# How do you identify yourself?



## Plasticweld (Feb 7, 2017)

I was just curious.  Giving it some thought I have told people I was a this or that, kind of based on what I did for a living at the time,  Sometimes it depended on who was asking or the mood I was in. The topic always comes up in any conversation, sometimes it's part of your introduction.  Reading through some of the posts and some of the stories it struck me how many different perspective there where.  I figured some of that had to be from how we viewed ourselves...so if you only got one word, or even a short sentence, how do you describe yourself and how many different answers have there been over the years.


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## wulfAlpha (Feb 7, 2017)

This is very interesting. I often think about how people identify themselves to others. It says a lot about someone, how they feel about themselves. I guess my answer to this question would be either thoughtful wordnerd or curious techie, depending on what hat i'm wearing that day


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## sas (Feb 7, 2017)

Sinatra sang it best: I've been a puppet, a pauper, a pirate, a poet, a pawn and a king (queen).

"That's life"....if you're lucky enough to experience it all.

When I see former business friends, usually over the bodies of old friends, they ask what I do. I tell them I turned into a poet. I concur, "I can't believe it either." I hope my children and grandchildren live long enough to surprise themselves. 

sas


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## aj47 (Feb 7, 2017)

Right now, as I'm seeking employment, I identify as a programmer.  A wise man (okay, astroandy, but it's been quoted to the point that it's lost its attribution in some places) once said, "All programs are poems but not all programmers are poets."


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## ppsage (Feb 7, 2017)

When I'm fighting on social media, I identify myself as a reader of history and archaeology.


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## Miseo (Feb 7, 2017)

I generally just identify myself with my name. Won't say more unless people start asking.


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## Plasticweld (Feb 7, 2017)

Miseo said:


> I generally just identify myself with my name. Won't say more unless people start asking.



When you think about it we are writers who are supposed to inquisitive by nature.  Being an extrovert I often look at someone and imagine who and what they are.  I then in an innocuous manner try to find out more about them.  This afternoon while standing line to pay my bill for gas I noticed that the guy in front of me had freshly shined shoes, _something you don't see anymore_.  His cloths while a little out of style were clean and pressed, prim but not proper.  I casually mentioned this to him and asked what he did. I told him that there was something about him that really made him stand out and that I was just curious.  Now he could have just blown me off, thought of me as some kind of kook... but no he told me he was an attorney.  I had said something about the next time I write about a character I am going to mention that he has freshly shined shoes.  


The guys face lite right up when I mentioned writing.  He said he also like to write, we exchanged business cards and in just a very brief moment I made a new friend.   I had no idea how he identified himself when I looked at him, but I did find out which word "he" chose


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## Miseo (Feb 7, 2017)

Plasticweld said:


> When you think about it we are writers who are supposed to inquisitive by nature.  Being an extrovert I often look at someone and imagine who and what they are.  I then in an innocuous manner try to find out more about them.  This afternoon while standing line to pay my bill for gas I noticed that the guy in front of me had freshly shined shoes, _something you don't see anymore_.  His cloths while a little out of style were clean and pressed, prim but not proper.  I casually mentioned this to him and asked what he did. I told him that there was something about him that really made him stand out and that I was just curious.  Now he could have just blown me off, thought of me as some kind of kook... but no he told me he was an attorney.  I had said something about the next time I write about a character I am going to mention that he has freshly shined shoes.
> 
> 
> The guys face lite right up when I mentioned writing.  He said he also like to write, we exchanged business cards and in just a very brief moment I made a new friend.   I had no idea how he identified himself when I looked at him, but I did find out which word "he" chose


That's pretty neat.


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## bree1433 (Feb 7, 2017)

Depends on who I am with. Mainly I just say my name and as questions come up I answer. One thing that always turns heads is when I say I am a Social Worker. Generally I get one of two reactions: the sympathetic "I could never do your job", and "I'm sorry" in the tone of 'why would you voluntarily choice to have a career like that'. I enjoy all the reactions though; it generally gives me an idea on who the person I am talking with is like.


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## wulfAlpha (Feb 7, 2017)

bree1433 said:


> Depends on who I am with. Mainly I just say my name and as questions come up I answer. One thing that always turns heads is when I say I am a Social Worker. Generally I get one of two reactions: the sympathetic "I could never do your job", and "I'm sorry" in the tone of 'why would you voluntarily choice to have a career like that'. I enjoy all the reactions though; it generally gives me an idea on who the person I am talking with is like.



You'd get the same reaction from me that I give to anyone who does what I think of as the really important jobs like teachers. You do good work and I wish you luck. Also stay safe!
You do make a good point.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## bree1433 (Feb 7, 2017)

wulfAlpha said:


> You'd get the same reaction from me that I give to anyone who does what I think of as the really important jobs like teachers. You do good work and I wish you luck. Also stay safe!
> You do make a good point.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Thank you! I always appreciate those reactions!


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## bdcharles (Feb 8, 2017)

I wouldn't.  I like the idea of not identifying myself. Saying what I do for a living just ... I dunno, I just can't imagine why anyone would be interested. People then would react to me based on what I say, how I behave. Strips away the abstraction sort of thing.

That said, I do get some funny looks when I tell people I'm a unicorn trainer. Perhaps it's an immoral profession?


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## Thaumiel (Feb 8, 2017)

"Unemployed"  


It's been about seven months since I left higher education, eight if you count the month I spent post-exams waiting to find out my marks, and it's becoming the only thing I'd use to describe myself as.


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## Ariel (Feb 9, 2017)

I never know how to answer this sort of question. What I do isn't as important as who I am and answering the latter with the former is stupid.

Besides slapping a label on a person and calling that "defining them" is severely limiting and, frankly, insulting.

James, you'll find something.  I know you will.


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## JustRob (Feb 9, 2017)

I often claim to be a mathematician, logician or problem solver, but really I'm just Rob. Whatever I am certainly isn't much physically, so I must be mental, but you may think that that's self-evident.



astroannie said:


> Right now, as I'm seeking employment, I identify as a programmer.  A wise man (okay, astroandy, but it's been quoted to the point that it's lost its attribution in some places) once said, "All programs are poems but not all programmers are poets."



I can relate to that. The head of mathematics at my school told us that it isn't being able to prove something that matters but being able to do it elegantly. For him mathematics was his art. Also, in the field of programming, when I had been working on the very first computer bought by my employers in the 1960s the company deputy manager, who had been responsible for creating the entire computerisation project, was about to retire and came to see me. He said with a beaming smile on his face "We made that computer s_ing,_ didn't we?" and I knew just what he meant. That's why I am trying to build a replica of that machine now, because I can still get pleasure from doing that.


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## sas (Feb 9, 2017)

James 剣 斧 血 said:


> "Unemployed"
> 
> 
> It's been about seven months since I left higher education, eight if you count the month I spent post-exams waiting to find out my marks, and it's becoming the only thing I'd use to describe myself as.




James,  
I prefer to identify you as a "Seeker"; hope you do ,too.  Best. Sas

.


