# given the situation detailed, what would your goal be?



## Justin Rocket (Jun 25, 2014)

I'm stuck on a point and am hoping comments here can serve as the "WD 40" for my creative engine.

Assume you are American and born to a poor or lower middle class family.  Assume that you've put all your hopes for a better life onto getting a college degree.  Assume that the only way you can attend college is with a scholarship.  You are a top tier high school hockey player.  You are pursuing an athletic scholarship in hockey.  You've been told that there is a college scout who has come to see you in the next game - which happens to be the championship game.

And you've messed up terribly in that game*.  You've lost your chances with that scout and you've lost your chance at college.

That night (before you've had the time to distance yourself from this emotional upset), what is your next goal (which might not even be related to hockey or college)?

*the reason you've lost the game is what seems to you to be a hallucination - in fact, you are worried about your mental sanity and are afraid to mention it to anyone.  In fact, there is a supernatural force in play, but you have no experience with the  supernatural and don't believe in it


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## T.S.Bowman (Jun 26, 2014)

First thing, why would your parents have allowed you to put all your hopes on the scholarship.

Second, a scholarship is never the "only way" someone can attend college. Even if it means stretching a 4 year degree into a 5 or 6 year task...there is always a way. Especially if said hockey player is determined enough.

Your next goal would be to push whatever it was you think you saw out of your mind and go about the business of trying to find a school where you can try out for the team as "walk on" player. From there, if you perform well enough, the scholarship you were looking for would probably wind up being offered.


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## Justin Rocket (Jun 26, 2014)

T.S.Bowman said:


> First thing, why would your parents have allowed you to put all your hopes on the scholarship.
> 
> Second, a scholarship is never the "only way" someone can attend college. Even if it means stretching a 4 year degree into a 5 or 6 year task...there is always a way. Especially if said hockey player is determined enough.
> 
> Your next goal would be to push whatever it was you think you saw out of your mind and go about the business of trying to find a school where you can try out for the team as "walk on" player. From there, if you perform well enough, the scholarship you were looking for would probably wind up being offered.



And you think that's what the guy would be thinking that night?  It's not something that would come to mind after the guy had time to distance himself from the emotional upset of the loss?


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## Terry D (Jun 26, 2014)

Depending on the guy, he could be get drunk/high, spend a night of angry sex with his girl friend or other available body, disappear into his room to sulk, get into an unprovoked fight and get arrested. All the stuff angry, frustrated young men do.


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## T.S.Bowman (Jun 26, 2014)

Justin Rocket said:


> And you think that's what the guy would be thinking that night?  It's not something that would come to mind after the guy had time to distance himself from the emotional upset of the loss?



Not necessarily. But, he wouldn't be really thinking about any long term goal at that point. 

I was just throwing it out there cuz you asked.

A question for you though. Who's to say that he couldn't "distance" himself enough to start thinking logically. Within a few hours of the loss, after the possible drinking (depending on how much) the sex and the anger...he's probably going to start trying to figure out what the hell had happened to him that caused him to mess up.


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## Justin Rocket (Jun 26, 2014)

T.S.Bowman said:


> Not necessarily. But, he wouldn't be really thinking about any long term goal at that point.
> 
> I was just throwing it out there cuz you asked.
> 
> A question for you though. Who's to say that he couldn't "distance" himself enough to start thinking logically. Within a few hours of the loss, after the possible drinking (depending on how much) the sex and the anger...he's probably going to start trying to figure out what the hell had happened to him that caused him to mess up.




The character will not recover within a few hours.  I'm focused on the character's next goal which may not be a long-term goal.


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## Blade (Jun 26, 2014)

T.S.Bowman said:


> Your next goal would be to push whatever it was you think you saw out of your mind and go about the business of trying to find a school where you can try out for the team as "walk on" player. From there, if you perform well enough, the scholarship you were looking for would probably wind up being offered.



