# Do you ever lose your writing drive?



## abacoian (Dec 19, 2014)

I'm kinda not writing right now. Things were going good, writing regularly, life and work and tired and being busy knocked my writing down and I haven't been for a good few months. I want to but just don't and don't know if I still can. Have you been here and what helped you and any encouragement appreciated.

Thank you,
Ian


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## Jeko (Dec 19, 2014)

> Have you been here



Yes.



> what helped you



Writing.

You can always write; the stresses and confines of busy life can even be a boon to that. But if you're not writing, then everything you've written before is going to look worse and worse, because you're not building on it. It's like you're a plant and you're not giving yourself water. You'll wilt.

 The more you maintain your creativity, the more you'll be able to command it at will; your brain works, in that way, just like any other muscle. Just ease yourself back into a disciplined routine, even if it's uncomfortable, in order to tell the stories that you want to tell.

If you want to write, you'll do the work. If you don't, you'll make an excuse. Most of the time it's as simple as that.


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## deadpringle (Dec 19, 2014)

Yeah, it does happen from time to time. I just started up writing again after a 6 year hiatus. I just needed a break after getting my first book done. I don't think the others will be as trying since I have a good feel for what's involved now. Don't sweat it. Sometimes it can help to try writing something that is outside of you comfort zone.


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## Bishop (Dec 19, 2014)

abacoian said:


> I want to but just don't and don't know if I still can.



Can your fingers hit keys? Can you use a pen?

Then you can write. I'm often not in the mood to write, and in those times, I write. I set a goal and I stick to it, 2000 words a day without fail. If I stop writing and wait for whenever I feel like it, I'd never get anything done. If you're not writing it's because something else is taking a priority in your life. Make writing a priority and make the time for it, and it will get done.


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## escorial (Dec 19, 2014)

i only write when things are not going as well as i expected...when things go well my words just stop.


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## abacoian (Dec 19, 2014)

Thanks guys, greatly appreciated


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## Morkonan (Dec 19, 2014)

abacoian said:


> I'm kinda not writing right now. Things were going good, writing regularly, life and work and tired and being busy knocked my writing down and I haven't been for a good few months. I want to but just don't and don't know if I still can. Have you been here and what helped you and any encouragement appreciated.
> 
> Thank you,
> Ian



Yes, I've "lost my drive." Mainly, that was due to real-life events that made things hectic for me and introduced a lot of uncertainty about where I was going and what I was doing. 

There's a popular myth out there that poses writers as often troubled and tortured souls, struggling with their life, and that this produces great writers. Well... I have to scream BS at that.  You can not write when you're overwhelmed by "real life." I suppose some people can, but it's hard to write a good story if you're being shot at while crashing over a bridge in a burning car, right? Right. In other words, you need some sort of stability, something to build on, in order to write well. (I think most people do, though there could be a few troubled souls out there that write in a fashion that is considered to be highly desirable. But, I wouldn't want to pay the price that those writers pay... They don't usually end up well.)

What helped me? Realizing that I must write, no matter what else is going on and no matter what other distractions I may have. I also realized that if I wanted to really write, I had to create some stability, some surety, in order to be able to build on that and to venture out from it, as a writer. 

I started making myself a routine as a goal. I started going to bed at night, trying to aim for a decent hour. (I am a notorious insomniac/night-person.  ) Then, when I got up, I started a routine of making coffee, checking messages, doing those things one must do, every day. I didn't start writing, yet, I just focused on establishing a routine. I pledged to eat before 6pm, every night. (I don't always eat every day.... Hey, I get busy and forget, sometimes...  And, I generally only eat once a day. It's in my nature, it's just how I am. Yes, it's weird. But, then again, I don't have to worry too much about overeating, do I?  ) I worked hard at trying to get to bed at a decent hour, even though I lapsed, here and there. 

OK, I did that for awhile, trying to keep to that routine. After that, it was time to build on that and start back with my writing. Once I had a routine purposefully constructed to afford me the opportunity to write, I was much more able to begin a writing routine again. It wasn't the routine that I constructed that was important, it was the fact that I did it.

For you, I would suggest doing something similar. No, I don't mean "building some silly routine in your already busy life."  What I mean is that you should start off by building something, anything, in your current life or routine that you can build upon as a firm foundation to support your writing.

That "something" can be anything. Suppose you decide to start walking the dog every day? Doing the dishes? Going to a coffee-shop? Working in your yard? Whatever it happens to be, specifically, doesn't matter. All that mattes is that you like it, you can do it, and that you _do it_. Do that for awhile and keep at it. Just do whatever it is that you have chosen to do. And, later, use that _accomplishment_ to support your writing and to encourage you with the reminder that you _can_ do something if you want to do it badly enough. Even the notion that you were successful at "doing something every day" can be enough to inspire you to "do something else every day" that you also would like to do.

Little bricks... Lots of little bricks, put together, can build a house or a mansion or a giant pyramid. But, you have to start with one. Pick one, start with that, build on it.


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## aj47 (Dec 19, 2014)

I have only one muse.  But my muse is incredibly versatile and can dance in Java code, SQL, and tech writing as well as poetry.  So when I am doing Other Things that might not appear especially creative to the casual layman, my muse is still there, cavorting.  Heck, I've had one of my recent critiques described as "poetic" by the OP.

Maybe you're expressing yourself in other ways than writing.


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## garza (Dec 19, 2014)

Never.

But because one-word posts are discouraged, an explanation is needed. 

For so many years my living depended on my writing. I needed to pay the rent. My son and I needed clothes, shoes, and food. Our belovéd E-type, for all its beauty, required fuel and, like all cats of its breed, the attention of one trained to maintain its complex internal workings. In short, to not write was not an option. Never having had a job, the survival in comfort of our little family depended on me putting one word after another daily. The necessity became habitual, and so continues to this day. Writing for me is both the giver of an internal satisfaction, and the supplier of the essentials and the extras of life.


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## Morkonan (Dec 19, 2014)

garza said:


> ...The necessity became habitual, and so continues to this day. Writing for me is both the giver of an internal satisfaction, and the supplier of the essentials and the extras of life.



This reminds me of the "Greats" during the heady days of the Golden Age of Science Fiction. Those guys would work their fingers to the bone, churning out a story every week, just so they could eat. They'd rush down to publisher's row, hawk their story to whatever editor they had developed a relationship with, and some that they hadn't, get a small check and then run down to the diner and get the first hot food they'd had all week.

