# E-books: How much is too much?



## PiP (Jun 24, 2019)

I'm curious, how much would you (as a reader) be prepared to pay as for an e-book, especially by a new author?


I found this article interesting
https://www.thebookdesigner.com/2018/01/the-price-is-right-6-secrets-to-pricing-your-ebook/


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## Ralph Rotten (Jun 24, 2019)

That's a dicey thing.
The prices have begun to stratify.
Anything under $3.99 is viewed as Indie pulp.
$3.99-5.99 is considered marginal territory.
$5.99-9.99 is for big publishing houses.
$9.99 and up is jagoffs like James Patterson. 


No, these are not hard and fast rules. Nothing written in stone. 
These are just growing perspectives on the eBook market.
When people see these prices, this is what they think.
Even though some big publishing houses sell their books for $4.99, and some Indies sell their books for $8.99 (these are the guys who don't wanna be considered at the other end of the spectrum)


I tend to sell for the $4.99 range for my average book. That makes it a value since they are usually big books for a midrange price. 
I sold a double-book for $6.99. That paid me roughly $2 profit per book (2x=$4 per copy)
I have a few old books hat I have marked down to 2 or 3 bucks.


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## PiP (Jun 24, 2019)

But you're the writer, Ralph, not the reader (aka not the person buying the e-book)  I've bought some excellent books by established authors at £0.99 . these are books which already have 100's of reviews.

We receive an email from Amazon every day with book offers and we always take advantage.


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## Aquilo (Jun 24, 2019)

If it's an author I know and love... price isn't an issue. If it's a new author and they have been rec'd to me a damn good source: the price isn't an issue. If it's a start-up author I don't know and who hasn't been rec'd to me... usually I enter with caution. If cover art is professional, blurb good, read-me section on Amazon carrying barely any faults, then anywhere from 0.99 up to 7.99 (ebook). I do most of mine between 3.99-7.99, depending on size. I did put one at 0.99 (90k), but that was a thank you to readers for staying with my whilst I got the 2nd editions redone and out. But it's rare I'll pay above what I put my own books out on the market for, to be honest.


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## luckyscars (Jun 24, 2019)

PiP said:


> I'm curious, how much would you (as a reader) be prepared to pay as for an e-book, especially by a new author?
> 
> 
> I found this article interesting
> https://www.thebookdesigner.com/2018/01/the-price-is-right-6-secrets-to-pricing-your-ebook/



As a reader I would not pay more than $3 or so for any book. That’s because (1) I read a lot, usually finishing a mid size commercial paperback in 2-3 days, so spending the best part of $10 or more on a book adds up fast and (2) There’s no reason to. There is a practically inexhaustible wealth of older, cut price books I have not read not even counting what’s in the public domain - so why the heck would anybody buy a brand new bestseller at $10, $15, sometimes close to $20? Makes no sense. Books don’t expire. This isn’t the Beatles going on tour. Spending big bucks on books for the sake of a momentary trend is silly. Wait a few years and get it cheap.

I do occasionally splash out on a $10 ebook if I really love the author but I will say right now if I’m buying a book at a price tag I don’t feel it is good enough to deserve, I won’t be spending that kind of money on that author in the future. I don’t go back to restaurants that sell overpriced meals that tastes like Applebees and I won’t spend money on an author who writes mediocre work and prices themselves at X because “that’s what the market is”.

Of course, as a writer I view it differently.


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## JustRob (Jun 24, 2019)

I almost never buy fiction except when collecting a series, which virtually by definition means the work of an established author. There are a lot of books out there to read already, so new publications aren't particularly attractive when I can get older ones for free from the public library, which provides both physical books and E-books nowadays, or very cheaply second-hand from charity shops. Any money paid to a charity shop is effectively a donation to the charity as the books usually find their way back to the shop for resale after I've read them. 