Or something along that line. The problem with having all your eggs in one basket is that if you drop the basket you are in a rough situation. At this point you need a plan B which hopefully has been brewing in the back of your mind all along. The only non-option is giving up; you have goals its just a matter of finding another way of achieving:cookie: them.


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## Kepharel (Jun 26, 2014)

Without knowing whether there really are dark supernatural forces at play and the cause of the hallucination (you/the reader would know that? the hockey jockey would not?) it's hard to conjecture.  Will he be the puppet of those dark forces through the rest of the night?  Getting drunk and doing John Wayne saloon bar stuff, for a young kid in the 'hood, could drive him further into the mire as part of the plot in his dance with the devil. On the other hand would the reckless teen goings on take the story into Cool Hand Luke territory.  Not enough info I'm afraid. One things for sure, hormones and disappointment don't give cause for goal oriented planning.


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## W.Goepner (Jun 29, 2014)

Justin Rocket said:


> I'm stuck on a point and am hoping comments here can serve as the "WD 40" for my creative engine.
> 
> Assume you are American and born to a poor or lower middle class family.  Assume that you've put all your hopes for a better life onto getting a college degree.  Assume that the only way you can attend college is with a scholarship.  You are a top tier high school hockey player.  You are pursuing an athletic scholarship in hockey.  You've been told that there is a college scout who has come to see you in the next game - which happens to be the championship game.
> 
> ...



From the writers point of view, Lets look at the situation. There are the visions, or hallucinations. You mentioned knowledge of them for fear of sanity. As I see it you have written yourself into a corner, the MC does not believe in the supernatural. Hard to recover from that, so Jump it, go five or ten years into the future. 

Two ways of doing that, you already have the hallucinations/visions, use them, or simply use time. [Getting over the loss of game and scholarship, MC, spent the next five years busing tables at the truck stop just south of town. Keeping to himself, for fear people would recognize, a looser.] Then with the hallucinations that he  has yet to come to terms with, he saves the life of a child or two, or finds the family that was lost for a week in the desert, and he cannot figure out why he was there to begin with, and or, while working at the truck stop, MC could be confronted by an old hag like woman, or a gypsy type person, that is there then gone before he can respond, (though this is cliche and common, put your own twist to it.)

For the most part the goal might be just surviving with the hallucinations being more frequent, guiding him to disasters or simple life changing moments in others lives, or directing him out of the mundane life he is trying to achieve to a greater life of the supernatural, take it out of the MC's hands for a while.

Just ideas, I hope one of them work for you.


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## Deafmute (Jun 29, 2014)

the cliche obvious response is simple, he would get drunk/high and do something stupid. Get in a fight, sleep with a stranger, crash his car etc. I say cliche but that doesn't mean bad. it just means obvious. You are creating a hook. he had a plan and everything was going perfectly then this "hallucination" pops up and screws all that up. He is angry, confused, lost and depressed. When this happens people latch onto their vices. The most obvious vices are alcohol and drugs, fighting and sex, but if you have other vices that he could use to escape his situation use them. He could go down to an old parkinglot he used to play in with friends when he was young bring a street hockey set and slap pucks at an old street sign while drinking, he could drive over to the ocean and throw stones off a cliff into the crashing tides, maybe consider throwing himself off the cliff. 

conversely you could make the hallucination dictate his next move. On his way home he could hallucinate again and crash, while he is about to kill himself a vision stops him. etc you get the drift. this is a classic hook you are using and its a good one to get the ball rolling on what I assume is going to be a story about the hallucination not the hockey. Have fun good luck


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## Bishop (Jun 30, 2014)

Justin Rocket said:


> That night (before you've had the time to distance yourself from this emotional upset), what is your next goal (which might not even be related to hockey or college)?



Probably go to get something to eat, by myself, ponder what to do. Then I'd begin applying for student loans, or getting a job to support me until I could save up for college.


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## dale (Jun 30, 2014)

he would become more and more drawn into the supernatural, and permit the insanity to dictate his choices, as far as future goals.


