from the excerpt you posted on the other thread, but that didn't mention what they ate. I was just curious.

The mother would become aware that time was advancing differently as she watched her daughter grow. She might not be aware initially, but one day it would dawn on her that a couple years had past. It wouldn't take five years. My opinion.

I did understand that it was the hours before noon. Sorry my personal anecdote confused the point.


The following does not really require a response here. You can, if you like, but you can just include the info in the story, too. Whichever works best for you.

So the mother is enjoying the solitude and the isolation is not bothering her. Why? There must be something she hated on the world she left behind. That should be part of your story, I think. 

Now the girl is dreaming about the winter and the weather starts getting colder. When and why does the mother get worried enough to send the signal? 

You say the technology advanced in the five years they were there, but how long did it take for them to get there? Is the mother worried that the rescue won't be in time? That might increase the suspense. 


A different idea for you to consider : Instead of the 10 Earth years year, might the planet be going into an ice age for the same effect? It could still be an unusual length of orbit, like 2 or 3 years. And maybe the child could be a bit older. Just putting it out there for your consideration.


I do like this premise.


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## Ralph Rotten (Jul 16, 2018)

Oooooh geeezzz.....

I just realized what plotline we are discussing.
This is Lost in Space, the Netflix version.
Great planet, but they don't know it's about to go into a deeeeeeep winter because of an eccentric orbit caused by a singularity (that had once been a binary star).
Now Molly Parker has to get them off the planet!
Cool part of the story is that it is built into the planet's environment. It has this super long winter, everything dies, and the entire eco-culture is re-spawned from the dust.


Oh, sorry, spoiler alert.


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## Snelbrouler (Jul 16, 2018)

> A different idea for you to consider : Instead of the 10 Earth years year, might the planet be going into an ice age for the same effect? It could still be an unusual length of orbit, like 2 or 3 years. And maybe the child could be a bit older. Just putting it out there for your consideration.



That idea has never once occurred to me, and I think it is brilliant!
I'll definitely use that premise instead of the weird convoluted one I thought of.
Thank you so much!:love-struck:

As for the _Lost in Space_ episode, I was never made aware that something like that existed. Would that be considered plagiarism?


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## Jack of all trades (Jul 16, 2018)

Snelbrouler said:


> That idea has never once occurred to me, and I think it is brilliant!
> I'll definitely use that premise instead of the weird convoluted one I thought of.
> Thank you so much!:love-struck:
> 
> As for the _Lost in Space_ episode, I was never made aware that something like that existed. Would that be considered plagiarism?



Plagiarism or copyright violation is when you knowingly, deliberately use another work verbatim or without change. That's clearly not the case with this.

You could even be inspired by Lost in Space, but do it your own way, possibly "fixing mistakes" (changing things that you didn't like). But that's not the case with this, either.

I think you're fine.

If you really grateful, you can send me an autographed copy when the print book comes out.


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## Snelbrouler (Jul 16, 2018)

No offense, but I wouldn't get my hopes up.
Considering that this is only my first work of prose, and that it's incredibly short, I wouldn't expect it to get published any time soon.
But thanks for your help and responsiveness!


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## Terry D (Jul 16, 2018)

Another solution to the variable climate conundrum would be to have the planet orbiting a variable star -- a star which varies in output on a regular basis (in this case, every ten years) -- variables can brighten and dim slowly, or quickly, so you could choose which you need for your story. Another solution could be a binary star system (two or more suns). Their orbital alignments could cause the effects you are looking for as well. Do a search for extra-terrestrial life around variable stars and binary stars. You should get some ideas.


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## Cran (Jul 16, 2018)

Jack of all trades said:


> Are you keeping in mind that the winter will be 2-5 Earth years long? Being without sunlight for that long can cause serious health issues, depending on how dependent the beings are to sunlight. Do we know what happens to humans who are kept in the dark for 2-5 years? I bet some would die. Lack of sunlight would prevent Vitamin D creation. Vitamin D is needed to convert beta carotene to vitamin A, isn't it? I think it's needed for the creation of bile, which is needed to digest fats. D is also needed for calcium absorption and bone health. I know that's humans, but an alien species could need more OR less sunlight.
> 
> But let's step away from the sunlight issue. How does one store enough food? It's unlikely that a species not evolved for hibernation can simply choose to hibernate.
> 
> ...