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## PiP (Feb 9, 2017)

Plasticweld said:


> .  I figured some of that had to be from how we viewed ourselves...so if you only got one word, or even a short sentence, how do you describe yourself and how many different answers have there been over the years.



It does not matter how you earn a crust what matters is attitude.

Me, if asked I would say self-motivated. Positive. Proactive rather than reactive. I would tag the person in more general terms not label them with a job title. You can move mountains with the right outlook on life.

On the other end of the scale you have the whiners and negative sappers.


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## Terry D (Feb 9, 2017)

To paraphrase Shakespeare: 'All men are three men; the man they think themselves to be, the man others perceive them to be, and the man they truly are.' If I were restricted to just one word to describe myself it would be, 'complicated'. That's a cop-out though, because everyone is complicated. Am I what I do for a living? That would make me 'the safety guy' at work (up until a year, or so ago it would have been, 'the continuous improvement guy'). Am I what my passions are? That would make me a father-husband-writer-reader-photographer-astronomer-dog lover-etc-etc-etc. I think what I really am is a combination of all those things, and probably more than I can think of.


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## wulfAlpha (Feb 9, 2017)

Terry D said:


> To paraphrase Shakespeare: 'All men are three men; the man they think themselves to be, the man others perceive them to be, and the man they truly are.' If I were restricted to just one word to describe myself it would be, 'complicated'. That's a cop-out though, because everyone is complicated. Am I what I do for a living? That would make me 'the safety guy' at work (up until a year, or so ago it would have been, 'the continuous improvement guy'). Am I what my passions are? That would make me a father-husband-writer-reader-photographer-astronomer-dog lover-etc-etc-etc. I think what I really am is a combination of all those things, and probably more than I can think of.



Well put. Shakespeare wrote a lot of great things. I didn't remember that particular one and I'll have to find it and refresh my memory of it. Also who a person is changes over time. Who they are at the core stays the same but they grow more complex over time. Who you are evolves from one moment to the next which is why stereotypes and tropes can be harmful if used in the wrong way. People don't fit neatly into little boxes no matter how hard we try to fit them in.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Terry D (Feb 9, 2017)

wulfAlpha said:


> Well put. Shakespeare wrote a lot of great things. I didn't remember that particular one and I'll have to find it and refresh my memory of it.



Upon further review -- I think the line is actually a quote from a movie, _The Naked Jungle_.





> People don't fit neatly into little boxes no matter how hard we try to fit them in.



Well, they can if you use a car-crusher.


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## Plasticweld (Feb 9, 2017)

Interesting what some of the answers are.   I did not use the word label when I asked for someone to describe themselves, only a word.  The real answer was of course that there is no single answer or description or even a single word.  

 I did get... and this was what I was looking for, is the far more complicated answer which many of you provided.  I have been interviewing people for a series of articles and found that the best answers are those that require and explanation.  Many here gave a lot of information about themselves in an effort to make sure they were not labeled with a single word or a familiar stereotype.  I am trying to learn the art of getting information  by not asking a question that can be answered in a single word or sentence, but one that provides a wealth of information and insight into who they are. 


Some of you provided a real insight into who you are, others provided insight into who you are not.   Wulfalpha, Miseo  participated but did not give an answer.  It is very interesting the way people responded.


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## PiP (Feb 9, 2017)

Plasticweld said:


> It is very interesting the way people responded.



Be careful what you wish for


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## Pennywise Purple (Feb 21, 2017)

In terms of Occupation: Just student looking for work
In terms of nationally/ethnicity: Thai/Swedish Australian
In terms of sexuality: Bi sexual and leaning towards men

I didn't know which 'identify' context you meant, so I just put those in.


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## Sam (Feb 21, 2017)

"Here was the new generation, shouting the old cries, learning the old creeds, through a revery of long days and nights; destined finally to go out into that dirty gray turmoil to follow love and pride; a new generation dedicated more than the last to the fear of poverty and the worship of success; grown up to find all Gods dead, all wars fought, all faiths in man shaken". 
~ _This Side of Paradise, _F. Scott Fitzgerald. 

This quote, spoken by Amory Blaine in the above-mentioned novel, resonates with me probably more than any other I've ever read. 

It describes a state of being that exists in the world, where happiness is derived from success, and success is derived from how much money one possesses, so that happiness eventually becomes an admixture of wealth and money, both of which are often conflated to mean the same thing. 

Many years ago, wealth meant "well-being". If you described yourself as being wealthy, you in fact meant that you were well. It's only been in the last hundred years that wealth became synonymous with money. 

What has this to do with how I identify myself? Well, I try (and mostly fail) to be an ascetic person. I try not to put the pursuit of money above all other things, though it is becoming increasingly difficult to survive in this world without it. I am not a miser, but I am frugal, and I do not subscribe to the idea that one should work until they're sixty-five or seventy (a few years ago, I attended the funeral of a man who died of cancer six months after retiring). 

Sadly, the world operates primarily on little sheets of paper that give the illusion of having value. I don't like it, but I can't do anything about it, except on my side of things, but I'm always reminded of the Will Smith quote: 

"People spend money they haven't earned, to buy things they don't need, to impress people they don't like". 

I guess, therefore, I identify as being weird.


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## RhythmOvPain (Feb 21, 2017)

Troll; asshole; alcoholic pothead genius; literary and musical virtuoso; anti-social; the man whose life is devoted to proving that religion (and theology as a whole) in all its forms are utter, chilish bullshit.

I might could go on, but this is a good representation.

Technically, since I do have a daughter, I could add father to that list, but we were never really a family, so...


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## J Anfinson (Feb 21, 2017)

I'm a peaceful guy who would rather be fishing, reading a book, or taking a nap in a hammock than running the rat race most of society seems to enjoy. I'm happy to sit in my little corner and mind my own business while pursuing my interests.


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## escorial (Feb 21, 2017)

I reckon how people see themselves is not how others do...


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## Ariel (Feb 21, 2017)

I guess I'll go ahead and join in.

 I work in a landfill. My official title is "scale master" which sounds way cooler than it is. Basically I operate and care for a giant truck scale and charge people accordingly. It pays well and considering I can also do anything an administrative assistant could plus payroll and minor bookkeeping . . . I deserve the title. 

I, fortunately, have less of the bookkeeping and payroll duties than I had in previous positions and I'm quite happy about that.

I am a poet. I am a jeweler, crafter, and generally creative. 

I, like J, would prefer to be left alone to read or nap in a hammock.

I'm a wife, step-mother, and friend. I enjoy the nerdy stuff including video games, D&D, and terrible sci-if TV shows and novels.


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## Raevenlord (Feb 21, 2017)

Sam said:


> "Here was the new generation, shouting the old cries, learning the old creeds, through a revery of long days and nights; destined finally to go out into that dirty gray turmoil to follow love and pride; a new generation dedicated more than the last to the fear of poverty and the worship of success; grown up to find all Gods dead, all wars fought, all faiths in man shaken".
> ~ _This Side of Paradise, _F. Scott Fitzgerald.
> 
> This quote, spoken by Amory Blaine in the above-mentioned novel, resonates with me probably more than any other I've ever read.
> ...



