# Cutting down on length?



## Idle Tinkerer (May 9, 2010)

How do you folks go about shortening a work that's gotten a touch too long? I've always had a talent for gross over-writing, and I struggle to pick out what can and can't be cut without sacrificing some quality.

Any tips from the folks around here, wise and experienced and all those other fun things?


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## Like a Fox (May 9, 2010)

Not sure I can call myself wise or experienced, but I have just spent three days taken the raw version of a couple of chapters of what I'm working on, and cutting them down, really polishing them.
I find that I say the same thing a few times. So I've been copying paragraphs at a time, and trying to eliminate anything unnecessary. Sometimes I go into great detail about something that simply doesn't matter.
It might be funny, or pretty, but it slows everything down. So I look for stuff like that.
And simplify, simplify, simplify.

It's your call when to stop culling. And then put it up here and someone is bound to tell you if you're waffling


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## Sam (May 9, 2010)

Give me an example of what you consider over-writing. Are you writing novels or short stories? 

The first thing I'd tell you to do is to examine your prose and dialogue. Is there something in your prose that is superfluous? Perhaps you spent a paragraph talking about something that his little to no relevance. Is there something in your dialogue that doesn't move the plot forward? I won't give definites, but dialogue should usually move the plot forward. If it doesn't, you can consider it "filler".


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## Olly Buckle (May 9, 2010)

Take out all the words that are not essential to meaning, eg.

How do you folks go about shortening a work that's gotten a touch too long? I've always had a talent for gross over-writing, and I struggle to pick out what can and can't be cut without sacrificing some quality.
becomes
How do you  shorten a work that's too long? I've always over-written, and I struggle to cut without sacrificing quality.

You sometimes have to alter verbs, like shorten and writing, if it still looks too long then start re-phrasing

How do you reduce a work's length? I find it hard not to lose quality when I do.


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## Idle Tinkerer (May 9, 2010)

I'm writing a short story, which is currently a touch over 4500 words, with me needing to get it down to around 4000.

Looking over it again, dialogue is probably one of the main offenders. There's definitely some waffle there, though I can try and excuse myself by calling it characterisation. Could definitely condense it some. Prose I struggle with. I'm going to have to bite the bullet and post the damn thing here soon, if I can put a "short" title on it with a straight face.



Olly Buckle said:


> Take out all the words that are not essential to meaning, eg.
> 
> How do you folks go about shortening a work that's gotten a touch too long? I've always had a talent for gross over-writing, and I struggle to pick out what can and can't be cut without sacrificing some quality.
> becomes
> ...


 
That... That's an awesome illustration of just how much I waffle. Thanks.


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## Mr. Beard (May 9, 2010)

I'm not much of a short story writer, but in any of the poems i write and i need to get rid of something i read it and then slowly just start getting rid of words that still make the story fit, and sometimes it requires taking out two or three and replacing it with one.  Its a slow process, but it seems to work for me.


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## Stardog (May 12, 2010)

Search for adverbs - delete.

Don't "show" pointless things that don't contribute to the story. "Tell" those bits. Showing takes up more space and should be saved for useful stuff.


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## Sam (May 13, 2010)

Stardog said:


> Search for adverbs - delete.



I'm reminded of a conversation I had on another forum involving adverbs. This guy said to delete all adverbs as well, and then I asked him what adverbs were. His response was: "All words that end with '-ly'. 

Wrong. 

_Anomaly, monopoly, unruly, grisly, crinkly, ugly, comely, cuddly, cowardly, bubbly, assembly, homely, friendly, sully, tingly, gangly, bully, imply, curly, wobbly, melancholy, silly, leisurely, worldly, heavenly, ghastly, masterly, fatherly, ungodly, shapely, brotherly, bristly, saintly, lovely, lonely, orderly, wrinkly, sparkly, family, dastardly, costly, homily, slovenly, ungainly, womenly, manly. _

*None* of the above are adverbs. When you start telling people to remove adverbs, you cross a line from which there's no coming back. Overuse of them, I will admit, is bad. But cutting them out completely is worse. And it's the kind of advice that's thrown around for no other reason than it sounds good.


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## Stardog (May 13, 2010)

Adverbs are not required in fiction writing and removing them will cut down on the length. Adverbs only tell the reader something they would already know if the scene was written properly. Some like "up" or "upstairs" are fine, but avoid the obvious ones.



> His response was: "All words that end with '-ly'.


Well, that's his issue.


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## Sam (May 13, 2010)

Stardog said:


> Adverbs are not required in fiction writing and removing them will cut down on the length. Adverbs only tell the reader something they would already know if the scene was written properly. Some like "up" or "upstairs" are fine, but avoid the obvious ones.