I assumed, based on the earlier description that hemi-global migration was not an option. Yes, vitamin D deprivation is not healthy (although not particularly fatal), but an interstellar traveler will have ways to counter that - vitamin supplements, UV lamps, dietary options. What do they eat? Subterranean marine life and fungi. 



Snelbrouler said:


> So far, we have a planet that's orbiting a sun much brighter than ours at a distance that allows for it's 10 year... year (haha).


It need not be very much brighter than our sun to work, especially if the world is a gas giant satellite. More on that below. 

But, even forgoing that option, the surface temperature of a terrestrial planet is modified by the land:sea surface ratio, the concentration of greenhouse gases (usually referred to as CO2 equivalents, although methane and water vapour are common greenhouse gases here) in the atmosphere, the pressure column (ie, atmospheric pressure at the world's datum, roughly sea-level), and the ocean-atmosphere circulation. The lower the land:sea ratio, and the higher the atmospheric CO2 equivalents and pressure column, the higher the mean surface temperature.




> As for the planet being a moon of a gas giant, I am actually really intrigued by that idea! Though I'm not really sure how life would be like on that type of environment, and would probably have to rewrite hundreds of words for that to work :shock:. But I will be searching up stuff about habitable moons nevertheless.
> 
> Anyways, I like the response this thread is getting. Thank you all so much for your thoughts on the topic!


One reason to consider a satellite world is our Moon. Our moon is unusually (think: extremely rarely) large for a planet the size and mass of Earth, to the point where the Earth-Moon system can be considered a binary planet. However, that over-large moon gave life on Earth at least two important advantages: the strong tides, and a roughly equatorial defense against rogue bollides (objects which impact the Earth).

A satellite world would most likely be tidally locked to its parent gas giant. That means its "day" (the cycle of sunlight and darkness) would equal its "month" (its orbit around the parent planet) and that would be determined by its distance from the planet (governed by Kepler's Third Law, but with a minimum distance according to the gas giant's Roche Limit - the formula d = 2.4x R (ρM/ρm)1/3 where ρM is the density of the primary body, ρm is the density of the satellite, and R is the radius of the main body.)  

A location on the inner hemisphere of the world would have a "double" day - that is, a sunrise and bright morning, a darkening around noon as it moves into the gas giant's shadow (but a brilliant view of the gas giant's internal storm glow, the lightning and the aurorae, depending on the latitude of the viewer), and a bright afternoon and sunset. On a water-rich world, that would mean morning evaporation becomes mid-daynight condensation (clouds) and heavy rainfalls if the shadow transit lasts long enough (transit times are determined by distance from the primary (satellite velocity and apparent size) and the diameter of the primary).

Finally, a satellite world would have that extra source of internal heat due to tidal stresses - hot vents in the seas, hot springs, and the potential for Mars-sized volcanoes. Air and water filters might be needed. With a molten outer core, the solid inner core can move (rotate) independently (of the tidally-locked mantle) thus generating a mild magnetic field - and that's important for surface conditions to allow for life as we know it.




Terry D said:


> Another solution could be a binary star system (two or more suns). Their orbital alignments could cause the effects you are looking for as well.


Oy! I was doing that one!


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## Jack of all trades (Jul 16, 2018)

Cran said:


> I assumed, based on the earlier description that hemi-global migration was not an option. Yes, vitamin D deprivation is not healthy (although not particularly fatal), but an interstellar traveler will have ways to counter that - vitamin supplements, UV lamps, dietary options. What do they eat? Subterranean marine life and fungi.



These people are crashed on this planet. They had not planned to be somewhere for years. A supply of supplements would likely run out before the five year long winter was over.