I have to say that from all of the answers given until now, yours is the one that resonated with me the most. 

I didn't know that quote, but I am glad I stopped by. 

This probably says more about me than anything I could have written.

To add something, I'd say that I am a hater of the meat-compactor society we live in.


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## Plasticweld (Feb 21, 2017)

Sam said:


> "Here was the new generation, shouting the old cries, learning the old creeds, through a revery of long days and nights; destined finally to go out into that dirty gray turmoil to follow love and pride; a new generation dedicated more than the last to the fear of poverty and the worship of success; grown up to find all Gods dead, all wars fought, all faiths in man shaken".
> ~ _This Side of Paradise, _F. Scott Fitzgerald.
> 
> This quote, spoken by Amory Blaine in the above-mentioned novel, resonates with me probably more than any other I've ever read.
> ...




You know Sam, I am going to disagree.  Having been poor, been rich then poor again, and then rich again.   Money is good to have, having more than you need even better.  I have a guy that came to work for me 5 years ago.  He just got out of prison after spending 12 years in jail for a violent crime.  In the beginning he just needed a hand, I was able to help him get started in business.  He failed.  He came to see me to let me know he had done his best and wanted to work off his debt.  I agreed to hire him and take a percentage of his pay to go back to his original debt.   I pay my men well, better than most in the area, I can do this because I am successful not just getting by.  Jason who at one point stopped to thank me for giving him a job so he could pay his bills... He told me that he was thankful to be able to that and that if he could just pay his monthly bills he would be happy.  I told him in no uncertain terms that if that was all he wanted out of life I would fire him right on the spot. 


I told him that in life I expect those that work for me to be the lifeguards for others.  If you can barely swim you cannot jump in and rescue anyone else.  Those in life who are just barely getting by, are never in a position to help someone else.  Today Jason makes a 6 figure salary, he is able to do more than get by. He works long hours, often 7 days a week, he remembers what it was like to be poor and has no intention of going back nor being in the position of being helpless and wondering if he can put food on the table. 


I have been able to people get started in business, loaned money so some could buy their first home, paid off the bank for others so that they would not lose their home.  Helped people buy a car when they didn't have the means but still needed to get to work.   I have given away ten of thousands of dollars to those who needed help.   That ability and that feeling far surpass and bullshit feeling, of just being a simple person with limited needs.  Yes, I have tons of toys and not much time to use them.  But please don't try and tell me that there is nobility in being poor or just getting by. 


You have an abundance of talent when it comes to writing, I notice how free you are with your advice and your talent when helping others here on the forum. You did not hold it to yourself, but spread it around... Some of us are better at making  money than writing, both are talents. And yes your are a writer :}


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## Darkkin (Feb 21, 2017)

Invisible.  I'm a ghost, there and gone, content to remain unseen.


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## Ariel (Feb 21, 2017)

Being frugal and wanting a modest life should not be looked down upon. Money for money's sake means little and so does the toys and all the other bullshit that comes with it. You can't take all that with you and it isn't as though your kids or grandkids are gonna want it.


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## PiP (Feb 21, 2017)

Ariel said:


> Being frugal and wanting a modest life should not be looked down upon. Money for money's sake means little and so does the toys and all the other bullshit that comes with it. You can't take all that with you and it isn't as though your kids or grandkids are gonna want it.



Money gives you freedom of choice. It also keeps the people who build all the ' bullshit toys' employed. 

ETA: it is the monied people who were born with a silver spoon in their mouth that irk me.


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## walker (Feb 21, 2017)

My employment is irregular at the moment, so I don't identify myself in terms of work. Even when I did, it was never satisfying.

The discussion about money is interesting to me. I don't have as much as I'd like at the moment, but I also know money doesn't buy happiness. That doesn't mean money is bad. Not at all! It just means it's not a guarantee. I had a significant other for three years who was wealthy. She was profoundly unhappy in some important ways. The experience had a strong impact on me. Like they say, seeing is believing. The money didn't make her unhappy, but it didn't rescue her either. All else being equal, I'd rather have money. But things like physical and emotional health are far more important.

I have traveled and held lots of different kinds of jobs, mostly blue-collar, but some white-collar. Back in the day, I hitchhiked across the country, more than once. I mostly traveled alone, and those were the days before cell phones. I had interesting, life-changing, and sometimes unsettling experiences. I lived in a foreign county for several years and as a result speak a foreign language more or less fluently. I have a couple of fancy degrees that I earned in my mid-30s to mid-40s. I spent a good chunk of my childhood and young adulthood in a very rural environment, fishing, hunting, and so on. 

I worked on environmental and social justice issues for many years and participated in civil disobedience. I like to tinker with things, like cameras and fishing reels. My wife, my cats, and my extended family, in several different countries, are very important to me. I have issues with substance abuse, but I'm well over two decades sober. Those are the bullet points. There's a lot more.

I like to do things well, but somebody once told me, "Anything worth doing is worth doing poorly." It's a twist on the old saying and sounds like a joke, but if you think about it, it's true.


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## Non Serviam (Feb 21, 2017)

Ahem.  *Takes the stage.*  Hi, I'm Non Serviam, and I am a writer.  At first it was just a little bit of prose here and there, maybe a metaphor or a bit of amphigory, but as time wore on I found I was getting more and more into it.  By the time I was 17 I was a sesquipedalian and addicted to pleonasm, and I've never looked back...

My user name, Non Serviam, tells you a bit about me if you can unpick it.  It's Latin.  People who know that it's Latin but don't understand it tend to call me "Non Servium", which I never correct, because there are some kinds of ignorance I delight in.  (I'm afraid I'm not actually a very nice person.  Sorry about that.)

People who know a little Latin know it means _I will not serve. _Those people tend to think of that in terms of having a problem with authority, which I don't deny.  Those who're a bit better read might catch the reference: It's what Satan said when he cursed God and leapt into the Abyss.  

I'm an atheist and an anarchist, but I don't mean what you probably think I mean by either of those words.  

"Atheist" means I am personally quite satisfied that there is no God, for any meaning of the word "God" that I find intelligible.  But I would like to apologise to everyone who does believe in God for Richard Dawkins and his little gang.  And I mean that wholeheartedly and very sincerely.  If you choose to believe in God, then that doesn't hurt me at all.  It may inspire you to be a better person, to give to charity or feed the hungry or shelter the homeless, in which case I'm very glad that you do believe in God.  I do not blame religious people for the cruelty to gays in the US Bible Belt, or the destruction of the World Trade Towers -- and for exactly the same reason, I do not expect religious people to blame me for the atrocities of atheists like Stalin or Mao Tse Tung.

I say I'm an "anarchist" because people think they know what that means, even though they mostly don't (even if they aren't confusing it with iconoclasm grounded in 1970s punk rock music).  If you actually do know anything about political philosophy, then I'm a mutualist of the Proudhon school.