Some wonderful stories came out of that desperation.

I would have loved to have been a writer during that time. Yes, it was hard. But, those guys made their bones and have the scars to show for it. When every word means a meal, one's skills get honed whether one wants them to or not.


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## Kyle R (Dec 19, 2014)

I haven't lost my motivation to write (yet!). I hope I don't. 

I have, though, lost confidence in my abilities many times. Professional rejections, especially, deliver huge blows to my fragile writer's heart. Will I ever make it as a writer? Am I wasting my time? Am I no better than a six-year-old scribbling with crayons?  These kinds of thoughts plague me whenever I check my inbox and see: 

"Dear Kyle, thank you for submitting your story. Unfortunately, better writers than you have submitted as well, and we would much rather pay them for their work, which they likely wrote in a fraction of the time you spent toiling away on yours. Perhaps in another ten years or so you might be good enough. Until then . . ."

Well, those may not be the actual words, but they are the words I always see. A few times, I considered giving up completely. 

But I also have a support system in place, both in real life (my wife, who believes in me despite all evidence to the contrary) and an online community of fellow writers who make the struggle not such a lonely one. 

I think it's important to have people who believe in you—even if (especially if) you sometimes don't. Or at least, people who will tell you to suck it up and push onward whenever you get a little mopey.

So, have I lost the motivation? Not a bit! Do I get beat down time to time? Absolutely! Will I keep getting back up and fighting back? You bet your butt I will! :encouragement:


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## garza (Dec 20, 2014)

Morkonan - Whenever someone here complains about 'writer's block' I have to laugh. They should have been with me in my early days as a free-lance wire service hack sloshing through rice paddies and dodging bullets in a jungle to get a story, knowing that being able to eat for the next few days depended on getting the story, getting it right, and getting it fast to beat the next fellow. When survival depends on selling a story the whole concept of 'writer's block' becomes farcical. The _need _to write soaked into my skin right alongside a _desire_ to write. If someone sits around waiting for inspiration or waiting for some sort of 'drive' that person needs to find something else to do. 

You mention the early days of science fiction. I'm not a fan of sci-fi, in general but I do like the stories written in the 20s and 30s. A few years ago Isaac Asimov put together a wonderful collection called _Before the Golden Age_. That's the only kind of sci-fi I enjoy. I don't think I've ever read a sci-fi story written after WWII that I enjoyed. I usually give up after a page or two.


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## InnerFlame00 (Dec 20, 2014)

Yes, I have before.  Mostly I think it's due to what astroannie said - I only have one muse.  If it's busy with other stuff my writing will falter.  However, I've beaten it by setting a modest goal for myself - on really bad days I let myself get away with only 500 words a day but I HAVE to do those 500.  On ideal days I will write 2000+.  As long as you are writing every day, even a little, eventually a good day will come around again.

That, and listening to audio books (or reading).  My current job has me designing chalk signs, so I can listen to whatever I want while I work. I usually go through about four or more audio books a month.  Not only has my grammar been improving, but my muse has really been jumping around like crazy.


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## ShadowEyes (Dec 20, 2014)

Go at the work grimly if you have to. There's a fallacy that says writing should be enjoyable. I only like it when I know what I'm doing. The work precludes success, so that even if I write dreadful stuff 90% of the time, I know I'm preparing to write the ideas that will matter most. The story, in itself, is only a short step to a greater goal for when I am older, have better, more mature ideas. I've heard it said that, if you are 25 and below, all of your ideas will end up in the waste basket, relatively speaking. Till I can write the best I am capable of, everything else is just practice. Grim practice, most of the time.


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## Terry D (Dec 20, 2014)

garza said:


> If someone sits around waiting for inspiration or waiting for some sort of 'drive' that person needs to find something else to do.



Or they need to realize that writing, for them, is simply a hobby which they can pursue when the whim strikes.


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## shadowwalker (Dec 20, 2014)

I have had spells where I can't write - during bouts with depression, or when there are family issues happening that are too stressful and exhausting to deal with _anything _else. It's not a loss of 'muse' (I don't believe in those) and it's not "writer's block" (which I also don't believe in) but the hard reality that there are outside forces I _have _to deal with at that time. But otherwise, there's always time to write - fifteen minutes here, perhaps an hour there. And eventually the RL situation resolves itself and the writing can go back to its regular routine. 

Successful writers don't wait for muses, or worry about writer's block, or write when they want to, or when they have the right space or atmosphere, or when life is relatively rosy. They just write.


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## abacoian (Dec 20, 2014)

Thank you guys, a great help and encouragement. For those that write every day, is and when is it okay to take a day off? I will work on a routine and try to just write


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## shadowwalker (Dec 20, 2014)

abacoian said:


> Thank you guys, a great help and encouragement. For those that write every day, is and when is it okay to take a day off? I will work on a routine and try to just write



There's nothing wrong with taking a day off - as long as you have already developed the habit of writing regularly and that you set firmly in your mind that it is _only _a day off. I have seen successful, published authors state that taking time off to 're-boot' is a good thing, but again - as long as you set a firm date to restart.


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## FleshEater (Dec 20, 2014)

Been there, and for the same reasons.

Don't sweat it. One day an idea will strike you and you'll HAVE to write. It happens to me all the time. The last time was right after my novel. Then, about four months later, I wrote three short stories. After those, I took a two month hiatus. Now, a story popped into my head again and I'm back to writing.


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## Sam (Dec 20, 2014)

I don't have a writing drive. 

I save all my work in a folder.


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## abacoian (Dec 20, 2014)

I wrote 500 words today, I will try to do that for 10 consecutive days and see how it goes. It was good today, hope it's gets better and easier


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## Apex (Dec 20, 2014)

Good writers are readers. Try reading more.


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## Guy Faukes (Dec 20, 2014)

Sometimes taking a reasonable break is worth it, even if it is a few months. It's like with any activity. You can overstretch your imaginative processes by writing non-stop. In the end, though, the most important thing is picking up the pen again.


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## garza (Dec 21, 2014)

So what do you do for those few months? Sleep on a park bench? Beg shillings from tourists to buy food? Find a homeless shelter run by a church or the Salvation Army? Rob somebody?