A sun lamp? Would they have one? Would it have survived the crash? How would it be powered?

Dietary options? You specified they are hibernating during the five year winter. What are they eating?

Vitamin D deprivation IS fatal when long term. One would not be able to absorb calcium or convert beta carotene to vitamin A. The vitamin D deprivation would simply be the first domino that would, ultimately, lead to death.

All in all, the hibernation option has too many problems to be viable. 

Migration is not being considered. It was an idea I put out there for consideration, much like your hibernation suggestion.


There is only speculation about binary stars having planets that can support life. Hardly rock solid scientific evidence.


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## Jack of all trades (Jul 16, 2018)

So there is no confusion again, I putting my remarks that are unrelated to Cran's post in a separate post.

Variable stars are dying. Not sure that life would remain active on a planet orbiting a dying star. The shifts from hot to cold would likely kill most life early on.

That might help with my next point.

Dirt. If there was no life on land, ever, there would be no dirt. Just something to keep in mind.

Clarifying : By "dirt" I mean something that could grow plants, excluding lichen-ish size or smaller.


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## Ralph Rotten (Jul 16, 2018)

Okay, here is some fun theory that may only deepen the question, but make the story more exciting.

What if the planet is not native to the solar system.



See, in our solar system we can identify things that are where they are supposed to be because they orbit close to Sol's orbital plane.
But things that were captured from elsewhere, or have been knocked out of orbit, will have an eccentric orbit. Pluto is one of these. 
Pluto not only orbits off-plane, but it rotates with its moon off-plane from the rest of the solar system.
Clearly something happened to Pluto because it is totally AFU in its orbital mechanics.

So this planet you have freezes like an icecube every [X] years due to en eccentric orbit, because it is not from that solar system.  It could either be a captured planet, or an artificial body of some kind (left floating in space for fifty million years it would pick up a lot of dirt and crap until eventually it looked like a planet.) 








The first time I saw this thing my thought was "Is that what a ship would look like if you left it in space for a million years?"


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## Ralph Rotten (Jul 16, 2018)

If you wanna get an awesome view of Pluto (and a buncha other waaaaay cool stuff, then download NASA's Eyes app.
It is totally bitchin'.
It's got Juno too.
I got to watch Cassini burn up virtually live with the app. Twas some awesome science.

https://eyes.nasa.gov/

Such a cool app.


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## Ralph Rotten (Jul 16, 2018)

and free too.:sneakiness:


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## Jack of all trades (Jul 16, 2018)

Ralph Rotten said:


> Okay, here is some fun theory that may only deepen the question, but make the story more exciting.
> 
> What if the planet is not native to the solar system.
> 
> ...



I don't think it could be an artificial body because it does have life. It's just that all the life is under water, and not on land.

Cool pic, though!


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## Terry D (Jul 17, 2018)

Jack of all trades said:


> There is only speculation about binary stars having planets that can support life. Hardly rock solid scientific evidence.



In case you haven't noticed, there's no "rock solid scientific evidence" for _any_ extraterrestrial planet being able to support life. _All _discussion about potentially habitable planets is speculation at this time. We do know that some binary systems have planets, and even have 'habitable zones' (see Kepler-47c).



> Variable stars are dying. Not sure that life would remain active on a planet orbiting a dying star. The shifts from hot to cold would likely kill most life early on.




There are many types of variable stars, not all are "dying". In fact, it may be true that most stars are somewhat variable (our own sun is a variable star). So, for the purposes of speculative fiction, a pulsating, long-term variable star could be a reasonable setting.


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## Terry D (Jul 17, 2018)

Cran said:


> Oy! I was doing that one!



LOL. And I'm sure you would handle it far better than I! I look forward to reading your take on it.


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## Phil Istine (Jul 17, 2018)

A mind-boggling concept:  A generational ship leaves Earth for a distant planet that's been identified as possibly life supporting.  They survive the journey.  Opportunities to evolve within the ship are clearly very limited.

