# Creativity: Conscious Craft or Subconscious Magic?



## Kyle R (Sep 20, 2017)

Some writers talk about creativity as a _conscious_ act: you sit down and write, whether you're inspired or not. Creativity, to these writers, is a pure and simple mathematical formula: _Time + Effort = Creation_. To these writers, "Writer's Block" is more of an excuse than an affliction, and the solution is always straightforward: more time, or more effort. Sit down at your typewriter and bleed.

As Jack London once said: "You can't wait for inspiration. You have to go after it with a club."

Other writers talk about creativity as a _subconscious_ act—an unseen process that occurs in the secretive regions of your mind, off stage, while your thoughts churn over other things. These are the writers who talk about "muses", who describe flashes of inspiration from their dreams, who believe that creativity is an elusive, mystical process that often arrives in fleeting spurts of genius—and it's their job as the writer to "catch" these moments and translate them to the page.

As Elizabeth Gilbert once said: "Creativity is a crushing chore and a glorious mystery. The work wants to be made, and it wants to be made through you."

How about you? Do you view creativity as a conscious craft, or do you consider it more of a subconscious form of magic? :encouragement:


----------



## Terry D (Sep 20, 2017)

Good topic, Kyle.

I believe creativity is a complex beast with tentacles in many parts of our brain. The bulk of it resides in our subconscious feeding on all the bits of information our senses, and conscious mind, let filter down to it, and then shitting out ideas, inspiration, and all the clever turns of phrase we eventually write down. That doesn't mean, however, that we are doomed to wait until our slimy, constipated, forgetful, muse decides to bless us with its processed offal. I think if we take that inconsistent Leviathan for a regular walk, we can stimulate it into regularity. We can prod it with the stick of our will.

Creativity is the process of assimilating input and then using that information to develop new connections between disparate concepts. That re-connecting happens in the subconscious, but, by regularly focusing on tapping into that reservoir of new ideas, we can train out subconscious to produce when we need it to. At least that's the way it works for me.

For instance, most of my entries into the LM challenge are written in 60 to 90 minutes. The final editing may take longer, but the story itself is written in very short order. I like prompts because I can take a prompt and let it roll around inside my head for a few minutes, and while it's in there it bumps up against other stuff that is already there. Quickly other ideas will start to stick to it creating a fresh (usually) idea that I then start writing. I can do that because I've _practiced_ allowing those connections to take place.


----------



## SueC (Sep 20, 2017)

I guess you could say a little of both. For myself I'm more inclined toward the _subconscious_ act. I almost always have to be inspired, or in the mood, or whatever you want to call that moment when putting pen to paper is essential. I have heard some people say, "I don't like to write," and I think to myself, how is that possible? I have been struggling with my latest project, which seems stalled at the moment. But when I was going to bed last night, I had a story-altering idea and I could hardly wait to get up this morning and begin. It might not have occurred to me if I had forced the issue and just sat down and wrote, whether I was inspired or not. Prompts help sometimes, but not all prompts inspire me to write. I am envious of people who say they write every day - I would be lost to any outside life at all if I did that. Writing makes the time fly. I can still be in my pj's at 3:00 p.m., if needing to write something down started when I got up. I don't know how people do it every day, but bottom line, for me  . . . I have to be inspired.


----------



## bdcharles (Sep 20, 2017)

Great topic! I think I concur with Elizabeth Gilbert, though I definitely fall under the latter when it comes to inspiration in that I like it to come from the most magical of subconscious places rather that to be reluctantly dredged up. But the conscious forging of that pure source material into a good read is where the sit-down-and-write comes in. 

Going after inspiration with a club? I wonder if that's not quite the same as sitting down and hammering the keys. More like aggressively seeking out things that quicken the unconscious realms. The two should ideally work in harmony; a bit like a corporation that has engineers sweating in a dark room, and middle managers presenting the other lot's weird and wonderful ideas in a user-friendly way.


