# Hemingway quotation- first draft always bad?



## PenCat (Apr 24, 2017)

Anyone know or have such a quote? Im looking for a little inspiration and I figure if a writer like Hemingway wrote things he thought were lousy first drafts, I'm in decent company.

Thank you!


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## Jay Greenstein (Apr 24, 2017)

Here’s the one you want:

“I write one page of masterpiece to 91 pages of shit. I try to put the shit in the waste basket...”
~ Ernest Hemingway

Here are a few more attributed to him.


 “It’s none of their business that you have to learn how to write. Let them think you were born that way.”

“Never confuse movement with action.”

“They can’t yank a novelist the way they can a pitcher. A novelist has to go the full nine, even if it kills him.”

“I don’t like to write like God. It is only because you never do it, though, that the critics think you can’t do it.”

 A man’s got to take a lot of punishment to write a really funny book.


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## Terry D (Apr 25, 2017)

PenCat said:


> Anyone know or have such a quote? Im looking for a little inspiration and I figure if a writer like Hemingway wrote things he thought were lousy first drafts, I'm in decent company.
> 
> Thank you!



Two come to mind...

"The first draft of anything is shit." And, "There is nothing to writing. All you have to do is sit down at a typewriter and bleed."


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## moderan (Apr 27, 2017)

The funny thing is, I know of at least two or three household names who sell their first drafts, edited on the fly. I imagine they haven't always done so, though, experience being the best teacher and all.


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## Mutimir (Apr 27, 2017)

Comparing Hemingway to anything that's out now or what you're writing...that's self-confidence suicide.


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## j.w.olson (Apr 28, 2017)

It's not Hemingway, but I know Anne Lamott's chapter "Shitty first drafts" from her book _Bird by Bird_ is a common read on this topic. The whole book is pretty good, but this chapter is the best. You can find it in pdf form online in various places, such as here: https://wrd.as.uky.edu/sites/default/files/1-Shitty First Drafts.pdf


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## moderan (Apr 28, 2017)

Mutimir said:


> Comparing Hemingway to anything that's out now or  what you're writing...that's self-confidence suicide.



Why? That makes very little sense? Because Papa was so damn good that nobody can touch him? Pfui.
And who's comparing?




j.w.olson said:


> It's not Hemingway, but I know Anne Lamott's chapter "Shitty first drafts" from her book _Bird by Bird_  is a common read on this topic. The whole book is pretty good, but this  chapter is the best. You can find it in pdf form online in various  places, such as here: https://wrd.as.uky.edu/sites/default/files/1-Shitty First Drafts.pdf



There are exceptions to everything. Don't be closed-minded.


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## Sam (Apr 28, 2017)

PenCat said:


> Anyone know or have such a quote? Im looking for a little inspiration and I figure if a writer like Hemingway wrote things he thought were lousy first drafts, I'm in decent company.
> 
> Thank you!



He also won the Nobel Prize and had two previous nominations prior to doing so. 

How does that inspire you? 

The better question here is: why are _you _content with writing crap first drafts just because 'insert author here' was notorious for writing crap first drafts? 

Rather than choosing to be inspired by someone else being crap at first drafts, you should aspire to be better at first drafts.


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## j.w.olson (Apr 28, 2017)

moderan said:


> There are exceptions to everything. Don't be closed-minded.



I haven't the foggiest what you're referring to here.

OP indicated a need to inspiration to get through/past a first draft. I linked a chapter that often provides that inspiration for people. So... "closed minded" seems irrelevant.


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## Tettsuo (Apr 28, 2017)

PenCat said:


> Anyone know or have such a quote? Im looking for a little inspiration and I figure if a writer like Hemingway wrote things he thought were lousy first drafts, I'm in decent company.
> 
> Thank you!


The moment when I put that last period on the last line of text is one of the most beautiful feelings I've ever felt.  I refuse to soil that experience with this (IMO) sick idea that it sucks by virtue of it's existence.


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## moderan (Apr 29, 2017)

j.w.olson said:


> I haven't the foggiest what you're referring to here.
> 
> OP indicated a need to inspiration to get through/past a first draft. I linked a chapter that often provides that inspiration for people. So... "closed minded" seems irrelevant.



You are indicating agreement with the premise that ALL first drafts are uniformly crappy. That's what I'm referring to. "The whole book is pretty good, but this  chapter is the best."
Subtext.


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## moderan (Apr 29, 2017)

Sam said:


> He also won the Nobel Prize and had two previous nominations prior to doing so.
> 
> How does that inspire you?
> 
> ...



Hear hear. This is such a common canard. I see this and the pro-trad-pub bias and I achieve nirvana. *laughs* More actual writing, less reading about other people writing, is my advice. You don't get better at craft by letting someone else make your decisions.


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## j.w.olson (May 1, 2017)

moderan said:


> You are indicating agreement with the premise that ALL first drafts are uniformly crappy. That's what I'm referring to. "The whole book is pretty good, but this  chapter is the best."
> Subtext.



...no? Putting words in my mouth doesn't count as identifying subtext in my answer to someone else's query, despite any animosity you feel toward people who suggest that most things aren't good enough the first time around.