A very long time after the generational ship leaves, humans figure out a way of travelling via folding space and manage to travel to the planet in a tiny fraction of the time taken by the generational ship.  After reaching the planet, the folding-space humans start adapting to their new environment and evolve - a lot - possibly to the point of barely being recognisable as human.

Eventually, the generational ship arrives.  They meet.
Could be something to work with, but I bet someone has already done it.


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## ppsage (Jul 17, 2018)

For a classic and well detailed illustration of the binary-star-long-season scenario see the Helliconia books by Brian Aldiss. A must-read maybe, for SF with an evolutionary bent. Even in conditions of decreasing plausibility (for climate experts at least), it remains riveting.


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## patskywriter (Jul 17, 2018)

It would be interesting if the main character had perceived weaknesses and superpowers due to her being human. The weakness could be her constant struggle to breathe, much like someone with asthma, but actually because the air is too thin for earthlings. So, on one hand, she’d be considered disabled because she would need a device or aid to help her get enough oxygen. But on the other hand, her lightweight frame, native to the Earth’s atmosphere, might allow her to bounce around (like astronauts on the Moon). Maybe everyone else’s frames are much thicker and heavier and they envy her abilities, as so many of us enjoy watching birds in flight.


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## Thaumiel (Jul 17, 2018)

Jack of all trades said:


> I suggest you learn more about our own solar system, with an eye to using the info to create your world. Use the Internet, but don't rely on Wikipedia. That info is not always the most reliable. (One person who has a Wikipedia page noticed incorrect info about himself. When he tried to correct it, the powers at Wikipedia deamed him an unreliable source and removed his correction, restoring the invalid info.)



I just wanted to point out that for the sciences Wikipedia is generally good and regularly fact checked. Be wary, but don't dismiss it.

One of the best ways to start a general search into a topic is to skim through Wikipedia and select the references that are most relevant to what you want to know. Follow them up at the bottom of the page and you'll be lead to books and research papers. From there you can get more specific in what you want to know, follow citations and so on.

Often published papers will be in pay to read journals, if you're at university or the right place of work you may have institutional access. If not then modern papers tend to also have a pre-print version on arXiv that can be viewed for free.

If you already know what topic/object you're interested in, then this site will be useful http://adsabs.harvard.edu/ You'll be able search directly for papers on topics. It will also give links to where you can find the published paper and/or arXiv files.


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## Cran (Jul 17, 2018)

Jack of all trades said:


> These people are crashed on this planet. They had not planned to be somewhere for years. A supply of supplements would likely run out before the five year long winter was over.
> 
> A sun lamp? Would they have one? Would it have survived the crash? How would it be powered?


If they were traveling through space between systems, they would have supplements and UV emitters (lamps), because of ... oh yes, vitamin D deprivation. The ship crashes with two survivors from an original complement of how many? Space ships are not like family cars; extended emergency supplies would be expected.

We are not told what did or did not survive the crash, but we are told that the derelict craft is used when above ground, and that two people survived, suggesting that the ship builders knew how to build ships to keep people as safe as possible when far away from the nearest AAA call out region. 

Batteries are a cool way to power most things; generators can be run on wind, solar, chemical, or radioactive power sources.



> Dietary options? You specified they are hibernating during the five year winter. What are they eating?


No, you misread. I suggested that they should do what large hibernating animals do, and that is to go underground. Humans are not natural hibernators. With subterranean water sources, they can eat fish (natural source of vitamin D) and cave fungi (mushrooms). With UV emitters, they can grow vegetables. Life in a deep cave system would not be very different from life in space between stellar systems.

If they are expected to make do with what is available, then marine life is doubly important. The oils would be the only local source of fuel.




> Vitamin D deprivation IS fatal when long term. One would not be able to absorb calcium or convert beta carotene to vitamin A. The vitamin D deprivation would simply be the first domino that would, ultimately, lead to death.