----------



## Jack of all trades (Sep 20, 2017)

While I might be able to churn something out that is on topic, quality writing requires me to be interested.  Is interest the same as inspiration? I am interested in everything that inspires me, but not everything that interests me inspires me. When inspired, though, the quality is better than just interested.

I find that seems to be true for my favorite authors, too. When a series is cranked out on schedule, it usually declines in quality from the opening book of the series.


----------



## Annoying kid (Sep 21, 2017)

Its both, in the sense that subconscious flashes of inspiration take over when conscious process isn't enough. Basically whenever I am faced with an especially difficult creative challenge and I got writers block, I typically stop for a few hours and sleep on it until the right words or idea comes to me. Most often used to figure out how to deliver exposition in a way that's minimalistic on the page, but maximizes subtext. Meaning doing the most with as little wordiness as possible. Which requires selecting a precise combination of ideas, words and sentences.


----------



## Terry D (Sep 21, 2017)

Here's what 12 'successful' authors have to say about this topic:

http://jamesclear.com/daily-routines-writers

If you do any research into writing creatively, you'll find the vast majority of successful authors stick to a daily ritual with almost fanatic compulsiveness. (by 'vast majority', I mean I can't find any who don't have a routine).


----------



## Jack of all trades (Sep 21, 2017)

Contrary to what some may believe, it really doesn't matter what is true for other writers. We are each individuals. What works for me works. It doesn't stop working just because someone says it won't work!

Ninety percent of the population might be right handed, but that doesn't make those who prefer to use the left hand wrong.


----------



## Terry D (Sep 21, 2017)

Jack of all trades said:


> Contrary to what some may believe, it really doesn't matter what is true for other writers. We are each individuals. What works for me works. It doesn't stop working just because someone says it won't work!
> 
> Ninety percent of the population might be right handed, but that doesn't make those who prefer to use the left hand wrong.



If the OP didn't want to know what other writers feel to be "true", he probably wouldn't have posted the question, so, yeah, it matters to Kyle.

I don't see where anyone has said anything "won't work". I do think it's interesting that people who actually make a living writing fiction almost universally do so by sticking to a routine. Nobody _has_ to do their writing in any way other than how they wish. If a writer wants to wait for a 'muse' to knock on the door and deliver their inspiration in a neatly wrapped box, that's perfectly fine. If they feel it's better to sit down every day (or stand up, as in Hemingway's case) and drag their inspiration out of their subconscious kicking-and-screaming, that's fine too.

Writing can be a dream, a hobby, a side-line, or a profession. Each requires its own level of commitment. There are lots of folks who dream of being a writer. We see them here all the time; they are the ones who have great ideas, dream up fabulous worlds and characters, but seldom do much in the way of actual writing. That's okay, everyone is entitled to their dreams. The hobbyists write with little thought of publication. They are happy with showing their work to a few others and get real satisfaction from the act of creation whenever and wherever it happens to occur. these folks may, or may not concern themselves with improving their craft, but, in the end, they will rarely be disappointed in the results. Those who write as a side-line do think about publication and they will work to hone their craft. These people often make dramatic adjustments to their lives to accommodate their writing (Franz Kafka worked long hours in an insurance office and wrote at night, often until 2 or 3 in the morning). Professionals (successful or not) are those who approach writing as a job, with all the routine and discipline that entails. 

None of these groups are 'better' than another, and every writer has the right to choose where they want to be on that spectrum -- and can slide from one classification to another over time if they have the inclination. And each has a different 'need' to control their creativity. Dreamers and hobbyists can wait for inspiration to strike like a hidden snake, or to slowly unfold like a special flower. The stakes are lower if goals are lower. To a great extent the 'side-liners' can wait for inspiration also, because these folks often are not 'writers first' and other things later, but many will not wait. They will make full use of the writing time available to them. Those who think of themselves as professionals cannot afford (not necessarily financially, but that's a great motivator too) to wait for some mythical muse to inspire them. They learn to inspire the muse.