I write offbeat stories, oddball scripts, and (rather more successfully) non-fiction.  I'm published mainly as a non-fiction author, although there are a few of my short stories floating around the interweb as well.  I'm also a guitarist, bassist, drummer and composer who writes and plays some dark and rather unconventional rock music.  I'm perpetually looking for a singer/lyricist to collaborate with, but I can never find someone with the right voice who has enough to say.  (_Extremely_ talented people, only, are invited to PM me about that.)

I can't write poetry or lyrics.  I am to poetry what a tone-deaf person is to music, or a colour-blind person to painting.  I have this terrible affliction where I genuinely can't tell the difference between immortal verse and horrible doggerel.

I made my account on this site more than ten years ago, and I went away when Baron took over.  I was a mod here when he was a member, and I -- well, it's graceless to speak ill of the dead.  Let's just say, I know he was popular here, but I knew another side of him and I wasn't a fan.

Oh.  Yes.  I am not my job title.  I'm not my house, or the car I drive.  I am not my income, or my marital status, or any of that nonsense.  It doesn't matter on a writing site.  I could be an octopus, typing with my tentacles from my fishtank, and it wouldn't matter to you -- either I can help you with your writing or I can't, and that's the only important thing about a mentor.  But if anyone cares, I'm 46 next week; male; British; comfortably well off; I've been married to the same lady for more years than I care to think about; we have a son who's at university in Cambridge at the moment; and I work for a local authority doing things that are almost totally unlike what Americans understand by the word "Social Worker" (my experience is mainly around safeguarding investigations into adult abuse, working with young offenders and drug and alcohol users, and all those other fun things).  My real life is hectic and depressing in roughly equal quantities and I have a pitch black sense of humour.


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## Bard_Daniel (Feb 21, 2017)

I like to think of myself as a drifting dreamer, content to go with where the tide takes me.

For what that's worth.


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## Sam (Feb 21, 2017)

Plasticweld said:


> You know Sam, I am going to disagree.  Having been poor, been rich then poor again, and then rich again.   Money is good to have, having more than you need even better.  I have a guy that came to work for me 5 years ago.  He just got out of prison after spending 12 years in jail for a violent crime.  In the beginning he just needed a hand, I was able to help him get started in business.  He failed.  He came to see me to let me know he had done his best and wanted to work off his debt.  I agreed to hire him and take a percentage of his pay to go back to his original debt.   I pay my men well, better than most in the area, I can do this because I am successful not just getting by.  Jason who at one point stopped to thank me for giving him a job so he could pay his bills... He told me that he was thankful to be able to that and that if he could just pay his monthly bills he would be happy.  I told him in no uncertain terms that if that was all he wanted out of life I would fire him right on the spot.



There are many people in this world, Bob, who perform menial labour on a daily basis and for whom the prospect of promotion, or even a better life, will forever remain just beyond their grasp. For instance, my binman has been doing that job since he left school. He retires in three years. But he has succeeded in providing for his family and putting his two kids through university. Should he be fired because he was content to be a binman (trash collector) his entire life? And while you're thinking on that, were he and everyone else to take your approach and seek something better, who then would remove the refuse that you and every other person on the planet dumps into bins (trashcans)? 

For every job that pays an exorbitant salary, there is another one that pays a pittance. Yet, as I just demonstrated, many of those jobs are as essential as any other. Someone has to fill that position, or people like you would end up with refuse strewn about your manicured lawn. I don't say that to denigrate you as a person, but to suggest that you have blinders on to the reality that someone has to come and clear away the crap that you and everyone else on this planet creates daily. 

I worked as a plumber for many years. I took home a normal week's wage, but I did jobs that were not very appealing: excavating around a sewer pipe and cleaning a blockage with my hands; removing and replacing sanitaryware from houses; trudging through cold and dirty water in a basement that flooded; having to dive underwater in the same basement in order to find the stopcock; fixing a leak in an attic with no flooring, fibreglass insulation, and exposed joists where one misstep would send me plummeting through the plasterboard ceiling. 

Guess what? Someone had to do it. Should I have been fired because I was content in that job? 




> I told him that in life I expect those that work for me to be the lifeguards for others.  If you can barely swim you cannot jump in and rescue anyone else.  Those in life who are just barely getting by, are never in a position to help someone else.



And they should what -- be condemned for it? 

I know a single mother with four kids and whose boyfriend walked out on her. She's working a 40-hour week in a supermarket, struggling to get by, and dealing with her eldest son's diabetes. She hasn't got enough money to help herself, she hasn't time to go back to university, and she has tried to get a good job for some time now. But she's surviving. 

But she doesn't give anything to anyone. Apparently that makes her a horrible person. 




> I have been able to people get started in business, loaned money so some could buy their first home, paid off the bank for others so that they would not lose their home.  Helped people buy a car when they didn't have the means but still needed to get to work.   I have given away ten of thousands of dollars to those who needed help.   That ability and that feeling far surpass and bullshit feeling, of just being a simple person with limited needs.  Yes, I have tons of toys and not much time to use them.  But please don't try and tell me that there is nobility in being poor or just getting by.



Point me to the place in any of my posts where I have eulogised, romanticised, or nobilised poverty. 

Seriously. Back it up or withdraw it. 



> You have an abundance of talent when it comes to writing, I notice how free you are with your advice and your talent when helping others here on the forum. You did not hold it to yourself, but spread it around... Some of us are better at making  money than writing, both are talents. And yes your are a writer :}



Yes, I am a writer, and I believe in helping those who are now where I once was, but I place no value in possessing more money than I know what to do with. I am content to have what I need to survive, some tucked away for a rainy day, and enough to not worry about where my next loaf of bread is coming from. Beyond that, I don't give a s**t about money. You may call me naive if you so wish, or even call me fake, but I truly do not need to possess large quantities of money that I will be inclined to spend on items I don't want or require with any great necessity. 

To that point, if I _need_ something and it costs a good deal of money, I will purchase it. The desk I'm sitting at right now will pay homage to that. On it sits a large television, a laptop that I'm currently typing on, a very powerful PC that cost quite a lot, and a home entertainment system. I had no issue spending money on those products, for I needed them, but I won't replace my TV or mobile phone or car every year because a new model hits the market. I have a seven-year-old Toyota that still gets me from A to B with a minimum of fuss. The diesel is relatively inexpensive; the insurance and tax equally so. 

I tutor students in English and creative writing and I make enough to get by. Sure, I could take on one hundred more students and work seven days a week and make enough to be considered well-to-do, but I don't feel the need to. There is no amount of money in the world that can ever buy health and happiness. 

In closing, the words of the Dalai Lama come to mind: 

"Man sacrifices his health in order to make money; and then he sacrifices his money in order to recuperate his health. Then, he becomes so anxious about the future that he refuses to live in the present, the result being that he doesn't live in either the present or the future. He lives as if he's never going to die, and he dies having never really lived".