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## shadowwalker (Dec 21, 2014)

garza said:


> So what do you do for those few months? Sleep on a park bench? Beg shillings from tourists to buy food? Find a homeless shelter run by a church or the Salvation Army? Rob somebody?



I think it's pretty obvious that if you're writing for a living, you only take time off when you can afford it - just like any other job. If you're not earning your living with writing, you can take time off whenever.


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## garza (Dec 21, 2014)

If you are _not_ earning your living by writing, but _want_ to, you need to start now thinking the way we think who _do_ earn our living by writing. Once you have written a few best sellers, you'll be okay. But until then best thing is for you to think of writing as the work you do. After all, are there days when you lose your 'drive' to go to your job? Are there times when you are not 'inspired' to show up at the office or the factory or wherever?  Do you lie abed waiting for your 'muse' to take you by the hand and lead you to your job? No. You have to pay the rent and buy the groceries so you get up and go do what needs to be done.

If you do reach the point where you can afford to take some time off, you will not want to. At least, that hasn't been true for me. I reached that point years ago and after a while decided to retire. I was 54 years old. I moved to Belize to be in the sunshine and within a month was back at work and I've not stopped in the 20 years that have passed since then. One day I will go to cry among the rain clouds, then ascend the mighty Ceiba Tree that supports the Earth, climb out onto one of the lower limbs, and an elderly Mayan editor will ask if I can run him up a feature article on land rights for indigenous peoples in Belize. 'Here's a steno pad and pencil,' he will say. 'Currents off again and the 'net's been down all morning but everything should be up by press time.'


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## shadowwalker (Dec 21, 2014)

garza said:


> If you are _not_ earning your living by writing, but _want_ to, you need to start now thinking the way we think who _do_ earn our living by writing.



One develops a work ethic regardless of what work they do. Moving from one job (non-writing) to another job (writing) doesn't change that. The only radical change that occurs is when one moves from working for some else to working for themselves, and then, no matter what entrepreneurial venture one starts (writing or non-writing), a new mindset is required. For writers of fiction, especially, the idea of earning a living through writing is worth working towards, but not especially realistic. At any rate, it remains that one takes time off only when one can afford it. If writing is not your only source of income, or not a major portion of your income, one can take time off from it whenever one decides to. Whether or not this is advisable is dependent on the individual.


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## garza (Dec 21, 2014)

The only 'work ethic' I've ever had is simple - if I didn't work I didn't eat. I've gotten in trouble before for expressing my belief that writing is not work and that if writing were work I would not be a writer because I was born lazy but with a love for writing. As soon as I found out I could live by writing I knew that's how I wanted to live. 

My world outlook is nothing like the people who have jobs, or even other writers. To have a work ethic, as I understand it, is to believe that there is something morally uplifting about work - that to work for the sake of working is somehow righteous. As a youngster I followed my grandfather's advice to find something I enjoyed doing that would make a decent living and I would never have to work. So I became a writer. I will write until I die, but I have never and will never 'work'. I am a craftsman with a love for the craft that transcends any concept of 'work'.


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## ppsage (Dec 21, 2014)

> I am a craftsman with a love for the craft that transcends any concept of 'work'.


This actually fits in almost perfectly with the Marxian paradigm which divides human productive activity into three categories: toil, labor & work. Don't remember the German labels for the concept though, so, in a sense, maybe not _work_ per se.


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## Folcro (Dec 21, 2014)

garza said:
			
		

> When survival depends on selling a story the whole concept of 'writer's block' becomes farcical



You've had the good fortune of making a living off of your writing. I'm not sure if the market was easier to get into back then, I won't step ahead and say that it was, but I'm sure the market was quite different in the days when you were a young writer wedging into the industry.



garza said:


> They should have been with me in my early days as a free-lance wire service hack sloshing through rice paddies and dodging bullets in a jungle to get a story, knowing that being able to eat for the next few days depended on getting the story...



Many people today, young and old, find themselves stuck in dead end, monotonous and thankless jobs; regardless of pay, such jobs can be demanding and give little back in terms of inspiration, and can in fact cause depression, especially jobs which deprive a person of sunlight, of which there are many. This can rob a person of the same "drive" your personal experiences seem to keep on giving--- don't get me wrong, of course, I am sure you deserve them. But everybody's experiences are different.



			
				garza said:
			
		

> Morkonan - Whenever someone here complains about 'writer's block' I have to laugh.



Don't do that.


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## ShadowEyes (Dec 21, 2014)

garza said:


> ...if writing were work I would not be a writer because I was born lazy but with a love for writing. As soon as I found out I could live by writing I knew that's how I wanted to live.



I think a lot of people have a notion that writing should be easy because there are no requirements to write outside of a basic education and a pen and paper. They may think, "Well, since I've failed at everything else, I can try writing!" But that's not the kind of attitude to have. Writing, as a profession, is only indirectly about the writer. It is foremost about the reader, and making the reader feel emotions. (In my opinion.)

But writing _is _ work. The study of humans and their portrayal in creative endeavor is just like any other science and is worthy of diligent practice, regardless of inspiration.


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## garza (Dec 21, 2014)

Folcro - The world hasn't changed as much as you younger folk believe it has. It's as easy today as it was in my day to get started as a professional writer if you are a teen-ager with an attitude and some skill as a writer, The shy and the clueless need not apply. What you have to do is start writing about local events around town, take them to the editor of a local newspaper or the news editor at a local broadcast station, and explain that you can provide an endless number of similar articles. The trick is to write about events that the paper or broadcast station would never send a reporter to cover, but one that has the participation of enough local people whose names will attract readers/listeners. I sold my first story at 14. It was about a scout camping trip and included the names of the kids and adults taking part and a brief account of the activities. I carried along several pictures. The editor of the Daily Herald, Roland Wilkes, liked the story, gave me a couple of tips to improve the writing, and bought it. By the time I went off to university two years later I was stringing for eight newspapers in the region. 

That was 60 years ago. I've never had a job, and I've lived quite well writing non-fiction. When I joined here my goal was to learn to write fiction. I've recently sold a novel to a regional publisher and a short novel to a North American publisher, so my efforts are beginning to pay off.