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## bazz cargo (Jun 30, 2014)

I know nothing of this guy. Is he religious? What courses was he thinking of? How stable is his family life, poor doesn't mean dysfunctional. What are his friends like? 

Then there are plot questions :What are you aiming for?  What baggage are you hoping to dump on him? What action and reaction? Cause and effect?

If I have the opportunity I will explore more than one scenario, see what works for me best. 

Interesting question, thanks for getting me to think.


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## Ari (Jun 30, 2014)

Why are people assuming the character is a guy? 

But, I guess it's not being asked what the character would do. It's being asked what I would do which is not the same thing at all...

And now I've assumed myself American (not easy) and a top hockey player (not easy either) and that the only way to go to college is to get a scholarship (so you can't get student loans in America?) and that I messed up due to hallucination (I can choose the kind of hallucination? Can I have seen unicorns prancing up a rainbow bridge into the clouds?) and now I'm in bed that night...

I'd probably think, "I didn't want to go to college anyway. Me, I'm up for life on the road. Bloody hockey. Bloody college." 
And I'd pack my harp and tin whistles - no wait, my harmonica and my banjo - and drive I'd into the next state where nobody knew me. 
There I'd live of busking, writing songs about how I had dreams of going to college but I couldn't, because of the unicorns.


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## Bishop (Jun 30, 2014)

Ari said:


> Why are people assuming the character is a guy?



Because he asked what I would do if I was that character. And last time I checked (I'm scheduled for another check later this week) I'm a guy ~.^

But, kudos to you for pointing that out. I think it'd be a bit more interesting, especially since female sports are often so overlooked.


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## dale (Jun 30, 2014)

Bishop said:


> Because he asked what I would do if I was that character. And last time I checked (I'm scheduled for another check later this week) I'm a guy ~.^
> 
> But, kudos to you for pointing that out. I think it'd be a bit more interesting, especially since female sports are often so overlooked.


lol. with that avatar...everything you say comes off as funny now.


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## Bishop (Jun 30, 2014)

dale said:


> lol. with that avatar...everything you say comes off as funny now.



Clearly, it's a keeper.


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## Justin Rocket (Jun 30, 2014)

Ari said:


> It's being asked what I would do



You are neither an American nor a top hockey player.  So, in fact, I'm not asking what you would do unless "what you would do" refers to a "you" which is not literally -you-.



> that the only way to go to college is to get a scholarship (so you can't get student loans in America?)



Yes, you can get a student loan in America.  However, you might not qualify for a sufficient loan.  The Federal Government may calculate an Expected Family Contribution which is unrealistic.



> I can choose the kind of hallucination?



To be clear, the "hallucination" is rather specific and, as I mentioned earlier, is actually not a hallucination, but a supernatural vision.  While that vision is rather specific, you'd need to know a lot more of the story to make sense of it.  That's why I didn't go into detail.


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## Ari (Jun 30, 2014)

Justin Rocket said:


> You are neither an American nor a top hockey player.  So, in fact, I'm not asking what you would do unless "what you would do" refers to a "you" which is not literally -you-.
> 
> Yes, you can get a student loan in America.  However, you might not qualify for a sufficient loan.  The Federal Government may calculate an Expected Family Contribution which is unrealistic.
> 
> To be clear, the "hallucination" is rather specific and, as I mentioned earlier, is actually not a hallucination, but a supernatural vision.  While that vision is rather specific, you'd need to know a lot more of the story to make sense of it.  That's why I didn't go into detail.



Ah, well. I tried.


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## W.Goepner (Jun 30, 2014)

Justin Rocket said:


> I'm stuck on a point and am hoping comments here can serve as the "WD 40" for my creative engine.
> 
> Assume you are American and born to a poor or lower middle class family.  Assume that you've put all your hopes for a better life onto getting a college degree.  Assume that the only way you can attend college is with a scholarship.  You are a top tier high school hockey player.  You are pursuing an athletic scholarship in hockey.  You've been told that there is a college scout who has come to see you in the next game - which happens to be the championship game.
> 
> ...