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## Plasticweld (Feb 21, 2017)

Sam thanks for such a thoughtful answer.


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## moderan (Feb 21, 2017)

I'm a writer/musician/artist/disabled-American. Animal lover, left-wing atheist leaning to agnosticism, politics junkie, information addict, specfic fan, baseball aficionado, outgoing introvert. Single now, not looking to change. 

NS says:





> I'm also a guitarist, bassist, drummer and composer who writes and plays  some dark and rather unconventional rock music.  I'm perpetually  looking for a singer/lyricist to collaborate with, but I can never find  someone with the right voice who has enough to say.


Likewise...I didn't know those things about you. I can write lyrics and sing if I am forced to. Link?


> I made my account on this site more than ten years ago, and I went away  when Baron took over.  I was a mod here when he was a member, and I --  well, it's graceless to speak ill of the dead.  Let's just say, I know  he was popular here, but I knew another side of him and I wasn't a fan.


That is exactly why I became a mod. And why I eventually un-became one. I fought the good fight for a long time.


Sam says:





> "Man sacrifices his health in order to make money; and then he  sacrifices his money in order to recuperate his health. Then, he becomes  so anxious about the future that he refuses to live in the present, the  result being that he doesn't live in either the present or the future.  He lives as if he's never going to die, and he dies having never really  lived".


How very true that is.


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## Phil Istine (Feb 22, 2017)

Ariel said:


> I guess I'll go ahead and join in.
> 
> I work in a landfill. My official title is "scale master" which sounds way cooler than it is. Basically I operate and care for a giant truck scale and charge people accordingly. It pays well and considering I can also do anything an administrative assistant could plus payroll and minor bookkeeping . . . I deserve the title.
> 
> ...



"Scale master" makes you sound like a musician 

I'm all sorts really - so many things at the moment that it's threatening to overwhelm me.
I'm the nearest-thing-he's-ever-had-to-a-father-even-though-I've-never-lived-with-his-mother (since very early in life), a carer, a debtor, a reader, a writer, a general dogsbody (I'm sure that could be a good name for a character in the army), a fighter (not physically - unless I really had to), a social chameleon (but not a bullshitter), a recoverer from both imposed and self-inflicted abuse.  I could also say I'm a record keeper, businessman and hard worker.

The funny thing is that the one that would get the most reaction is when I might say that I'm a window cleaner.  I get nods of sympathy and they say something like, "Oh! That's OK," while really meaning _Poor sod, doing a dirty job for a pittance._  The reality is that I probably would hate to do their job in exchange 

I once went to a party and, for a laugh, pretended I was a doctor - and made a great job of carrying it off.  The different way people treated me was quite illuminating.


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## Ariel (Feb 22, 2017)

I get what you mean, Phil.  The reaction of my workshop group when they found out I work at a landfill was very funny and frustrating. I have had people actually try to sniff me to see what I smell
like.

I work in the office and it's a "clean" landfill anyway.


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## Deleted member 56686 (Feb 22, 2017)

I guess I'll chime in while I stop by (still in process of moving). I guess for me, I merely want to be happy. The only material things I want would be the roof over my head, a working computer, books, and access to music. And intellectual stimulation; other than that, I don't need much.

I would want to see more harmony in the world where we accept differing opinions (and I'm not referring to the OP; We have always had a mutual respect for our positions). I think people get hung up on things they can't control. Me, I prefer to live and let live. 

See you for real in a few days.


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## Non Serviam (Feb 22, 2017)

moderan said:


> Link?



Well, I haven't inflicted very many of my musical efforts on the internet as yet, because I can't imagine who would want to listen to them without vocals or lyrics.  But I've got hours and hours of stuff I can send by email.  (PM me.)


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## PiP (Feb 22, 2017)

Ariel said:


> I get what you mean, Phil.  The reaction of my workshop group when they found out I work at a landfill was very funny and frustrating. I have had people actually try to sniff me to see what I smell
> like.
> 
> I work in the office and it's a "clean" landfill anyway.



I can relate to this, Ariel. My husband used to work in the East End of London and managed a scrap yard (metal) which they exported all over the world. Unfortunately the industry had an unsavory reputation... most of which was actually true. Back home in the leafy suburbs, a lonely bored housewife and mother, I joined a 'ladies' group. Husbands were doctors, teachers, accountants etc... I always avoided telling the 'ladies' what my husband did for a living and all was going swimmingly. That was until we were invited to join the dinner club and my husband evilly told them as a joke (I hope) he was part of the East End Mafia. To add to their obvious discomfort he then went on to tell them about his day and how he had come face-to-face with a sawn-off shotgun (that part was true). I nearly died of embarrassment. Needless to say we were not invited again and I left the group.

Ariel, often people are quick to judge.


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## Ariel (Feb 22, 2017)

I think the reaction the majority of people give to people who work in sanitation or utilities is hilarious. Did they think this stuff magically worked or disappeared?  It can be gross and even humiliating but it has to be done.  Fortunately it also tends to pay fairly well.

I didn't end up working in a landfill because I had no where else to go. I ended up here because it is the best that was on offer for my skill set.


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## PiP (Feb 22, 2017)

Non Serviam said:


> My user name, Non Serviam, tells you a bit about me if you can unpick it. It's Latin. People who know that it's Latin but don't understand it tend to call me "Non Servium", which I never correct, because there are some kinds of ignorance I delight in. (I'm afraid I'm not actually a very nice person. Sorry about that.)
> .



Meanie! LOL Runs off to check PMs and posts


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## J Anfinson (Feb 22, 2017)

Plasticweld said:


> That ability and that feeling far surpass and bullshit feeling, of just being a simple person with limited needs.  Yes, I have tons of toys and not much time to use them.  But please don't try and tell me that there is nobility in being poor or just getting by.



I'm afraid I take exception to this, even find it a bit offensive. So money allows one to help others? Therefore poor people can't help others? 

Tell that to Mother Theresa. 

That "bullshit feeling" allows me to sleep at night because I know I'm nothing special and I'm not above the next person. I'm thankful for what I have and glad for every reminder that some have it worse. It's easy to forget about all the little things that make my life better than my neighbor's. The longer you spend away from being dirt poor, the more you forget. As an example, about a month ago I went out of state to visit family. While there, the topic came up about what we were going to do for lunch. I suggested we fire up the barbecue grill and cook hamburgers. They looked at me sheepishly and said they didn't have charcoal and were too broke to buy any. So I went out and bought two bags so they'd have some even after I left (they didn't like the charity but I told them tough shit).

Point is, even though ten years ago I was just as broke as they were, I'd forgotten how some can't even afford a bag of charcoal. Now I'm not rich by a long shot, I make decent money these days (I'm a welder for those who might wonder) but I still live paycheck to paycheck with a little left over for other interests. I'm not rich but I keep the bills paid, I guess. Does that mean that I'll never amount to anything? That nothing I do will profoundly affect someone else's life? You don't need money to accomplish that. What it takes is the ambition and drive to do so. Money often follows that ambition and drive.