There is no such thing as writer's block. Either you want to write or you don't. I've wanted to write since I was a kid and when I discovered how easy it was to make money writing, that's when I decided that's how I wanted to live. The path I followed continues to be open to young people with talent and a goodly bit of cheerful self-appreciation. A teacher once called me an arrogant little snot - I was ten at the time - and that's one good recommendation to have. But you have to have both ability and enthusiasm for the craft to be successful.

ShadowEyes - A basic education is not enough these days. That's one thing that has changed if you want to be successful as a frontline reporter or top-ranked editor.I have a Masters in English, and I would count that as a minimum level needed to keep up with events in today's world. The knowledge gained in getting that degree, though I've been out of the classroom for over 50 year, has been a great help as I worked to learn how to write fiction.


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## shadowwalker (Dec 21, 2014)

For most Midwesterns, at least, work ethic means if you accept a job you do it to the very best of your ability. That philosophy works for all jobs, including writing. If you're unlucky enough to take a job you hate, you still put in as much effort as if you had a job you love. That has nothing to do with taking time off. That means, at least to Midwesterners, that you don't spend money you don't have, which is on par with not choosing not to work if you don't have money to pay the bills. And again, we need to be mindful of the different markets for fiction and nonfiction when it comes to the ability to earn a living by writing.


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## Sunny (Dec 21, 2014)

garza said:


> There is no such thing as writer's block. Either you want to write or you don't.



That's probably a very true statement for _you_. 

However, not everyone is the same. Just because you don't understand writers block or have never had it, doesn't mean it doesn't exist for other people who have. 

If other people say they have writer's block, then they do. You aren't them and you can't obviously feel what they are feeling or going through what they're going through. You don't have the same experiences as that person talking. You don't have the same outlook or the same fears or the same driving ambitions or a million other factors that goes into why someone might claim they have writers block. 

I say, good for you for never having writers block. Good for you for having a career you are very proud of. These are wonderful things to have accomplished for sure. 

But, just because something doesn't relate to you doesn't mean it doesn't exist.


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## shadowwalker (Dec 22, 2014)

Personally, I think the more one relies on believes in writer's block, the more often it will occur.


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## garza (Dec 22, 2014)

shadowwalker - I've never spent time in the Midwest. I'm from Mississippi and during the late sixties and on into the seventies spent a lot of time traveling around the South talking with people and much time in New York working with publishers' editors, so I know the South and I know New York, but the Midwest is outside my territory. I've spent very little time talking with the people there, so I don't know firsthand what their world view is. However, from your description of the Midwestern work ethic, it sounds the same as what I was taught growing up in Mississippi. 

Non-fiction markets are always there and always hungry. Fiction markets appear to be chancy. A non-fiction writer with any degree of skill above the average can walk down the street and find work to do at almost every door. It used to be every door, but some parts of the non-fiction market aren't as active as they once were. The non-fiction writer needs to keep on his toes if he wants to continue to sell regularly. The fiction market I've yet to understand. Fortunately my agent does understand. 

Sunny - Sorry if I upset you, and you're making me feel guilty because you are being so kind about it. The truth is I do not understand what can stop a person from sitting down and writing whenever that person wants to write. I've told the story before about dinnertime with my grandfather, but maybe you've not heard. 

My maternal Grandfather died when I was ten, but up till then he had been the greatest influence in my life - greater even than my parents. He ate dinner with us every night, and always demanded that I compose something. One night he said something like 'Now Ricky, tell us about your friend Seamus and his little pug dog.' I had no friend named Seamus and I knew of no one with a pug dog, but that did not matter. A story had to be told. No excuse. Or he might ask for a Limerick on some subject. The subject would be proposed before we ate, and the completed Limerick had to be ready for recital at the end of the meal. Stories and Limericks had to meet strict technical standards. 

Now if a seven or eight-year-old can do that, how can an adult claim not to be able to string words together to form an essay or write a story? It's so simple. You write a word, then the next word, and keep going until you have a piece of writing completed. 

But perhaps some people do suffer from something called 'writer's block', though such a condition is beyond my comprehension.


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## Kyle R (Dec 22, 2014)

Much of the time, writer's block happens when writers are dissatisfied with the quality of writing they are producing.

So they write.

They shake their head and delete what they've written. 

They write again. 

They frown, crumple up the page, and try again. 

They write some more. 

They groan, scratch the words out, grip their hair, and tear the page in half.

They produce a new, blank page.

They look at it. 

They think about all the terrible words they've been writing for the past half hour.

They place their pen to the page (or their fingers to the keyboard).

They hesitate.

They wonder. They worry. They fret. They look at the clock ticking away.

They scribble a word, or type a letter.

They look at it, and sigh.

They crumple up the page and let their shoulders fall.

They are experiencing writer's block.


It's a very common phenomenon. I struggle with it daily. 

This is why I tell myself, "Write it crappy! Then make it better later on!" Otherwise, I'd never get anything done. :grief:


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## Jeko (Dec 22, 2014)

> If other people say they have writer's block, then they do.



But why do they say that they have it? What does 'I'm having trouble writing' accomplish? If you kept working at your story, instead of working at ways to explain why you haven't been productive today, you wouldn't have 'writer's block'; you'd have a story. But too many writers feel difficulty with their work and fall back on 'it must be something out of my control' - 'I'm a good writer, but writer's block is just getting me down' - 'I'll start writing again when it goes away'.

Creative dissatisfaction is different from writer's block, as it's a vital part of the writing process. What most people mean when they say 'writer's block' is that they've got some kind of 'condition' that they need to overcome. They stop focusing on the story and start focusing on themselves, and how to get themselves 'going' again, and how to get themselves 'in the zone', and there are so many books on that kind of BS. Then their 'writer's block' gets worse somehow, and all they say is that the condition is worsening and that they're trying the best but poor me, I have writer's block and I can't write and I'd have a bestseller by now if it wasn't for this stupid condition that I have.

Writer's block has _nothing _to do with your story. So why would you ever think about it while you're writing? The disciplined writer simply stays focused on the story, and keeps writing no matter how hard or easy the words flow. The reason they say that writer's block doesn't exist is because they know that it is made by the writer, which means it only has as much power as the writer wants to give it.