First, I want to say this sounds more factual than fictional. I hope not.

As to the situation as described. I would say it is obvious that this person is not out of high school as yet. Seeing that they were concerned about furthering their education, they should focus on finishing out high school. Afterwords, getting a low profile job where they can work their way through the community collage. With high enough grades from a community collage, some state collages will accept them. Also they should be applying for any scholarship they could find.

Second option, continue in high school and look for a job That they can work their way up into a better position. While going to every hockey tryouts they could find, they were good enough to be scouted once they can be good enough to tryout. 

Third option, again finish school. Figure out the hallucination, with supernatural powers at play, it would be worth figuring out. It could lead to the "Greatest American Hero" type of thing.

Fourth option, quit school, get drunk, or stoned, or both. While wasted get into a scuffle that turns them into a fugitive, or lands them in jail for twenty years. While in jail they learn that what the supernatural hallucination is all about and it leads them to be a better person, helping others before they end up like he did.

As for what I would do? Any of them except number four. I do not agree with any type of cop-out. I am now five years without any sort of income. My art attempts are not going any where. My writing is, well, unknown at this time. I have been told, nearly everything I have done in life, was not good enough by my father, the one person I ever wanted to accept me. His thought was to get me to strive harder. His accomplishment was to create a doubting, self degrading, procrastinating, pessimistic, underachiever. I have managed to follow my brother like a lost dog for over fifty years. Every time I stepped out on my own it was only for a short time before I was back at my mother's home, my brother's home, or my father's. The ONLY thing I have done on my own, that was any good, I served in the United States Army, and because of my shortcomings, I did not reenlist. So if it were me finishing up high school, unable to fulfill my better educational dreams, I would go into the armed forces and get an education in some field there.


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## Kyle R (Jul 1, 2014)

Like a few others have already mentioned, I'd go with rage and destruction. Tearing apart his room. Smashing all his hockey gear. Burning it, maybe.

Perhaps finally accepting that offer from a sketchy character to binge drink/vandalize property/do drugs. Any sort of self-destructive behavior.

I know you've some experience with Snyder's _Save the Cat_ structure, so I'm assuming the championship loss would be in the "All is Lost" beat?

If so, my next beat would, naturally, be the "Dark Night of the Soul." :encouragement:


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## aliveatnight (Jul 1, 2014)

I'd personally go with the vision dictating his next move. Perhaps it causes him to hurt himself or someone he cares about. Maybe the vision was actually trying to warn him of something bad happening. Or perhaps it's some act of the Devil.
You could also go with the self destructive route as the others have mentioned. 
Or he could be logical about the situation and see what his options now are (as nobody is ever completely screwed).
He could even be depressed and will quietly cause himself self harm (drinking alone or cutting).

I hope one of these could be of help to you.


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## Justin Rocket (Jul 1, 2014)

Thank you all very, very much for your suggestions 

I think I may need to provide more context.
Five years ago, when Logan was 12, he cajoled his little step-brother, Victor, into walking out onto a frozen lake.  The ice cracked and Victor died.  Logan did not intend to harm his step-brother and he was devastated.  He pulled Victor's body out of the lake, then a friend went to get Logan's mom and step-dad.  For two years, Logan had fairly regular night terrors and saw a psychiatrist. His mom deserted him.  Logan lived afraid that his step-dad would kick him out of the house (though, in fact, his step-dad is a compassionate mentor with a broken spirit over the loss of his son).  Logan hid the fact that the reason Victor was on the lake was that Logan had cajoled him into going there.
Now, Logan is seventeen.  He has, in the past two weeks, had two night terrors (after three years without any).  Now, he has the big game with the scout present.  Maybe the stress of the game is what is causing the return of the night terrors, he thinks.  
During the game, he sees the ghost of his dead step-brother on the ice.  He is startled and makes several errors during the game, blowing his chance at the scholarship (he wanted to attend college out of state with a major in emergency medicine).  He feels dejected at this twist of fate and his step-dad tells him that he has to make the best of what he's got.
What Logan does not know is that he is the incarnation of the god of murder.  After the game, he is at the pivot point where he gives up what he thought his life would be so that he can learn to embrace a much greater destiny  (and a true nature which is very hard to accept).  The world desperately needs him to learn to embrace this destiny, for there is a supernatural villain intent on destroying the world and only Logan has the power to stop him.