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## LeeC (Feb 22, 2017)

J Anfinson said:


> I'm afraid I take exception to this, even find it a bit offensive. So money allows one to help others? Therefore poor people can't help others?
> 
> Tell that to Mother Theresa.


Ride on Jake, you nailed it. When I was younger and able, I used to stop and help a few around here that needed the help. Now, there're a few that help me when I need it. One good person stoped by earlier this winter and fixed my SP snowblower when I couldn't afford to take it to the repair shop, and refused to accept anything in return. The avarice society humans tend towards in cycles will be our downfall. 

Of course I blame it all on Native America's lax immigration policy


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## Kevin (Feb 22, 2017)

Tell me about your toys, plastic. I have a mountain bike, a snowboard, a surfboard, and some boxing gloves with the stuffing pounded out of them. I have a pair of $180 hiking boots that I get a lot use out of. The surfboard is in the shed, not been out in years. You have to be in shape for it (paddling muscles) but I no longer have time. The mountain bike I can roll right into the mountains within minutes from my front door so I do - thank goodness- love it. I have lights so I trail ride in the dark if I have to. The boots were my first not cheapies and man, is there a difference. I used to spend $50 to $80 a month on the gloves but the gym owner died so that's done( unless I hang my own bag which wifey is not happy about).


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## SummerPanda (Feb 22, 2017)

Lately I have been introducing myself to co-workers as a cranky bitch or an opinionated bitch.


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## Plasticweld (Feb 23, 2017)

Jake, go ahead and be offended then.  All that means is that when someone is about to lose their house, you are of no help, when someone's car breaks down and they can't pay the repair bill.. You are no help.  When someone needs to put down a down payment on their first house but don't have the money...You are no help.

 Spare me all BS is right.  I am help to help others with not just money but with my time and effort.  Because I have the ability to take time off in the middle of the day and just go help...That takes doing well enough so that I can do that.  Living pay check is a reality for many.  


What I find astonishing is that here I am on a writing site where if I came in and said...Shit I write good enough I don't need to do any better.  Shit why do I even need to follow the rules of grammar or even tell a decent story as long as I just get by.   Making money is no different than writing, it is  skill, it does not happen by accident and it takes long hours and tons of failures be for you succeed. If you took the same approach to your writing...and this is a dig...maybe you do... That your writing is good enough to just get by... How far are you or anyone else going to go as a writer?     


I mentioned Sam and his ability to help.  He has an abundance and a skill that he is able to share because he worked hard at the craft.  He put in long hours has had many failures along the way and learned much through his process to be successful.  He has the ability to help me or any other writer here because he did much more than just get by or have some casual goal as a writer. 



I happen to be good at making money and I am no less generous when it comes to someone needing help...  NO one is going to be asking for writing help from anyone who is just getting by as a writer and no one is going to be getting any financial help when the only person they can ask... is just getting by. 


Pardon my rant...You guys might be writers, I might just be a rich guy. 



Kevin in I told people what I have, they would like me even less :}       



oh and I didn't go back and proof read this cause apperantly its ok to do enough to just get buy andand I dont' want be a showoff and do more thann needed


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## Sam (Feb 23, 2017)

Plasticweld said:


> Jake, go ahead and be offended then.  All that means is that when someone is about to lose their house, you are of no help, when someone's car breaks down and they can't pay the repair bill.. You are no help.  When someone needs to put down a down payment on their first house but don't have the money...You are no help.



Your intolerance of other people who have not received the opportunities that you have been afforded is quite astounding, Bob. 

When someone is about to lose their house, no, I am of no help to them. You have the wherewithal to do that, and I commend you for stepping in to help, but do not for a second believe that your wealth gives you the right to pontificate to me about what use I am or am not to society. 



> Spare me all BS is right.  I am help to help others with not just money but with my time and effort.  Because I have the ability to take time off in the middle of the day and just go help...That takes doing well enough so that I can do that.  Living pay check is a reality for many.
> 
> What I find astonishing is that here I am on a writing site where if I came in and said...Shit I write good enough I don't need to do any better.  Shit why do I even need to follow the rules of grammar or even tell a decent story as long as I just get by.   Making money is no different than writing, it is  skill, it does not happen by accident and it takes long hours and tons of failures be for you succeed. If you took the same approach to your writing...and this is a dig...maybe you do... That your writing is good enough to just get by... How far are you or anyone else going to go as a writer?



Well, let me see. 

Fourteen novels, traditionally published, two dissertations, a master's degree, two-and-a-half million words of prose written over 19 years, a tutor of students, and I'm still the same humble prick I've always been. I've never lorded my ability over anyone, nor my status, nor my wealth, and I see no benefit to doing any of those things. 

It would appear that you, on the other hand, believe that making money is the sole purpose of living. I don't subscribe to the notion. The pursuit of prodigious quantities of money means nothing to me. As long as I can maintain a roof over my head, a hot meal in my belly, and pay my bills, I'm happy to do the jobs that you think are beneath you.  



> I mentioned Sam and his ability to help.  He has an abundance and a skill that he is able to share because he worked hard at the craft.  He put in long hours has had many failures along the way and learned much through his process to be successful.  He has the ability to help me or any other writer here because he did much more than just get by or have some casual goal as a writer.



Thank you, but it doesn't change the fact that you're trying to insinuate that I'm foolish for not putting the same value into monetary gain as you do. 



> I happen to be good at making money and I am no less generous when it comes to someone needing help...  NO one is going to be asking for writing help from anyone who is just getting by as a writer and no one is going to be getting any financial help when the only person they can ask... is just getting by.



George Potter (RIP) was doing enough to make a living from selling his writing. Would you have asked him for writing advice? I think you would have. 

Making large quantities of money from writing does not in any way make you automatically qualified to give advice. I'm not exactly rolling in dough from my writing, either, but I have no problem giving advice and I even get paid for tutoring people. 

Who are you to dismiss the advice of anyone because of their status?


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## Ariel (Feb 23, 2017)

Wealth does not equal moral right. Just because you are doing well financially and choose to help does not mean that anyone else will choose the same.

Being poor does not make me or anyone else a bad person.  Equating wealth with morality is what is wrong in this country.


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## Deleted member 56686 (Feb 23, 2017)

Well this conversation has gotten interesting.

I believe there are many ways to contribute and help others besides giving money. I'm certainly not rich, and I know I'm not the greatest writer in the world (though I certainly try ). I mean, not to sound like the braggart of the year, but I'm under the impression that I have helped people here just by trying to be a gentle, caring force. I guess I'm trying to follow the mantle left by Pandora for those who remember her.

I guess what I'm trying to say is we all have something to contribute and it doesn't have to be money. It could be with whatever you have an abundance of.


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## Pluralized (Feb 23, 2017)

Hmm, identifying oneself. 