----------



## Jack of all trades (Sep 21, 2017)

Funny. I read the OP as starting a poll-type conversation to find out what the various members of this site think about inspiration versus perspiration. Apparently some consider this to be an attempt to nail down some universal "truth" of the matter. Most folks I know change throughout their lives, so I doubt such a "truth" exists, even on a personal level. Since I don't think there is a "truth" to nail down, I am choosing to avoid this thread from now on. Those who agree with me are welcome to PM me with their opinions.


----------



## H.Brown (Sep 21, 2017)

Right, this was a thread for members to voice their thoughts on the subject matter. We have to respect each others contributions and opinions, I do not want this thread to become arguementative.


​


----------



## Terry D (Sep 21, 2017)

Jack of all trades said:


> Funny. I read the OP as starting a poll-type conversation to find out what the various members of this site think about inspiration versus perspiration. Apparently some consider this to be an attempt to nail down some universal "truth" of the matter. Most folks I know change throughout their lives, so I doubt such a "truth" exists, even on a personal level. Since I don't think there is a "truth" to nail down, I am choosing to avoid this thread from now on. Those who agree with me are welcome to PM me with their opinions.



Sorry if I somehow offended you. I only answered the OP with my opinion and observations based on a long time dabbling in this business/hobby. The only time I mentioned 'truth' was when quoting you, but, since you brought it up, the only thing I believe to be close to a 'universal truth' (again, your phrase, not mine) in writing, is that, like any other creative art/craft, no one performs their best without regular practice -- and that includes regular exercise of the creative organs.


----------



## ppsage (Sep 21, 2017)

Writing a novel probably requires something like a couple million individual inspirations.

I feel like something that gets missed in discussions of the role of inspiration in art is the actual minutia of creation. This may be because a work of art, from the other side so to speak, is almost defined as being inspirational in some way. But the actual creation of a written piece involves deciding which word to put next. It often involves going back over those decisions and making them again or different ones. What inspires each of these myriad decisions? For a writing artist, the actual work is getting pertinent words to pop into consciousness in a routine and dependable manner. 

For almost everyone I expect this is a skill which improves with practice.


----------



## Bloggsworth (Sep 21, 2017)

Consciously crafted magic, what else...


----------



## Kreegen (Sep 22, 2017)

I've always viewed it as subconscious. 
I'm not writing my book because I'm a writer. I'm writing it because I was inspired by what I saw lacking in other media in the genre. I write when things come to me. The subject and characters are nearly effortless to create, and they pick up their own personalities. 
Now, there are some details that are harder to nail down, but otherwise it's all been pretty seamless. 

Maybe it's a combination of both, because there are days that it's hard to write. However on those days I usually just stop, then something else inspires me or answers the question I had. (That something else sometimes being another person, but still)

I would never describe writing as bleeding. To me it's more like swimming or breathing, it just comes to me. 

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk


----------



## EmmaSohan (Sep 23, 2017)

I had no inspiration for the fourth scene of my WIP. I didn't want a boring scene that just furthered the plot. There's no joy in writing without inspiration. It's so discouraging to know that, despite all my hope and effort, I could end up with something worthless.

But I knew I had to sit down with determination, start writing, and hope my Muse came to the party. It was a leap of faith I didn't want to make. Is that part of the hard work you meant, Kyle?

I actually thought about it for an hour, I thought of a start that wasn't particular exciting but at least it was different. I ended up with a mostly finished scene with at least four good parts. (Yay!) My Muse made no stunning contributions but was at least whispering to my unconscious. The scene still needs work -- more work! -- and inspiration, but I can work with it now. Is that the work you were talking about?


----------



## EmmaSohan (Sep 23, 2017)

When I looked closely, my muse wasn't as clever as I thought. My book lacked a plot, and a friend suggested that my MC try to make the world a better place. That was a bad idea. It was a fantasy, so adding a quest would work, but that lacked all creativity. But when the two horrible ideas collided, I had a quest to make the world better. That was a stupid goal for a quest, but a good idea for a book.