When I start reading a novel I read virtually non-stop until it's finished, much to my angel's annoyance, so I can read one in a single day. Bear in mind that a novel may contain little more action than a film and I read in almost real story time, so a novel just equates to an overlong film when read that way. Reading at that speed I can't justify paying for novels and would rather spend any such money on the occasional DVD. 

So far as I can make out the vast majority of E-books are effectively imports to Britain regardless of the nationality of the writer, especially considering that Amazon insists that it doesn't do any trade in or from Britain. (My angel and I both have E-readers that don't accept Amazon E-book format files as we never buy _anything_ from them.) The main self-publishing websites are equally located in the USA, so the E-book industry appears to have almost nothing to do with the UK. It's not surprising when here a paper book doesn't attract VAT but an E-book, so far as I know, still does, being deemed by the government to be "software"! Having spent much of my working life writing software, when I wrote my novel I didn't realise that I still was. 

I may appear mean in my approach to reading but the truth is that I've never read that much fiction at all, so paying for it would be unusual. Equally I made my own novel available for free download on my own website and the only other items that I've written have all appeared in WF to be read for free here, so I work the same both ways. I have also written computer software for a charity for free since I retired. 

Beyond my personal practices, from what I've seen written about pricing E-books, the scale is seriously distorted by factors other than the quality and quantity of the writing, so I can't suggest any sensible figure.


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## Ralph Rotten (Jun 24, 2019)

Like I said: that chart is perception, not fact.
I see chatter online about what price range people shop in, little things here and there.

But this is Amazon's official chart on sales prices:







But this only speaks to profit per book, not necessarily will you sell many books at that rate.


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## Ralph Rotten (Jun 24, 2019)

This was interesting too:
https://www.thebookdesigner.com/2018/01/the-price-is-right-6-secrets-to-pricing-your-ebook/


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## columbo1977 (Jun 30, 2019)

Like most for me it depends on the author, and anticipation. I rarely buy hardbacks as they are so expensive I will usually wait for the paperback. But I am a sucker for signed copied from my genres.

It does really annoy me when eBooks are priced the same as paper books, they don't have all of the overheads so they should not cost the same.


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## Ralph Rotten (Jun 30, 2019)

PiP said:


> But you're the writer, Ralph, not the reader (aka not the person buying the e-book)  I've bought some excellent books by established authors at £0.99 . these are books which already have 100's of reviews.
> 
> We receive an email from Amazon every day with book offers and we always take advantage.




Few of those books started out as 99 cent books.
They were likely downgraded to help promote the newest book.
After your book has exhausted it's initial sales arc, you might as well use it to market your new books.


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## MatthewWilliams75 (Jul 22, 2019)

If you are a new author, wouldn't the goal be to sell as many copies as you can rather than make as much money as possible? I'd rather sell 100 copies at $1.00 than 20 copies for $5.00. You have more people reading your material and more potential future patrons.


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## PiP (Jul 22, 2019)

columbo1977 said:


> It does really annoy me when eBooks are priced the same as paper books, they don't have all of the overheads so they should not cost the same.



Exactly! I can't understand the logic behind this.



MatthewWilliams75 said:


> If you are a new author, wouldn't the goal be to sell as many copies as you can rather than make as much money as possible? I'd rather sell 100 copies at $1.00 than 20 copies for $5.00. You have more people reading your material and more potential future patrons.



If I was a new author I would also be more interested in selling more copies. It makes business sense to me to reach as many readers as possible rather than just those with deep pockets.


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## luckyscars (Jul 22, 2019)

PiP said:


> Exactly! I can't understand the logic behind this.
> 
> If I was a new author I would also be more interested in selling more copies. It makes business sense to me to reach as many readers as possible rather than just those with deep pockets.





MatthewWilliams75 said:


> If you are a new author, wouldn't the goal be to sell as many copies as you can rather than make as much money as possible? I'd rather sell 100 copies at $1.00 than 20 copies for $5.00. You have more people reading your material and more potential future patrons.