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## Sunny (Dec 22, 2014)

Cadence said:


> But why do they say that they have it? What does 'I'm having trouble writing' accomplish? If you kept working at your story, instead of working at ways to explain why you haven't been productive today, you wouldn't have 'writer's block'; you'd have a story. But too many writers feel difficulty with their work and fall back on 'it must be something out of my control' - 'I'm a good writer, but writer's block is just getting me down' - 'I'll start writing again when it goes away'.
> 
> Creative dissatisfaction is different from writer's block, as it's a vital part of the writing process. What most people mean when they say 'writer's block' is that they've got some kind of 'condition' that they need to overcome. They stop focusing on the story and start focusing on themselves, and how to get themselves 'going' again, and how to get themselves 'in the zone', and there are so many books on that kind of BS. Then their 'writer's block' gets worse somehow, and all they say is that the condition is worsening and that they're trying the best but poor me, I have writer's block and I can't write and I'd have a bestseller by now if it wasn't for this stupid condition that I have.
> 
> Writer's block has _nothing _to do with your story. So why would you ever think about it while you're writing? The disciplined writer simply stays focused on the story, and keeps writing no matter how hard or easy the words flow. The reason they say that writer's block doesn't exist is because they know that it is made by the writer, which means it only has as much power as the writer wants to give it.



I don't know why they say they have writers block. Everyone has a different reason I suppose. Saying _"I'm having trouble writing"_ doesn't accomplish or disaccomplish (I know that's not a word, but I kept it there anyway!) anything I don't think. It's likely a truthful statement of what someone is going through at that time, and they're looking for someone talk to about it. 

I think you can find many reasons why it doesn't exist for you. I also think the writer complaining about having writer's block can find many reasons why they do have it. 

Just because you think it's a matter of being disciplined or whatever kind of terms you want to put on it, doesn't change the reality of the person going through it. I think you should be happy you haven't felt it. I think you should be happy you don't understand it as others do. Be happy it's something you don't understand. But trying to tell someone who suffers with something that you've never felt, or something you don't understand, is somehow wrong to me to say it doesn't exist. 

You can spin it a million different ways to tell them why they don't have writers block, but until you're in their shoes and know what they speak of, you don't really know. 

I knew someone who had depression and their husband didn't understand it. He had never had it. He said she was just "sad" and the feelings would go away. I mean, he'd been sad before. He'd lost his previous wife to cancer before her and never needed to lean on any kind of "drugs" for this so called disease he didn't understand. Just because he didn't know what it felt like to have depression, just because he thought it was feelings of sadness that anyone goes through in life didn't make her depression any less worse. 

I think it's a shame to tell anyone what they are feeling or what they are going through has no merit because you've never experienced it or understand it for yourself. 

Anyhow, that's just how I see it. People have different afflictions and different problems everyday, that I'll never understand and I'm glad I don't. But I would never presume to tell them it wasn't there.


Garza,

I like your story about your grandfather. It's funny how sometimes they have more influence on us in our lives than our own parents. Their wisdom just sticks with us without us knowing it. Until that day we look back and realize we've changed because of what they've said to us.  

I'm glad he had you do those stories. It sounds like it would have been fun to be encouraged to have an imagination, especially at the dinner table. I was told not to make up stories, or stop asking questions and eat what's on my plate.


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## Kyle R (Dec 22, 2014)

I believe that, when someone says they are suffering from writer's block, it can be helpful to discuss what's giving them difficulties. It could be anything. Stress. Perfectionism. Depression. Fear. Anxiety. Doubt. Problems in their life. Health issues. You name it.

Some who complain about writer's block have a tremendous amounts of creative output. Thousands of words every day. But they might delete those words each day out of frustration and start again with a blank page the next day.

Then you have others who complain about writer's block who might stare at the blank page for hours, unable to think of anything good enough to write.

Then you might have a writer whose loved one is sick, and they have a hard time being creative because they are preoccupied with concerns about that person's health.

Different problems require different solutions. 

Dismissing those who complain about it, as if they don't know what they are talking about, isn't really helpful, in my opinion.

I believe it's infinitely better to acknowledge what they're _implying_ when they mention writer's block, (that they are _having trouble writing_, for whatever reason it may be) and then take things from there. :encouragement:


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## Apex (Dec 22, 2014)

Telling a person who has writers block, not to have writers block, is like telling a person who stutters, not to stutter.
There is not just one reason why a person has writers block, there could be a million different reasons, thus there is not one answer to it. I have had it more than once. Fiction writing is different than all other forms. It often feel like a curse…”Oh God, why the hell did I fall in love with fiction writing?” Since I have had it more than once, I charted my feelings during the time of the block…I did understand it was me blocking me. Here was my problem: I would be 20, or 30,000 Words into a story…block. After spending time to write that many words, something in the back of my head said…”I don’t like this story.” 
I’m one of those who talk to myself. I have always talked to myself. Sometimes the talk turns into an argument. Do you know what it feels like to lose an argument with yourself? 

“I don’t like the story.”
“So what are you going to do, dump it?”
“I don’t like it, it’s just, well I don’t like it.”
“Go have a cup of coffee. I’m not wasting five months work just because you don’t like it…fix the damn thing.”
“I don’t want to fix it because I don’t like it.”
“You’re hopeless. I don’t care what you do. Screw you.”

I most always think on a story for about a year before I start writing. When I don’t, well I get time into it, and find I don’t like the story after all…I can either try to fix the mess, or stick it in a box, and use little parts of it in a different story. That is what used to block me. Write the feelings down you are having during your block. If you see a pattern, it might lead you to understand your block. A sure cure for the block…DON’T WRITE FICTION.


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## shadowwalker (Dec 22, 2014)

Kyle R said:


> Some who complain about writer's block have a tremendous amounts of creative output. Thousands of words every day. But they might delete those words each day out of frustration and start again with a blank page the next day.



That's not writer's block - they're writing. They aren't happy with what they're writing, but they're writing. 



Kyle R said:


> Then you have others who complain about writer's block who might stare at the blank page for hours, unable to think of anything good enough to write.



That's not writer's block - that's people not taking the plunge. I've had times when I had one hell of a time figuring out what to do with a story - times when I could easily have thrown up my hands, blamed writer's block, and accomplished nothing more. Funny thing - the more I kept writing and revising and writing and revising, the clearer the path became and eventually I was over the hump. Staring at the pile of wood doesn't get it chopped.



Kyle R said:


> Then you might have a writer whose loved one is sick, and they have a hard time being creative because they are preoccupied with concerns about that person's health.