Once I am in a different place, it's easy to be creative by being ruthlessly faithful to the new place. My MC would never go on a quest, so I invented a male to come into town and (based on a prophecy, of course) buy her for his wife and take her on his quest. Now I had two people who didn't know each other but were married, spending every second together. It was a unique perspective to explore the elements of a loving relationship.


----------



## Jack of all trades (Sep 25, 2017)

EmmaSohan said:


> When I looked closely, my muse wasn't as clever as I thought. My book lacked a plot, and a friend suggested that my MC try to make the world a better place. That was a bad idea. It was a fantasy, so adding a quest would work, but that lacked all creativity. But when the two horrible ideas collided, I had a quest to make the world better. That was a stupid goal for a quest, but a good idea for a book.
> 
> Once I am in a different place, it's easy to be creative by being ruthlessly faithful to the new place. My MC would never go on a quest, so I invented a male to come into town and (based on a prophecy, of course) buy her for his wife and take her on his quest. Now I had two people who didn't know each other but were married, spending every second together. It was a unique perspective to explore the elements of a loving relationship.



This is off topic, so I probably shouldn't respond, but...

If an idea is bad in real life, it's bad in a book.

And I read that something like 80% of books are purchased by women, so... you may sell more books if women are willing to go on quests and are not bought and sold like objects. Just sayin'.


----------



## EmmaSohan (Sep 25, 2017)

Jack of all trades said:


> This is off topic, so I probably shouldn't respond, but...
> 
> If an idea is bad in real life, it's bad in a book.
> 
> And I read that something like 80% of books are purchased by women, so... you may sell more books if women are willing to go on quests and are not bought and sold like objects. Just sayin'.



Sorry I wasn't clear. Bad ideas are very common in books. Letting a fish drag you out to sea. Build a theme park with real dinosaurs. Visiting the island of the Cylops for no reason. Trying to run away by floating down the Mississippi River. Devoting your life to killing a particular whale. The issues surrounding a hopelessly vague quest appear in about 20 places in my book, and to the extent that idea is new, all of those scenes were at least somewhat new.

A book where a woman is sometimes treated as an object might have some relevance to women today, she said snarkily. More seriously, I have worked with the assumption that females should have available role models that are different from male roles models. That goal pretty much saturates everything I write.



Casor says, "Soolan, the Wizard of Prophecy spoke poorly of my quest, saying I did not know what it was."

He did. I will not speak my agreement.

Casor: "Many have spoken poorly of my quest to make the world better."

Because it is so _vague_. What does it mean? As we traveled today away from Naam I thought about this issue. Surely Casor has no clear goal.

Casor: "I am discouraged, Soolan."

"Do not be discouraged, Casor."

Casor: "Is there some reason I should not be discouraged? I wish to hear your thoughts on this issue, Soolan."

"Because I do not like it when you are discouraged."

"That is no reason, Soolan. Many have called me foolish. Why should I not feel discouraged?"

I have nothing to say that will help. I do not know why he ever felt encouraged.


----------



## Jack of all trades (Sep 25, 2017)

???


----------



## Theglasshouse (Sep 30, 2017)

Right now I believe the biggest obstacle for a starting writer might be the subconscious. But I believe writing could be both as subconscious and craft process and paying attention to craft is important and I believe it helps one learn tricky concepts such as description (and being more conscious). By being an observer and knowing by example to observe maybe we could describe better. There's, for example, a whole book I came across with over twenty unique ways to describe a penny (sentence per sentence if you tried really hard). Same applies to objects in a living room.

I have my own challenges to overcome as a writer, but I am trying to use the subconscious, by an image that has symbolic meaning, in which I tried do this exercise which produced some results by exploring the subconscious by generating ideas. I did this exercise from a book. (I plan to write it out when I could address the criticisms of what people have said about my writing namely grammar and details). Imagine what does the object or image conjure up in your subconscious mind or mean to you?First is the image, then there is the past feeling, thought, or past relationship after that, of a person.