I don't necessarily disagree, but I think part of it is about perception.

Imagine we are talking not about books but about jeans. If you see a pair of $5 jeans on a rack, from an unknown brand, you are probably going to (reasonably) assume they aren't very good quality. You may still buy them, you may still not, but assuming you have the money to afford both options, you are as likely to buy a $500 pair of jeans as a $5 pair because you will assume (reasonably) the $500 pair is worth its price tag. It will offer better value in the long run.

If I see a .99 book on Amazon that does not seem to be on sale and I don't know the author and maybe there aren't a whole lot of reviews, I will probably assume it's some wannabe. That will even more be the case if it clearly lists Create Space or another 'Indie' as a publisher. Even more the case if it clearly has a generic 'free' album art' and a cliche title, etc. The fact it is listed for so cheap in that case screams to me 'PLEASE SOMEBODY BUY ME AND MAKE ME FEEL LIKE A REAL WRITAR". If it was $5 and had 10 verified reviews I know at least 10 people bought it, presumably at that price, and if those reviews are good then I know when those people say 'this was a great read' they are assessing it as a great read _at five dollars a ticket _rather than a great read for less than the price of a can of tuna. It means that the positive review seems more valuable because it took into account greater financial cost.

For all my 'I don't pay more than three bucks' I would _happily _pay $5 or more for a really good book that is somewhat life changing than a .99 book that is crap.

This comes back to the fundamental problem I have with self-publishing and why I don't do it: I know there are writers who take it seriously, operate with high degrees of professionalism, and are in any meaningful sense 'real writers'. But I also know for every one of those guys (let's call them _Ralphs_) there are probably 50, 70, rapidly approaching 100 or more people who are 'publishing' but shouldn't be. They don't have the skills, they don't have the quality standards, they don't really have the interest beyond showing off, and they don't invest. 

The difficulty is distinguishing between the two - the _Ralphs _and the _Ralph-nots_. Price tag vs apparent value is not the only way to do that, but it's part of it.


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## Aquilo (Jul 22, 2019)

luckyscars said:


> The difficulty is distinguishing between the two - the _Ralphs _and the _Ralph-nots_. Price tag vs apparent value is not the only way to do that, but it's part of it.



I'm just going to add to this and say there's three: Self-published, trade published, and then the hybrid authors. Hybrid authors are those who do both, and many do nowadays mostly because trade authors will have an established readership and for all the good that trade publishing does, authors only get a fraction of the money that crosses hands, so they will self-publish and cut out the middleman.


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## luckyscars (Jul 22, 2019)

Aquilo said:


> I'm just going to add to this and say there's three: Self-published, trade published, and then the hybrid authors. Hybrid authors are those who do both, and many do nowadays mostly because trade authors will have an established readership and for all the good that trade publishing does, authors only get a fraction of the money that crosses hands, so they will self-publish and cut out the middleman.



It's sort of a different topic I guess, but I totally understand why people self-publish for the reason you describe - it's owning a business as opposed to working for one.

What I really really hate about self-publishing is that it is now so entirely bogged down with unreadable _scheisse_ I now pretty much refuse to buy self-published/Indie books unless I am totally, one hundred percent convinced I am getting quality. 

These days literally the first thing I do is check to see if the book I am about to get is self or traditionally published. If it's the former I will google the shit out of it for reviews and other evidence that it's worth the time and money (I am more annoyed by the time than the money as while most ebooks don't cost much I don't believe in giving up once I start so usually end up reading it until the end and if it's not very good that's a waste of time). 

I don't even trust the Amazon reviews anymore unless there are a large number of them and they are at least mostly verified purchase.


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## Aquilo (Jul 22, 2019)

luckyscars said:


> I don't even trust the Amazon reviews anymore unless there are a large number of them and they are at least mostly verified purchase.