That's not writer's block - that's Real Life needing to be dealt with. 

Writer's block exists only for those who self-inflict it. The going gets tough and they fold, and then blame writer's block so they don't have to accept the responsibility for the _decision_ not to write. I don't know how often I've seen people go on and on and on about how they want to do this and that but can't because of writer's block - yet they can write forever about their malady. If they put half as much energy into figuring out their story as they do lamenting writer's block, they'd have the book written.


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## Jeko (Dec 22, 2014)

> I think it's a shame to tell anyone what they are feeling or what they are going through has no merit because you've never experienced it or understand it for yourself.



That's not the point; I _have_ experienced it. I just know that what I experienced was something I created, nurtured and eventually dealt with under my own steam, and that it was an important part of my creative process - overcoming creative difficulty and a temporary sense of a lack to progress. It's not a 'block', because it's a part of the path that the writer often has to take. 

I used to call it writer's block. Then I stopped thinking of it in that way and included it as part of what I expected and worked with during the creative process. It's a common misconception that those who argue against writer's block haven't experienced it, but that's not the case. I've met many writer's like myself who simply acknowledge that times of hardship are common in the craft that they've chosen. You work through them. You stay focused on the story. The moment you're worrying about 'writer's block', however, you're focused on yourself. I will repeat: writer's block has nothing to do with your story. It does, however, have everything to do with you.

I'm all for helping writers get through a loss of productivity, but calling it 'writer's block' is just daft. It advocates that you're not making progress, when you are, as long as you're still working at the story. Think of things as stationary and they'll more likely stay that way. 

It's advocations like this:



> Telling a person who has writers block, not to have writers block, is like telling a person who stutters, not to stutter.



that are what drive many writers to believe that writer's block is out of their control. But as Kyle has explained, all the symptoms of 'writer's block' are created by malpractice of the writer. It should be those malpractices, and not some mystical 'block', that the conversation focuses on.

I don't dismiss people who claim to have it; I immediate ignore the fact they 'have it' and start to talk about their story, because that's what matters. Thus, the fact that they have 'writer's block' bears no importance to me.


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## Bruno Spatola (Dec 22, 2014)

It's only the term itself that annoys me. I prefer to think of it as a simple creative lull, rather than an actual blockage you 'suffer' from, as if it's a medical syndrome. It is a real thing, obviously (the experience). Sometimes, some artists have trouble expressing themselves. That's not a belief, that's a fact, and I would strongly encourage talking about how tough you're finding a particular story or scene or line, or whatever, to the peers of your craft. I'm saddened whenever that practice is discouraged, but there are naysayers of everything. Some are more hands-on in their problem solving. No time for excuses or looking for answers: just write! They are right, though.

What I _wouldn't_ like to hear myself saying is, "Urgh, I have writer's block. How can I alleviate it?" The answer I come to is always the same: By reading more, and, eventually, writing yourself out of it. When it becomes a crushing chore to do what normally comes naturally to you, I think you need a break, or a new project.

Without in-depth studies being carried out, I can't have a strong opinion about the existence of it in an objective way, but to tell people it's not real is just as unwise. To me, anyway.


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## Bishop (Dec 22, 2014)

I don't have writer's block. I'm just on an xbox-themed hiatus.


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## Jeko (Dec 22, 2014)

> I knew someone who had depression and their husband didn't understand it. He had never had it. He said she was just "sad" and the feelings would go away.



Depression is a good parallel to this, actually. There is a widespread belief that depression is caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain, which many drug companies use to sell their 'cures' for it. Yet, there is absolutely no evidence or research that supports this claim. These is, however, billions worth of industry built upon it.


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## Kyle R (Dec 22, 2014)

No two writers are the same. Sometimes the problem is a common one—with a common solution. Other times it's a more unique one.

Michael Arndt, for example, (award-winning screenwriter) was hired to write the screenplay for _Toy Story 3_ after his breakout success with his debut screenplay, _Little Miss Sunshine_, (which he drafted, impressively, in less than three days). 

A proven quick and successful writer, Arndt found himself faced with a weighty proposition—writing the final film in a multimillion dollar franchise. He struggled. He feared the blank page. He feared disappointing the fans. Nothing he could come up with seemed good enough. He describe it as "several months of sort of floundering around and going in circles."

Eventually, he solved his problem—but not by writing. He solved it by _stopping_ his writing, and by going to other films and studying them, to figure out what he was doing wrong and what he needed to do instead.

My point is that, while some of us might not call what he experienced "writer's block," to Michael Arndt, it was. He was blocked. He had to figure out a way to overcome it.

The key (in my opinion) is to acknowledge that, for many writers, writer's block _does_ exist. Whether it's self-inflicted or not, or whether or not it fits our individual definition of it, it exists all the same.

Some writers are fortunate enough to not have to deal with it. Or, they're fortunate enough to have found their own personal solution. But just like writing itself, I believe it's an individual thing, and the symptoms (and solutions) can vary from writer to writer.

One size does not fit all. Nor does one definition.

Just my own perspective on it. :encouragement:


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## Jeko (Dec 22, 2014)

> He was blocked. He had to figure out a way to overcome it.



This highlights the difference in opinion; I wouldn't say he was blocked. I would say that he was developing his story, and a lot of his ideas weren't coming together. Nothing was stopping him from working on his story because he was always working on it, whether he was trying to get the story together or looking at other stories for guidance. 

That's what writer's do - calling it a block is like saying a builder's blocked because he has to gather materials. Gathering materials is part of their job; working through difficulties in your story and difficult times is part of the writer's job. Arndt was always doing his job; a writer who says they have 'writer's block', however, often uses it as an excuse to stop doing their job.

From what I've heard, the variations of writer's block are so broad that the term seems to encompass every difficulty a writer can face, with the proviso that the writer thinks it's not their fault. That's not something I want to support; it's something I want to break people away from.


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## Kyle R (Dec 22, 2014)

I think it all depends on personal experience. I've experienced writer's block enough to know that, for me, it's a real phenomenon.

It might not be for some others. That's one of the wonderful things about writing. Everyone works differently.

When someone complains about writer's block, there seems to be two camps of people who respond: those who believe they've suffered from it as well, and those who believe there is no such thing. I fall into the former category. 