I'm not suggesting that every first draft is uniformly crap. I'm suggesting that the original poster, based on what was indicated in the first post, will likely find value in reading that chapter of Lamott's book. Some first drafts are certainly written better than others, and some may be good. Of course there are exceptions. Some are publishable. This chapter of her book is specifically useful for people who already think their draft is low quality and are close to giving up because of it; it encourages you to finish the draft anyway, then improve things in revisions. It sets a mindset that makes people feel more comfortable experimenting and trying new things until they get their draft right. Different strategies certainly work for everyone, but this is a commonly recommend read for people who are starting out, in my experience.

If you write things that don't need revision before publishing, that's fine, and I'm not trying to convince you to change what works for you. If you feel good about the first drafts you write, that's great! I do too. I know I need to do a lot of work, usually, but it's very satisfying to finish the first draft and set it aside for a while.


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## moderan (May 1, 2017)

Nah, I didn't put words in your mouth. I simply indicated the subtext of what you were saying. This isn't worth fighting about though. You can be right if you want. Apologies if I harshed your mellow.


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## Tettsuo (May 1, 2017)

j.w.olson said:


> ...no? Putting words in my mouth doesn't count as identifying subtext in my answer to someone else's query, despite any animosity you feel toward people who suggest that most things aren't good enough the first time around.
> 
> I'm not suggesting that every first draft is uniformly crap. I'm suggesting that the original poster, based on what was indicated in the first post, will likely find value in reading that chapter of Lamott's book. Some first drafts are certainly written better than others, and some may be good. Of course there are exceptions. Some are publishable. This chapter of her book is specifically useful for people who already think their draft is low quality and are close to giving up because of it; it encourages you to finish the draft anyway, then improve things in revisions. It sets a mindset that makes people feel more comfortable experimenting and trying new things until they get their draft right. Different strategies certainly work for everyone, but this is a commonly recommend read for people who are starting out, in my experience.
> 
> If you write things that don't need revision before publishing, that's fine, and I'm not trying to convince you to change what works for you. If you feel good about the first drafts you write, that's great! I do too. I know I need to do a lot of work, usually, but it's very satisfying to finish the first draft and set it aside for a while.


I guess I disagree with some people's idea of what a good first draft is.

Whether or not the piece is publish-ready isn't what I base my good on.  I base my good on if the story is good, coherent and pulls me in.  Everything else is simply a project in troubleshooting.

But, if the work is straight up trash, no amount polish will help it.  To me, that's a bad first draft.


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## PenCat (May 1, 2017)

Thanks to the folks who got my question and kindly answered it. As for the ones administering a blistering spanking to the thread, get help.


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## Bard_Daniel (May 1, 2017)

I'll just throw my two cents in: Although a first draft might not be ready for publication it has that raw edge to it, that creative essence, that cannot be replicated in revisions.

Hemingway was a great writer IMO-- I think the quote you needed was provided and I think some great commentary was provided, specifically by moderan and Sam. 

That's it for me!


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## PenCat (May 1, 2017)

danielstj said:


> I'll just throw my two cents in: Although a first draft might not be ready for publication it has that raw edge to it, that creative essence, that cannot be replicated in revisions.
> 
> Hemingway was a great writer IMO-- I think the quote you needed was provided and I think some great commentary was provided, specifically by moderan and Sam.
> 
> That's it for me!



Agreed..I've noticed in all of my creative work, and heard from others that the first, if imperfect version, often has the magic essence.maybe our task is to simply remove what prevents it taking flight?


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## moderan (May 2, 2017)

PenCat said:


> Thanks to the folks who got my question and kindly answered it. As for the ones administering a blistering spanking to the thread, get help.



***


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## EmmaSohan (May 2, 2017)

There has to be some good parts to your first draft. (Or else you have way too much willpower.) For nonfiction, you would "fix" things in editing -- make things clearer, fix inconsistencies and fill in gaps. I want to remind you to add more good things in the next drafts. If a scene is weak, add conflict or suspense. Add a scene to make a boring character more interesting. Once I cam to WF to ask how to add humor.


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## PenCat (May 2, 2017)

Where I am with my first drafts is to simply get down the ideas. I often get phrasing just so, or nearly so, but there are also sentences which are pretty stinky. Peee-yooo stinky. So bad I can't believe that I wrote them.

But I know I'll make them better. If I hadn't gotten the ideas down, there might not be anything TO make better.

It helps to know that other writers go through similar.


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## bdcharles (May 3, 2017)

Personally I dive into my first drafts with as mich zip and zingo as any. I want the phrases to be Dickens-perfect. I want the images to be crystals of gleaming clarity, transporting gorgeous scenes from my reserves of genius straight into the minds of my satisfied readership. I might even have a little plot on the go if I'm lucky; and yes, all my first drafts have been artefacts possessing precisely this manner of awesomely-structured beauty.

Then I leave it for a week and it turns to total gwak. Did the edit monster come? Weird innit. What's that about?


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## who me? (May 3, 2017)

consider sturgeons law

[h=3] "*Ninety* percent *of everything is crap*" [/h]
that is still after all the revising and editing


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