Might I point you to every traditionally-published book on the planet? Take a look at any of them, and if you find one devoid of adverbs, I'll bow to your assessment and say you can't use them. 

This is new-age malarkey that largely had its provenance on the Internet. It is not a "rule". If you want to cut out adverbs, by all means do so. Don't say that everyone must also do so. 

Your advice is actually good. You can cut a lot of adverbs to reduce word-count. But they aren't "wrong" or "not required".


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## Sigg (May 13, 2010)

Idle Tinkerer said:


> How do you folks go about shortening a work that's gotten a touch too long? I've always had a talent for gross over-writing, and I struggle to pick out what can and can't be cut without sacrificing some quality.
> 
> Any tips from the folks around here, wise and experienced and all those other fun things?


 
The first 3 responses to your thread really hit the nail on the head and I agree with them. There is no real "trick" other than to just start cutting words out or rephrasing things to be less words.

The real difficulty is when to stop yourself. For example, cutting all dialogue that doesn't strictly move the plot forward may also destroy your characters. Of course, the natural response would be, "If it is written _properly_ then that shouldn't be a problem!" but we all know in practice it isn't that simple.

The only other suggestion I have is to participate in something like the LM challenge or make your own challenges. Or just try your hand at Flash fiction. Doing the LM challenges have really helped me with the skill that you're asking about. For example, the word count limit is 500 words and I wrote a 1000 word story, I had to sit there and slim it down to 500 without completely destroying the story. Another thing to be aware of is that you need to _plan_ for your word count. So if you know it's going to be a 500 word flash fiction, don't start outlining 20 characters and 5 subplots, clearly none of them will be realized to any sort of satisfaction.

So in that vein, if you have far too many words already written, consider cutting out whole characters or subplots and making the story more focused on a single theme or message. Of course if you're writing novels... you can go crazy, but writing short fiction is an entirely different skill set.

EDIT : a perfect example of how NOT to write a short story is my post above, not succinct at all and not very organized or focused.


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## alanmt (May 13, 2010)

practice helps.

In one of my writing classes, our assignment was to rewrite a well-known short story, reducing it to two pages. That assignment was graded and returned with a new assignment: reduce the story to one page. The next assignment was to reduce it to a paragraph. The final assignment was to reduce it to a sentence. It was a valuable exercise.

Doing the Literary Maneuver competitions on this forum, in which you have a 500 word limit, is also helpful in learning how to edit length. I have never written a 500 word or less story in my first draft. It is always several hundred words over. Then I have to edit it down to fit the word limit.


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## Sigg (May 13, 2010)

> I have never written a 500 word or less story in my first draft. It is always several hundred words over. Then I have to edit it down to fit the word limit.


 
This round of LM was a first for me in that regard, I wrote a 183 word story haha.  Not saying it's any good, but maybe the judges will give me points for making their lives easier!


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## moderan (May 13, 2010)

I certainly encourage joining the LM and trying to write concisely within the guidelines of the competition. We'll have a lot of prompts which will stretch and test people's abilities, both shrinking and expanding stories.
This has been a public service announcement.


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## Kat (May 13, 2010)

I just cut about 20,000 words from my novel. Reading it over I realized that it wasn't helping in any way. It didn't further the plot at, it was just useless filler. I am bad about being overly descriptive. It might sound beautiful but it's not needed. There was a point where I was reading it and thought no one really cares about this. I'm sure if you read it over and over again you'll find points that aren't needed or you'll get so sick of it you'll toss it across the room. 

I do agree that writing short pieces really helps you realize what is and isn't needed. Still have a few days to join this LM. lol shameless spam.


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## Sigg (May 13, 2010)

Kat said:


> I just cut about 20,000 words from my novel. Reading it over I realized that it wasn't helping in any way. It didn't further the plot at, it was just useless filler. I am bad about being overly descriptive. It might sound beautiful but it's not needed. There was a point where I was reading it and thought no one really cares about this. I'm sure if you read it over and over again you'll find points that aren't needed or you'll get so sick of it you'll toss it across the room.
> 
> I do agree that writing short pieces really helps you realize what is and isn't needed. Still have a few days to join this LM. lol shameless spam.



I think this exercise is only effective if you are able to distance yourself from the piece, if you go back and try to make those edits immediately after writing it, it will be much more difficult.


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## Kat (May 13, 2010)

Yep, I imagine so. I admit to being sporadic about editing. I will finish a piece, put it away and then come back to it later when my mind is clear. Which doesn't help time wise when you do that with each chapter


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## seigfried007 (May 13, 2010)

How to properly cut words depends on the reason and the piece. If an editor says, "I need you to cut 20K from this before I publish it," he will usually tell you if he wants it in scenes or minutia. 