And while I can't offer solutions to everyone, I _can_ say is what has worked for me.

For me, two things seem to help:



Writing a "throwaway piece" sometimes helps. A story written, with no expectations, just to prove to myself that I can still write without putting so much pressure on myself.
Accepting "sub-par" writing sometimes helps, too. Intentionally pushing ahead with the goal of writing low-quality prose, just to reach "THE END." This way, when I _do_ want to switch on my "perfectionist button," I can apply that side of me to a finished draft, rather than to a blank page.

:encouragement:


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## shadowwalker (Dec 22, 2014)

Cadence said:


> Depression is a good parallel to this, actually. There is a widespread belief that depression is caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain, which many drug companies use to sell their 'cures' for it. Yet, there is absolutely no evidence or research that supports this claim. These is, however, billions worth of industry built upon it.



I don't know where you got this, but there are definitely chemical changes in the brain which cause depression. It is a _medical problem_, whereas writer's block is nothing more than someone convincing themselves they cannot write. So no, it is _not _a good parallel.


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## Jeko (Dec 22, 2014)

> I don't know where you got this, but there are definitely chemical changes in the brain which cause depression. It is a _medical problem, whereas writer's block is nothing more than someone convincing themselves they cannot write. So no, it is not a good parallel._



Good articles on the subject:

http://chriskresser.com/the-chemical-imbalance-myth
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/281830.php

I remember doing research into this some time ago. Like I said, it's a commonly believed myth.


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## FleshEater (Dec 22, 2014)

shadowwalker said:


> I don't know where you got this, but there are definitely chemical changes in the brain which cause depression. It is a _medical problem_, *whereas writer's block is nothing more than someone convincing themselves they cannot write*. So no, it is _not _a good parallel.



The highlighted is a misconception in my opinion. Sometimes, no matter how hard one tries, an idea will not transpire into anything. And sometimes the well is very, very dry. It isn't convincing oneself they cannot write, it's simply a lack of ideas. I've been there. My mind shuts off, and I cannot, for the life of me, think of one single idea to write about. It just isn't there. And the only thing that let's it begin it's evolution from an idea into a story is time away from writing, and a clear head. That is, in my personal experience.


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## Sunny (Dec 22, 2014)

Cadence said:


> Depression is a good parallel to this, actually. There is a widespread belief that depression is caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain, which many drug companies use to sell their 'cures' for it. Yet, there is absolutely no evidence or research that supports this claim. These is, however, billions worth of industry built upon it.



I'm sorry Cadence, but I did not know that you were an MD! 8-[


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## Kyle R (Dec 22, 2014)

Cadence said:


> Good articles on the subject:
> 
> http://chriskresser.com/the-chemical-imbalance-myth
> http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/281830.php
> ...



Probably best to save discussions (or debates) about medical conditions for another thread. Or, another forum. :encouragement:



FleshEater said:


> The highlighted is a misconception in my opinion. Sometimes, no matter how hard one tries, an idea will not transpire into anything. And sometimes the well is very, very dry. It isn't convincing oneself they cannot write, it's simply a lack of ideas. I've been there. My mind shuts off, and I cannot, for the life of me, think of one single idea to write about. It just isn't there. And the only thing that let's it begin it's evolution from an idea into a story is time away from writing, and a clear head. That is, in my personal experience.



I've noticed the same! Specifically, I've found that not getting enough sleep is one thing that definitely hampers my writing abilities. It leaves me in a creative fog, unable to think of much at all. :grief:


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## shadowwalker (Dec 22, 2014)

The thing about writer's block that I see, over and over, is that people can describe in great detail the circumstances surrounding this block - and without fail, it boils down to one of two things: stressful physical/real life conditions that they _have _to deal with (physical illnesses, job, family, etc), or not being able to write because some ideal is not being met. Hell, I've seen writers claim WB because they didn't have a computer they were used to! No ideas to write about? Look out the window! There are a million things to choose from - it just takes more work to come up with the words. How much credence do you think teachers and bosses would give to "I don't have that report because my mind went blank" or "My muse just walked out on me"?


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## Kyle R (Dec 22, 2014)

shadowwalker said:


> not being able to write because some ideal is not being met.


Definitely something that I struggle with!

It's a constant battle—one that didn't exist until I made it my goal to be a career writer. :-k


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## Jeko (Dec 22, 2014)

> Sometimes, no matter how hard one tries, an idea will not transpire into anything. And sometimes the well is very, very dry. It isn't convincing oneself they cannot write, it's simply a lack of ideas.



Again, that's not writer's block; that's stage one of the writing process: getting ideas. What good is there complaining about a roadblock when you don't have any fuel?



> Probably best to save discussions (or debates) about medical conditions for another thread. Or, another forum. :encouragement:



Indeed; I just wanted to raise the issue that current scientific research is doing a similar dispute over the cases of depression as we are disputing the causes of 'writer's block'. 



> stressful physical/real life conditions that they _have to deal with (physical illnesses, job, family, etc), or not being able to write because some ideal is not being met_



This furthers my point that writer's block has nothing to do with the story and everything to do with the writer. It's therefore self-centred, and I've never found being self-centred beneficial to the craft. How can you be concerned for your characters if you're primarily concerned with yourself?


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## shadowwalker (Dec 22, 2014)

Cadence said:


> This furthers my point that writer's block has nothing to do with the story and everything to do with the writer. It's therefore self-centred, and I've never found being self-centred beneficial to the craft. How can you be concerned for your characters if you're primarily concerned with yourself?



I wouldn't necessarily say that real life issues are so much self-centered as required to be dealt with. Someone who is dealing with an elderly parent's issues in a nursing home is not not writing because of self-centeredness; one can hardly put off talking about medical decisions in favor of writing the next chapter. Likewise, if one has the flu and is spending their time in the bathroom, it's not really conducive to writing. There are, in other words, real life issues that have to be put ahead of writing, and that can be so stressful as to interfere with it. However, once those _crises _are over, there should be no reason not to write again.

- - - Updated - - -



Cadence said:


> Indeed; I just wanted to raise the issue that current scientific research is doing a similar dispute over the cases of depression as we are disputing the causes of 'writer's block'.



The dispute is not similar - one is talking about a claimed malady, the other about treatment of a recognized medical condition. I just wanted to be clear on that point.