Very long term. With up to one half of the human population now (with all that sunshine available) considered to be lacking sufficient vitamin D, and one quarter of those classed as vitamin D deficient or deprived, imminent death from same is less of a concern than outright starvation or water-borne diseases. Yes, bone softening and deformation results from chronic vitamin D deficiency, that's why ways to mitigate it would be part of any space-faring design; much like citrus was used on sailing ships to counter scurvy.


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## Jack of all trades (Jul 18, 2018)

Cran said:


> If they were traveling through space between systems, they would have supplements and UV emitters (lamps), because of ... oh yes, vitamin D deprivation. The ship crashes with two survivors from an original complement of how many? Space ships are not like family cars; extended emergency supplies would be expected.
> 
> We are not told what did or did not survive the crash, but we are told that the derelict craft is used when above ground, and that two people survived, suggesting that the ship builders knew how to build ships to keep people as safe as possible when far away from the nearest AAA call out region.
> 
> ...



You are making a series of assumptions which do not seem to hold with the confines of the original post. 



Snelbrouler said:


> Its distance from the sun causes the planet's climate to be significantly cooler than ours. During the planet's "summer" season, it receives daily rainstorms and violent winds. *During the "winter" season, the temperatures drop hundreds of degrees, making its surface completely inhabitable. This is also why all of the planet's ecosystem resides in its oceans.*



So there is no cave fungus, because all life is in the oceans. (Even if there was, it might be poisonous.) No guarantee of subterranean water, either. Temps too low to survive outside. 

No land life that is native, so is there dirt that is suitable for growing vegetables? Were seeds brought along for the ride?

A later post by the OP states : 


Snelbrouler said:


> The MC notices something is wrong only until the temperatures on the planet suddenly drop below freezing, as the climate change is eerily similar to what she experiences in her nightmares. The rocket she lives in doesn't have enough fuel to escape the planet's atmosphere, so *the MC must send an FTL signal towards an interstellar civilization for them to come rescue her.* It sounds weird and kind of goofy, but I might change it later.



Now that implied to me that the planet was not extremely far from where she started. It is rapidly getting cold, and freezing is becoming more likely, so she sends a signal. She must be expecting that the signal will reach her people and they will have time to travel to get her before she freezes. That can't be years, or help would arrive too late. That implies to me that the planet where she is is within her solar system, and she only traveled months. Supplements may have been taken along, but not necessarily enough to last more than a year, and surely some would have been used on the original trip. 

I agree that your, and other, proposed ideas may make for a good book, though. It just doesn't seem to me to work with the criteria provided. (Granted, the OP could change the criteria.)


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## Jack of all trades (Jul 18, 2018)

James 剣 斧 血 said:


> I just wanted to point out that for the sciences Wikipedia is generally good and regularly fact checked. Be wary, but don't dismiss it.
> 
> One of the best ways to start a general search into a topic is to skim through Wikipedia and select the references that are most relevant to what you want to know. Follow them up at the bottom of the page and you'll be lead to books and research papers. From there you can get more specific in what you want to know, follow citations and so on.
> 
> ...



I didn't mean to make it sound as though Wikipedia is completely unreliable. Just that it shouldn't be the sole source, as you also said.


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## Jack of all trades (Jul 18, 2018)

I did a little digging on the subject of dirt. It seems that even the Moon can support plant life.

"The results show that plants are able to germinate and grow on both Martian and moon soil simulant for a period of 50 days without any addition of nutrients. ... Our results show that in principle it is possible to grow crops and other plant species in Martian and Lunar soil simulants. Can Plants Grow on Mars and the Moon: A Growth Experiment on ... journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10..."

But growing plants and having them be edible are two different things.

"Toxic Mars: Astronauts Must Deal with Perchlorate on the Red Planet -Space.com https://www.space.com/21554-mars-toxic... Jun 13, 2013 ... The pervading carpet of perchlorate chemicals found on Mars may boost the chances that microbial life exists on the Red Planet —but perchlorates are also perilous to the health of future ... Salts on Mars Are a Mixed Bles"

It seems that perchlorates are harmful to the thyroid.


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