For years, my focus was trying to rid my psyche of the notion of 'self' so I could find awareness and actually pay attention to the rapidly passing moments (i.e., the only time I'm actually alive). There have been days where I don't think in terms of 'self' but rather in terms of actions, motions, things I do for the people around me. That's when I feel the most alive, and the less 'self' matters. 

Weird to think in these terms and try to put it to words. This materialistic culture turns me off, always has. I love music, art, good conversation, and the feeling of hope. I suppose I also identify as someone who's trying to simplify, jettison these plastic things I've collected, and live a life with meaning rather than a life of accumulation. At the end of it all, you die alone and cannot take a single thing with you. 

I'm Avery and Elliott's dad. Tracy's husband. Not rich, not poor, and thankful for every lesson, every moment, and every hug. My heart is full. I've spent time with beautiful, selfless human beings who smile from the inside out and love me unconditionally, so yeah, life is pretty successful overall.


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## Clubs_and_Hearts (Feb 23, 2017)

I've never identified myself as a writer, and I hope one day I will feel confident enough to do that. Until then, I mention my name, my job, and/or my religion if asked.

Sent from my SM-S975L using Tapatalk


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## Kevin (Feb 23, 2017)

"Kevin in I told people what I have, they would like me even less :}  " hey, I might just be your best friend. Just kidding...I hate borrowing things in general. I don't know why. 

Intolerance? What the hell are people talking about?
I bet you work your ass off for your money. ( anyone here every have to make payroll? I'm guessing not..) I know how that is, working your ass off. I do a job, or did a job that 'only illegals would do.' Frankly, they do a half-ass job of it now, about one third the output of an actual journeyman, but... such are the times, at least for that trade (among many others).

There's a thing that happens whenever I'm winning at monopoly: all of a sudden I start giving. I know most people aren't that way, or I'm guessing they're not, hanging on to every penny... I've run into plenty of customers like that and I'm always baffled(at how f...ing cheap, and petty they are). I had one guy that was worth 30million. He wanted to gyp me for $250. Lol. I lost his number.

But you know that's a whole different animal than you, Plastic. There's something  about getting your hands in it, or maybe not, because I have known people that did have their hands in it and yet were the biggest creeps, rip-offs, when given the chance. There's something else then, and who knows where it comes from, a sense of right and wrong, or empathy or something, that effects how some of us act, and I mean actions taken; not words. 

So... There seems some logic in that how can one be philanthropic if you are engaged in trying to feed yourself, clothe yourself; keep a roof over your head, unless you're mother Teresa, who I don't think is here, and she did after all, have nothing better to do... for christ's sake, and I mean that literally... Sure, you can give some, you could take someone in, or feed someone, but look at say... Ofrey, giving away cars to a whole audience, I mean... How is she able to do that, hmm? Money, I think... And I think prior to that she worked her ass off; lots of hours and no frills. She sacrificed, and got lucky, at least somewhat ( time, place).


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## J Anfinson (Feb 23, 2017)

Plasticweld said:


> Jake, go ahead and be offended then.  All that means is that when someone is about to lose their house, you are of no help, when someone's car breaks down and they can't pay the repair bill.. You are no help.  When someone needs to put down a down payment on their first house but don't have the money...You are no help.



No, I can't pay their way out of trouble. However, I can show them how to get back on their feet because I've done it. The idea that you need money to be of any use is dangerously arrogant. But it would seem that you'll never understand that.


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## walker (Feb 23, 2017)

I already commented once on the money thing, but I'll try again.

To me, the issue is: How much money is enough? What do I need to lead a reasonably happy life?

People think in extremes. If they hear that money is not the number one priority in your life, they default to thinking that you want to live in a shack, or even like an ascetic, on top of a mountain, in rags.

But maybe you feel that what you have is sufficient, and that other aspects of your life are more important. John Muir, the Scottish-born naturalist who wandered a lot of the American west, wrote a lot about people that were "time poor." Muir also has my favorite quote of all time about money. I can't remember it exactly, but it came near the end of his life. He was on an expedition to Alaska, funded by Edward Harriman, who was an extremely wealthy railroad man. Somebody asked Muir about Harriman's money, and Muir said, "I have more money than Harriman. I have all I want, and he doesn't."

For the record, anyone earning more than $34,000 is already in the one percent of top wage earners, in global terms! 
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...obal-elite--half-worlds-richest-live-U-S.html

So I have to wonder, if you have a home, car, family, food on the table every night, and a reasonable expectation that you will always have those things (barring a paranoid "An asteroid could hit my house!" type personality, who will worry no matter what) what is the point in sacrificing your entire life, or very nearly your entire life, to the pursuit of more money, as so many do?

And again, because people think in extremes, somebody will read the last sentence that I wrote and think, "He wants everybody to live in a tent and eat nuts, like squirrels!" But no, I'm not saying that at all. I'm saying that at some point, isn't enough enough? And I really wonder at fabulously wealthy people who want more and more and more and more. Take Mick Jagger. Love his music! But did we really need the last few tours, the perfunctory strumming of the old hits, so that the boys could have a few million more dollars? To what purpose? I mean, when you have everything, isn't that when you go to India on a spiritual journey like the Beatles, or take a risk and sail solo around the world, or dedicate yourself to gardening instead of rock and roll, or do anything except try to stash away more money? It becomes an end unto itself. Too much is never enough.

As far as helping others with money, that happens, I guess. Are the Wall Street bankers that caused the crash in 2008 helping others with the $700 billion bailout they got? Can't say for sure, but I suspect not. I studied biology at a fancy university. In many courses, 90% of the students were aspiring doctors, and the rest of us were odd eccentrics interested in wildlife. The pre-meds drove us crazy with competitiveness. We had a homework drop-box in one class. Some of the pre-meds stole other people's homework out of the box, changed the names, and dropped the homework back in the box. A fed-up wildlife student wrote a letter about the pre-meds to the student paper, and provoked an impassioned response from a pre-med about how pre-meds were more or less the equivalent of Mother Theresa, and that they had to be as competitive as they were to make all the money that they wanted, which was going straightaway to help needy people all around the world of course. It was a good story! I remember it to this day. So when I see one of those former pre-meds sitting on a pile of cash, I guess I'm to understand that she is waiting for somebody _really_ needy to come along, at which point she will donate all of it, which was the point of stealing homework, and not sleeping while an intern in a hospital, etc. instead of personal gain, lust for a certain brand of car, and so on. 

Not to begrudge anybody whatever they want in life, but at least be honest about it. I had a friend who was in law school at that same university. He had a bright future ahead of him. I asked him why he did it. He smiled and said, "I have expensive tastes." He was driving a nice car too. I also remember his comment. It was honest. Now that guy may have a pile of money now. He may also have helped other people with it at times. Maybe he lent a friend in trouble $5,000. But I don't think that he would claim that being able to lend a friend money was why he dedicated himself to earning a lot of money. Is that true of everybody? Of course not. The world is a wide place. Many people with money have a strong philanthropic tendency. But my anecdotal experience, without studies, statistics, and such to back me, is that more people who earn lots of money are interested in having nice stuff for themselves than helping other people. Just my experience. Take it for what it's worth. Best.