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## Jeko (Dec 22, 2014)

> I wouldn't necessarily say that real life issues are so much self-centered as required to be dealt with. Someone who is dealing with an elderly parent's issues in a nursing home is not not writing because of self-centeredness; one can hardly put off talking about medical decisions in favor of writing the next chapter. Likewise, if one has the flu and is spending their time in the bathroom, it's not really conducive to writing. There are, in other words, real life issues that have to be put ahead of writing, and that can be so stressful as to interfere with it. However, once those _crises are over, there should be no reason not to write again._



Sorry, I over-quoted. I was only responding to the latter issue of an 'ideal' not being met.


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## FleshEater (Dec 23, 2014)

shadowwalker said:


> The thing about writer's block that I see, over and over, is that people can describe in great detail the circumstances surrounding this block - and without fail, it boils down to one of two things: stressful physical/real life conditions that they _have _to deal with (physical illnesses, job, family, etc), or not being able to write because some ideal is not being met. Hell, I've seen writers claim WB because they didn't have a computer they were used to! No ideas to write about? Look out the window! There are a million things to choose from - it just takes more work to come up with the words. How much credence do you think teachers and bosses would give to "I don't have that report because my mind went blank" or "My muse just walked out on me"?



There are a million ideas, but that doesn't mean they all will transpire into a story. 



Cadence said:


> Again, that's not writer's block; that's stage one of the writing process: getting ideas. What good is there complaining about a roadblock when you don't have any fuel?



I'm not sure you understand how this works. When your mind shuts down, there are no ideas. Imagine staring at a black piece of paper; that's all it is. And no matter how hard one tries, an idea will not formulate. 

If you've never been there, then you really have no idea what it's like to stare into an empty well.

I'll be stepping away from this conversation now. This is one of those topics like religion; everyone who has an opinion is right.


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## shadowwalker (Dec 23, 2014)

Staring at a blank sheet of paper is not looking for ideas; that's sitting there waiting for your "muse" to strike. As I said, look out the window and you'll see a million ideas. Will they all make a story? They may not all make a novel, or even a short story - I guarantee any writer can make them into at least a page of description or dialogue. And at some point, one of those ideas or one of those short pieces will generate a full-blown story.


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## Jeko (Dec 23, 2014)

> I'm not sure you understand how this works. When your mind shuts down, there are no ideas. Imagine staring at a black piece of paper; that's all it is. And no matter how hard one tries, an idea will not formulate.
> 
> If you've never been there, then you really have no idea what it's like to stare into an empty well.



Again, I have been there. The solution for me was to stop staring at the blank sheet of paper. What use is gazing into an abyss? Instead, I looked for ideas around my neighbourhood with reckless abandon, taking in anything I saw as remotely interesting.  Ideas do not 'formulate' - you don't make them. You find them and put them together and make stuff out of them.


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## Kyle R (Dec 23, 2014)

Everyone's different. I believe everyone's brain works differently, too.

Some people are able to be creative on a whim. Some are able to force creativity through effort. Some simply need to wait for inspiration to strike.

I, personally, believe that the more you force your own creativity, the more accessible your creativity becomes.

However, I also recognize that this belief is based only on my own experiences. My brain is not the same as someone else's brain—so what works for me might not work for another.

I see this with plotting and pantsing. A lot of pantsers talk about how their story begins to grow a mind of its own and go off in new directions. For them, an outline might be pointless, because they're probably going to abandon it anyway, so why waste time writing it?

For me, if I write up an outline, that's the story I write. I don't deviate. I may embellish, but I'm always connecting the dots I've pre-planned, no exceptions. But if you give me no outline, no pre-planned direction? I'll have a very difficult time writing.

Does this mean either of us is wrong? I don't think so. I think it means our brains work differently.

So if I start telling someone, "Just force it!" and they say, "I can't! My brain doesn't work that way!", then maybe they are right. There's no conclusive scientific evidence (none that I'm aware of, at least) that says we all think the same. Nor do I think we need to. 

If someone says writer's block exists for them—I believe it. I can offer things that I've done that have helped overcome it, but my solutions might not work for them. That's the tricky part about it. Sometimes the solution is common and simple. Sometimes it's more difficult and unique. :encouragement:


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## bookmasta (Dec 23, 2014)

I believe writing is like most other skills, the more you do it, the more you can become adept at things like plotting and so forth. I'm on eleven novels and counting and I have yet to run into the infamous writer's block, except for in the beginning when I was first starting out.


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## shadowwalker (Dec 23, 2014)

I don't believe it's really a matter of forcing creativity. It's more a matter of forcing relaxation. An idea just won't come, so the writer starts worrying about WB; the more they worry about it, the more convinced they become they have it, the harder it is to come up with ideas. If they would step back, take a deep breath, and relax, play with writing instead of acting as if it were life or death, they would be able to write. It's giving themselves permission to just write. This is why I say WB is self-inflicted. Writers just get too involved with not being "able" to write.


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## Kyle R (Dec 23, 2014)

shadowwalker said:


> This is why I say WB is self-inflicted. Writers just get too involved with not being "able" to write.



I agree that it's self-inflicted. Who else would inflict it? The neighbor's cat? 

"Begone, cat! You vile harbinger of writer's block!" :highly_amused:

But calling it self-inflicted doesn't make it any less of a problem, in my opinion. Sometimes, self-inflicted issues are the hardest of all to overcome. Addictions, for instance. Or compulsions. :grief:


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## Jeko (Dec 23, 2014)

> But calling it self-inflicted doesn't make it any less of a problem, in my opinion.



Ah, I see. The main issue I have is with people who _don't_ think it's self-inflicted, as if it's some kind of random curse that just 'happens'. I don't think I can approach their problem if they're thinking of it in that way, so I tell them that the mystical 'writer's block' they're talking about doesn't exist.


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## shadowwalker (Dec 23, 2014)

Kyle R said:


> But calling it self-inflicted doesn't make it any less of a problem, in my opinion. Sometimes, self-inflicted issues are the hardest of all to overcome. Addictions, for instance. Or compulsions. :grief:



Compulsions aren't self-inflicted, but yes, it is like an addiction, at least as far as not taking responsibility for the decision-making. It is, like drugs and alcohol, a problem only if you let become one. And, like drugs and alcohol, the sure-fire way to prevent the problem is not to use to begin with.


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