If no scenes can be cut (and usually there's a few that are better off gone) then minutia's the answer. This means hacking at the 'be's, the adverbs, the endless adjectives, the meandering constructions. It means a few more commas and periods, but fewer almosts, reallys, kind ofs, surpisinglies, ises, etc. It means stronger verbs because they get more done in less time and paint a better picture anyway. It also means fewer but better adjectives--only those that make the biggest impressions.

Another thing that sometimes gets cut is places and characters in their entirety. For instance, if so-and-so isn't hauling enough plot-weight for that giant scene, sometimes he gets axed. If one character can do the work of two or three more minor characters, sometimes those guys get consolidated into someone who's going to do all of the above. The same thing happens with settings. 

For instance, a character goes to a hotel and sleeps. The hotel lobby, rates, parking, valet, bellboys, room, noisy neighbors, etc all get described as the character interacts with them. Contract with him sleeping at home, with a friend, an old girlfriend, at his mom's house, a seedy dive, a whorehouse, his car. For the depth these people and places add, they're usually more worth the words and can enhance the plot easier.


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## HarryG (May 14, 2010)

The danger with cutting the clutter is recognising it in the first place, and I totally agree with Sam about adverbs, you can't write without them although they need to be used carefully and judiciously.

If you are requested to reduce your word count for some reason, and I can't think of many that are legitimate, I would think it pointless to merely take out what you considered appropriate words and dialogue in the first place, already edited by yourself to your satisfaction; and you might have to consider removing part of your story instead.

Edit until you're blue in the face is good advice, but for fuck-sake leave something in, otherwise the sun goes down without a murmur and you might as well type The End.


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## Himani (May 14, 2010)

I'm in the editing phase of my manuscript as well. I've found two books I liked that gave some good tips and exercises regarding editing: _Revision and Self-Editing_ by James Scott Bell and _Manuscript Makeover_ by Elizabeth Lyon. Mostly, though, practice is necessary. I've found that I edit ten times better if I have the manuscript printed out, in front of me, and a red pen in my hand. I don't know why, maybe because my eyes strain easily on the computer or maybe because a red pen puts me in an editing "mood." 

I've also been catching myself using passive voice or superfluous verbage. Look for things like "He seemed to think XYZ" and cut it down to "He thought XYZ." A lot of the time things like "seemed to" isn't necessary. Stuff like that. Outlining also helps me. I outline my plot, like what I want to happen, and sometimes I outline chapters to make sure I get what I need done and can cut out the extra, unnecessary stuff (it's like a To Do List for writing  ).



Kat said:


> I just cut about 20,000 words from my novel.



Wow, that's impressive. I guess the words can really add up once you get  started.


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## TWErvin2 (May 25, 2010)

In my experience, planning out the plot helps keep it under control. It gets tricky when you have to remove plot threads. It leaves ripples and some areas of the short story/novel flat.

I know that isn't a lot of help on the trimming part. 

Sometimes a good way to go at that is to have someone else read the piece and make recommendations. They have a different perspective, and they're not tied to the piece like the author is. Of course, a lot really depends on the experience and insight of the reader. And also a dedicated reader, someone who is willing to put the time and thought into the project.

Terry


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## garza (May 26, 2010)

I'm not a fiction writer, at least not so's you would notice, but good writing is, I suppose good writing whether fiction or non-fiction. 

My favourite words are precise and concise - say exactly what you mean to say and use the fewest and best words possible. 

There are no absolute rules. Overuse of either adverbs or adjectives will kill anything, but modifiers are too useful to discard altogether. With each one, ask yourself it it is really needed. Avoid '-ing' verbs as much as possible to eliminate helpers and sharpen the focus, but there are situations in which they are essential. Avoid the passive voice because passive is generally wordier, but you need the passive to make the kind of statement that opened this paragraph. 

The third sentence above illustrates the point about adverbs. In the phrase, 'really needed', the 'really' adds nothing. Either the modifier is needed or it is not needed. In this case it is not needed.

The best writing is clean, clear, simple, direct, and strong. 

And the best writers break this rule as well. Faulkner, Stevens, García-Marquez...


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## RomanticRose (May 27, 2010)

Idle Tinkerer said:


> How do you folks go about shortening a work that's gotten a touch too long? I've always had a talent for gross over-writing, and I struggle to pick out what can and can't be cut without sacrificing some quality.


 
Delete the words in red.  That's how I go about it.


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## The Backward OX (May 27, 2010)

I wish I had this problem. Mine is making my story longer.


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## TWErvin2 (May 27, 2010)

The Backward OX said:


> I wish I had this problem. Mine is making my story longer.


 
Then why not focus on writing short stories?

Terry


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