For example, a boxer's glove can represent a feeling of a person wanting to conquer's one's fears. Of one's search for talent. Wanting to win a boxing title, even though you are well to do and prosperous. Does it trigger more images? The image has to do with the boxing glove as an example given, or maybe a butterfly collector, or maybe a dead moth trapped in a jar with light that is hot. Then you use those objects, that resonate with you. You write until you get ideas. I am glad it worked for me to generate ideas. You can generate a theme, a character, emotion, an idea, a feeling, beauty is evil for example because some people think it's a system of inequality. You are born either beautiful or ugly or average. Kurt Vonnegut wrote for example, a short story where beautiful people wore masks, and intelligent people, were constantly having devices that confused them.

Any image could be fair game as long as it intrigues. I tried to explore it based on this exercise what I thought of that image based on my unique point of view. I won't post what I did generate, but it was a fun exercise of the subconscious. So I think I am at the subconscious stage, where I must try to imagine the personality of the characters as well to write the story.

My example of the buttery collector is this which I came up from after working yesterday: beauty must die. Beauty must live. This is a broad theme to explore. And it is a real feeling, and entertainment has potential to do so much better for the world.


----------



## Annoying kid (Oct 1, 2017)

> More seriously, I have worked with the assumption that females should have available role models that are different from male roles models.



Interesting. Different in what sense? :-k


----------



## EmmaSohan (Oct 3, 2017)

Annoying kid said:


> Interesting. Different in what sense? :-k



Someone here once said the main character should be high in agency. My female main characters are usually low in this. Then they develop as the book progresses, and end up being able to do what is needed, which still doesn't make them high. (Remember, I am always working with high school students.) One MC couldn't make decisions (but learned to). Another said "I'm not a leader. I'm not even a follower."

In one final scene, my female MC realizes that a bomb has a timer and needs to be disarmed. A male character would break away from the guard, leap over the seats, get to bomb, and do his best to disarm it. She, instead, shouts "ALEX! DISARM THE BOMB!" Then he does the getting away, leaping, and disarming.

I tried to balance their roles in that final scene. (She has just shot a terrorist, and when a policeman goes to shoot Alex, she kicks his gun away.) Still, when I look at that fragment, I can see how sexist it is. But maybe that was the whole point, to find a female role model consistent with a female. Females can be strong and brilliant and high in agency, but heros don't have to be strong, brilliant, or high in agency. They do have to do the right thing.



> As the common wisdom says, none are happy with the tasks given to them by fate. Marize has done what fate asked of her; Edam has done what fate asked of him. Now it is my turn.


----------



## JustRob (Oct 3, 2017)

I've never actually seen creativity as having anything to do with writing, never having intentionally been a writer. The fact that one particular bout of creativity in my life could only be expressed through writing was quite unique, in fact so strangely unique that some might regard it as paranormal. Creativity is surely by definition innovative rather than reactive and people differ in their lives in general as to which of these two approaches they take. Too often in life I've seen the reactive people stampede in the wrong direction in an attempt to solve a problem which is easily solved through a little creative inspiration. There is a time to be reactive and a time to be creative and it's just a matter of getting the balance right in all activities in life.

Potential plots for stories, intriguing characters, clever statements and phrases, in fact all the building blocks of written works are just products of our natural thought processes and experiences. I discard such ideas that cross my mind every day simply because I don't want to write and they are not of immediate use for any other purpose. Maybe regular writers struggle because they try to pump that well dry rather than letting those thoughts well up naturally. I could never do that. For me creativity is about discovery, not manufacture. When I write I hope that the reader will not think "How clever. I could never think up such things," but rather "How simple. Why didn't I think of that myself?" That's the problem then, that what others might regard as creativity I simply see as discovery of what is already there. It's like the sculptor who claims that he simply removes the unwanted pieces of stone from a sculpture that is is already buried within a block or a woodcarver who sees the shapes that already exist within pieces of wood and just needs to free them.