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## tabasco5 (Jul 1, 2014)

How about making it the worst of the worst situations for the hockey game?  Intense rivalry, final shot kind of thing - absolute worst case scenario stuff - and your dude blows it on the big one.  For example, see the following video of the Iron Bowl 2013 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GKmkD1pUG0.  

The kicker for Bama in the video is your dude.  He just blew everything, and he is thinking he might as well end his life.  So he goes back to his apartment, people are shouting threats and burning effigies in his yard and cursing his mother.  To get out alive he shaves his head, puts on a disguise, and crawls out his window down to his car.  The car has been vandalized and all the tires are slashed.  He walks to an ATM, withdraws all his cash, and hops a train.  He train hops and hitchikes all the way to Miami.  From there he boards a ship in the undercargo bound for Columbia.  The ship turns out to be smuggling cocaine and gets stopped by the feds. There is a shootout and everyone aboard both ships are killed but your dude.  His picture is taken from a camera on the US ship and he is now wanted around the world for trafficking and murder.  He disembarks from the ship on the ship's dinghy and finds a river running to the sea.  He motors upriver for 37 miles until the dinghy runs out of gas.  From there he must kill his own food in the jungle and fight for his life.  He eats some berries that make him hallucinate again and he is back in the game lining up for the final kick. 

 He is just about to kick when he is smashed in the face by a log.  He is unconscious and wakes up the next day tied down by vines in the hut of an aborigine.  For 4 weeks he is fed nothing but little fishies and some mush, and is beaten and forced into slave labor building a 300 foot wattle and daub square monument.  He decides on escape and works up a plan.  The night he plans to leave a tropical storm comes and this hides his escape.  He makes it back down to the river and finds an old dugout canoe.  He jumps in the canoe and puts it in the water and the tropical storm blows him inland another several miles.  The next day he wakes up in a city of some sort complete with big ugly buildings and people rushing around wasting energy.  He steals food from a cafe dumpster and lives with the homeless for several days.  He gets mugged and beaten and his teeth knocked out, so he has a hard time eating anything.  He resorts to swallowing food whole because his mouth hurts so bad and a sucker gets lodged in his throat.  He has a choking fit and a passerby tourist has to do the heimlich.  This tourist is from his hometown and comments that he looks like her favorite hockey player except for the long hair, ratty beard, busted face, missing teeth, thin grotesque body, and sunken eyes.  She invites him to a concert at the park, a Beatles cover band, and she goes on and on about this hockey player all night and his mysterious disappearance.  She had all his hockey cards and would do anything to have him back.  All his other fans miss him too, and they are ashamed that they destroyed his car and burned down his mother's barn. 

 He finally tells her that he is the hockey player and they fall in love and hold hands and kiss.  She says she can get him back in the states by some loophole known only by lawyers, senators, or fiction writers, and so she does.  He goes back home to a hero's welcome and all is good and they get married and kiss some more.  During the honeymoon the feds show up having finally found him, the killer on the Columbian drug running ship.  He is busted in the face with the butt of a rifle and thrown over the balcony.  They stick him in the car and take him to jail.  There is a long interrogation.  14 hours.  They only give him coffee to drink and it dehydrates him because coffee is a diuretic.  He begins to have a nosebleed, then he signs the confession and spends the night in the drunk tank and gets mugged.  They move him to a private cell and there is a tv in it.  The local news is on and is doing a special on the "rogue hockey player" as he is now known. 