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## Plasticweld (Feb 23, 2017)

*SAM *_quote
_*Well, let me see. 

Fourteen novels, traditionally published, two dissertations, a master's degree, two-and-a-half million words of prose written over 19 years, a tutor of students, and I'm still the same humble prick I've always been. I've never lorded my ability over anyone, nor my status, nor my wealth, and I see no benefit to doing any of those things.* 


Gee Sam You must be as lucky as I am,  I have been in 13 businesses in the past 40 years.  Made a million, lost a million a couple of times.  Guess what I get dirty when I work, I own logging company, a welding company and a sawmill, and partnerships in a few other small businesses.  I routinely gamble the cost of the house I live in on business ventures.  I work 70 to 80 hours a week... so I must be lucky just like you.  I do know that after being here going on three years I don't think I ever mention money nor bragged about my success.  There is mud on my boots at the end of the day, I just choose to keep working and investing when others go home for the day.  


For anyone who has known me over the years here, I am the first to jump in when someone is struggling here on the site and needs help, encouragement or just a kind word. It would be very naïve of you to think that somehow I just hand out money and that is my only fix for things. 
*
It would appear that you, on the other hand, believe that making money is the sole purpose of living. I don't subscribe to the notion.
 The pursuit of prodigious quantities of money means nothing to me. As long as I can maintain a roof over my head, a hot meal in my belly, and pay my bills, I'm happy to do the jobs that you think are beneath you.  

*If you honestly believe that of me it only means you have read very little of what I have posted here over the years.   I think around 30 stories not counting the LMs which can be very revealing in the Non Fiction section.  I don't think any of them would fit in that category 



*Thank you, but it doesn't change the fact that you're trying to insinuate that I'm foolish for not putting the same value into monetary gain as you do. 

*if you applied that same logic to your writing where would you be?  Why is it wrong to expect success in more than one area in life?   The skills are transferable in my opinion. 


I did not imply that, and if that is what you took out of it I apologize.  What I have found that when someone is hungry they need a loaf of bread not good thoughts or even kind words.    Is it foolish to think you are really going to change things without money?...it kind of is.  I have been broke before, I had the IRS come in, and at one point seize everything I have owned.  I have been near bankruptcy twice.  I know what it is like to need help maybe better than you.  I also know that when I needed help I need more than good thoughts. 





*Who are you to dismiss the advice of anyone because of their status?
*

That is easy.   If the only thing  you are capable in giving a critique in reading another work is " I liked it, or it stinks"  because your either too lazy to give one, or you don't have the skills then what is your advice worth... Nothing.   This site prides its self on a place where writers can come share their work and gain advice and encouragement from other writers.  The quality of the reviews and the advice I have been given over the years I find priceless so there is a reason to both dismiss the advice of some and treasure the advice of others.... There are critiques from some writers here to be the most encouraging and rewarding part of this site.   It is because I have read their work,  enjoyed their stories and posts.  All critiques are not equal   


That being said the skill of writing in many respects is no more than mental masturbation, it strokes the ego and makes us feel self important.  I doubt there is anyone here who is make a more than modest living at writing, and more than likely 98 percent of us who just love to write.  This is a pass time and a hobby.  Maybe our words will change someone or effect the direction they take in life... More than likely not.  Our jobs which provide for us and our families is real, it has consequences and it effects not only us but those we care about.   Being blasé about our professions and lively hoods   seems way out of wack to me. 






I started this thread with the idea of learning  more about the people here, you can only do that if you challenge what they believe and what they say. 



I will say that I am anything but intolerant.  My views and beliefs are far from the norm here.... Yet here I am :}



Anyone that wants to argue with me, please do so by PM the intent of the thread, as I said was to learn key words in how to ask someone a question when interviewing them that they could not ditch or just brush off with a one word answer.  Though I have always practiced it.  I often share as much with those that I have interview as I have received.  As someone values knowledge I have always go after those who think differently than I do.  What is amazing is that because someone holds a different belief than I don't get offended or take it personal some here have. 


 If you ask I will tell, if you tell, I will ask you another question, that is what writers and those with inquisitive minds will always do.   Peace out as the hippies say


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## Non Serviam (Feb 23, 2017)

Breaking news!  Your identity is not your profession, your income or your bank balance.


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## Raevenlord (Feb 23, 2017)

Non Serviam said:


> Breaking news!  Your identity is not your profession, your income or your bank balance.


Bollocks, you just tore apart my understanding of this universe! Surely you jest!! You... Jester... 

Pray tell, what Is identity? 

I raise you, kind sir:

What is life even?...


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## Ariel (Feb 23, 2017)

Bob's right, let's get this back on track.



Plasticweld said:


> I was just curious.  Giving it some thought I have told people I was a this or that, kind of based on what I did for a living at the time,  Sometimes it depended on who was asking or the mood I was in. The topic always comes up in any conversation, sometimes it's part of your introduction.  Reading through some of the posts and some of the stories it struck me how many different perspective there where.  I figured some of that had to be from how we viewed ourselves...so if you only got one word, or even a short sentence, how do you describe yourself and how many different answers have there been over the years.



For me, the answer varies depending on what is actually being asked. If I were to answer about my roles in the lives of other people it would include a variety of titles including "wife", "stepmother," "daughter," and "sister."  If I were to boil it down to one word it would be "survivor."  The titles that apply to me keep evolving with every job I have had and with every relationship.


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## Gofa (Feb 23, 2017)

Me in song lyrics from my formative years 

I'm a picker
I'm a grinner
I'm a lover
And I'm a sinner

And 

I've seen fire and I've seen rain
I've seen sunny days that I thought would never end
I've seen lonely times when I could not find a friend

And 

When I was a child
I caught a fleeting glimpse
Out of the corner of my eye
I turned to look but it was gone
I cannot put my finger on it now
The child is grown
The dream is gone
I have become comfortably numb

and 

I never thought there were corners in time 
Till I was told to stand in one 
I've heard circles moving right through corners 
And they don't even know they've been around and around before 

All because I felt it that I believed it 
Because there are things I've never seen that I believe in

If it rains again tonight, I can think light years ahead 
I can put myself back a thousand years ago 
It's as if I've been here before or as if I am still to be born 
I'm a slow loser, but I'm a fast learner 
This much I know 

Finally:  True story and drives next lyrics, in that a man in a cigar bar once offered to take my soul.  A Toltec thing and I declined

These lyrics speak of a life long struggle regarding my soul

He said: 'I'll give you one dollar'.
I said: 'You've got to be jokin', man,
It was a present from me mother'.
He said: 'I like it, I want it, I'll take it off your hands,
And you'll be sorry you crossed me,
You better understand that you're alone 
a long way from home

No more lyrics 

Of all the things I am 

Firstly           I am different 
secondly.      I am a long way from anything like home

consequence 

Ive spend my life trying to be the same as others 
and 
any available time searching for little pieces here and there that remind me of home


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