When I submitted my novel to a professional reader for comment he suggested that I change tack and focus on a completely different aspect of it. I agreed that that would make a good story, but it wasn't the one that I needed to write. To me the story already existed and I just had to find the right words to set it free. That is what creativity means to me, discovery of something new within the mind. There is no point in questioning its origin. The skill of the craft is needed simply to expose it fully.


----------



## Annoying kid (Oct 3, 2017)

> In one final scene, my female MC realizes that a bomb has a timer and needs to be disarmed. A male character would break away from the guard, leap over the seats, get to bomb, and do his best to disarm it. She, instead, shouts "ALEX! DISARM THE BOMB!" Then he does the getting away, leaping, and disarming.




You say sexism, but is her being female the sole reason she doesn't disarm it? 

- If she knew how and he didn't and still called for him to do it.

- If they can both do it and he's busy and she's available but still calls for him to do it.  

- If they can both do it and both available and she's alot more experienced yet still defaults to him disarming it.

Those three scenarios are sexist. Having the main character play a supporting role in the climax because she's female when a male main character would be written as playing the main role, which you admitted, would also be sexist.

That said we're writers not activists, and women with low agency has potential to be popular as seen with Twilight and Fifty Shades of Grey, so I'm not going to call it a bad thing. There's no mandate for fiction to be aspirational.


----------



## AnastasiaA (Oct 3, 2017)

I would agree that it is a bit of both. I suppose it's like any skill - you can have talent and effort, but it's when you have both that good things happen.

When I'm in a good place with writing I find I often get flashes of inspiration in my dreams, from things I have read or watched, or just from observing the world around me. In fact, I usually get too many, and they keep distracting me from what I'm trying to focus on.

But I have had plenty of dry patches, where I've got out of the habit of writing and the inspiration completely stops. The only way I've found to get out of those is to just sit down and force some words out. Journalling is helpful for making regular writing a habit, and just for having something to talk about when your ideas run dry.

I do, however, notice a huge difference in quality from when I have forced myself to write, and when I have written because I just had to, and I was in that perfect mental zone. Normally the content I've written out of sheer effort isn't very good. Having said that, I do force myself to sit down and write often, partly because I already regret the time I've wasted not writing, and I don't want to add to it by sitting around waiting for inspiration. You also don't know if you'll get into the zone twenty minutes in, or it can at least be edited when you are feeling more inspired!

The other problem is that I get the strongest desires to write when I'm either at work, and when I get home the feeling is gone, or when it's 1am and I'm trying to fall asleep. Neither are very helpful.


----------



## bazz cargo (Oct 4, 2017)

Inspiration... perspiration....

I have a problem focusing on one thing at a time, my mind churns continuously. It can be frustrating for others around me when I zone out. I can suddenly, mentally, hare off after something and forgot the washing up, or where I last left my spectacles.  The discipline to stick to the story in front of me is absent. I can't turn off my imagination. Oh well, now where did I leave my pants?


----------



## J Anfinson (Oct 4, 2017)

I find it to be both. I can make myself start writing at any time and usually churn out something decent. However, I'm often most proud of the bits which pop in my head at odd times, usually while I'm at work or otherwise unable to do anything with them until later. Character dialogue is the most common. I'm pretty sure coworkers think I'm nuts since I giggle to myself a lot.


----------



## Newman (Oct 9, 2017)

Kyle R said:


> How about you? Do you view creativity as a conscious craft, or do you consider it more of a subconscious form of magic? :encouragement:



It's both conscious and subconscious. I'd take the word "magic" out of it completely. Recommend this: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0521576040/


----------



## sas (Oct 9, 2017)

bazz cargo said:


> Inspiration... perspiration....
> 
> I have a problem focusing on one thing at a time, my mind churns continuously. It can be frustrating for others around me when I zone out. I can suddenly, mentally, hare off after something and forgot the washing up, or where I last left my spectacles.  The discipline to stick to the story in front of me is absent. I can't turn off my imagination. Oh well, now where did I leave my pants?




Seems you are text book ADD. They are quite creative, but find it hard to focus. Ritalin has been great for those in my family who have it.


----------