 The power to the jail cuts off then comes back on and the tv is running in a loop.  The rerun of his bungled play is playing over and over in perpetual rerun.  He can't turn the tv off because the buttons have been filed away by the guards as a security measure.  For 12 hours he has to watch his bungled play over and over and eventually ties the sheet around his neck and the rafter and jumps off the bed.  When the sheet pulls tight and the pressure hits his neck he is brought suddenly back to consciousness.  He is laying on the couch at his parents' house and has fallen asleep watching tv.  Happy Gilmore is on.  "I think I'll go play some golf," he says to his parents.  "Hockey is a dangerous sport."


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## W.Goepner (Jul 1, 2014)

Justin Rocket said:


> Thank you all very, very much for your suggestions
> 
> I think I may need to provide more context.
> Five years ago, when Logan was 12, he cajoled his little step-brother, Victor, into walking out onto a frozen lake.  The ice cracked and Victor died.  Logan did not intend to harm his step-brother and he was devastated.  He pulled Victor's body out of the lake, then a friend went to get Logan's mom and step-dad.  For two years, Logan had fairly regular night terrors and saw a psychiatrist. His mom deserted him.  Logan lived afraid that his step-dad would kick him out of the house (though, in fact, his step-dad is a compassionate mentor with a broken spirit over the loss of his son).  Logan hid the fact that the reason Victor was on the lake was that Logan had cajoled him into going there.
> ...



Interesting, have you ever read the incarnate series by Piers Anthony? (spelling might be wrong there) He wrote about the gods and fates in that series. One I believe was "the red sword", a story about mars the god of war. You seem to be heading in the same direction. 

Question; god of murder? I mean it is alright, but sounds odd. Let me see, there is Hades god of the underworld, the dark gate keeper, the grim reaper, each representing death. A god of murder, one in control of the violent deaths of the innocent, that is how I see murder. *shivers* The idea of a being in control of that sort of thing, But the incarnation of Hades, if it has not been done, Hades is not evil he is only the keeper of the dead. Human society has deemed him a dark god because of what he does, we see him as a vulture of sorts. Some times Hades wrings his hands as the time grows nearer for a special someone to enter his realm. This is not my story though.

It sounds like you are trying to decide if Logan should be plunged into his role or have more moments of indecision. On one hand dumping him into the role would harden him into the position. On the other giving him a bit of toying can show him he has no choice. Either way he is bound to be the god of murder. I say try writing it first by dropping him into the role, play it along to a point where he would be the same as if he went through some trials, Then write it with those trials, taking it to the same point. A double perspective, being put through the trials could make him caring, compelling him to change the way murders happen, thus lowering the statistics. Being dropped into the role could make him hard to the suffering of others and he would grow more powerful with every murder. Again not my story.

Many avenues, and hard choices. I say good luck.


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## Justin Rocket (Jul 1, 2014)

W.Goepner said:


> But the incarnation of Hades, if it has not been done, Hades is not evil he is only the keeper of the dead.



Hades is Greek.  Greek gods have been done to death (pardon the pun).  I'm going with a different real world pantheon.


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## Morkonan (Jul 5, 2014)

Justin Rocket said:


> ...That night (before you've had the time to distance yourself from this emotional upset), what is your next goal (which might not even be related to hockey or college)?...



Try to join the baseball team? Football? Debate club? 

Or, I would find the hotel where the scout is staying and plead my case to them, begging them to see me in another game and pleading with them to give me another chance to show what I've got... And, of course, they'd probably blackmail me into doing something illegal, seeing my dilemma, and it would all end in tears with me inadvertently committing murder in order to further the career of an athlete who is a college-rival of mine, who I detest... and who is also an alien who is on the fast-track to becoming President of the United States so he can weaken our military to the point that the alien invaders can take over the planet without having to fire a shot, which would harm our environment... and make Al Gore pissed... who is also an alien of a rival species.

Or something like that.


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