Thing is, there are too many authors who scam the system for my liking on amazon, including those who run teams of click baits. It's barely about writing, more about how many people you can get to click through you pages to get page reads, especially in the likes of KU. I know a lot complain about Goodreads, but the reviews are more honest there, and less likely to belong to click-bait farms. With Amazon, I'm less likely to trust an author if their reviews come in pver 100 plus within a few days of being published.


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## Bayview (Jul 22, 2019)

That chart from Amazon isn't a static thing - they actually look at books that are somehow "similar" to the book being published, and give a different price point for different books. I've had them recommend $2.99 for some books, and $3.99 for other books. Not sure what the variation is based on.

(Also, it DOES show projected sales, not just profit. The curved, dotted line is the projected number of sales.)


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## MatthewWilliams75 (Jul 22, 2019)

luckyscars said:


> I don't necessarily disagree, but I think part of it is about perception.
> 
> Imagine we are talking not about books but about jeans. If you see a pair of $5 jeans on a rack, from an unknown brand, you are probably going to (reasonably) assume they aren't very good quality. You may still buy them, you may still not, but assuming you have the money to afford both options, you are as likely to buy a $500 pair of jeans as a $5 pair because you will assume (reasonably) the $500 pair is worth its price tag. It will offer better value in the long run.
> 
> ...



I understand where you are coming from. But even someone like Stephen King was unknown at one point. I assume authors with a larger following have a professional website. So yea, if King was selling e-Books, he's probably charging over $10. But that's b/c he can. A new author can raise prices as he/she becomes more established. But when you first start out, you do what you need to do to get your book out there.


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## Ralph Rotten (Jul 22, 2019)

luckyscars said:


> If I see a .99 book on Amazon that does not seem to be on sale and I don't know the author and maybe there aren't a whole lot of reviews, I will probably assume it's some wannabe. That will even more be the case if it clearly lists Create Space or another 'Indie' as a publisher. Even more the case if it clearly has a generic 'free' album art' and a cliche title, etc. The fact it is listed for so cheap in that case screams to me 'PLEASE SOMEBODY BUY ME AND MAKE ME FEEL LIKE A REAL WRITAR". If it was $5 and had 10 verified reviews I know at least 10 people bought it, presumably at that price, and if those reviews are good then I know when those people say 'this was a great read' they are assessing it as a great read _at five dollars a ticket rather than a great read for less than the price of a can of tuna. It means that the positive review seems more valuable because it took into account greater financial cost."_


_


Yup. Apparently the perception of price with regard to book quality is because they are Veblen goods. I have no idea what Veblen means, but this guy wrote an interesting article on pricing books and how people's perceptions are changing. My books sell [new] for $4.99+, but I may discount them later just to help sell an upcoming book (or discount the first book in a series to get new readers into the franchise.)

https://scribewriting.com/book-pricing-guide/
_


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## Ralph Rotten (Jul 22, 2019)

I thought this part of the article was the most interesting:








And my paperbacks are usually about $15, which is inline with this:


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## MzSnowleopard (Jul 22, 2019)

I remember when the average paperback was $ 5.99 & $ 6.99. I did a lot of reading back then. 

These days, for me it's about the length of the book and the age of the book, along with the writer's talent and history (previous works). More times than not, however, I go for the bargain bin like my DVDs. Very rarely, if ever, will I pay new price for a DVD. I did with Black Panther because I thought it was worth it. I did with Captain America because despite the time since it's release, that brat was not coming down in price. 

I prefer hard cover because they last. I'll buy the paperbacks and e-books as a type of 'chance reading' Meaning, if I like the story enough I'll sell it to a used book store then buy hard cover. If I decided I don't like the book, I can sell it and be done. Sure, I'd be out a- few bucks in the balance sheets but that's the life of collecting. right?

At least with e-books, we can take them with us while the hard cover copy sits in the library at home.


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## Ma'am (Jul 24, 2019)

Most of my ebook revenue is from loans, where people sign up to pay $10 per month to read unlimited ebooks, up to ten at a time, from authors who have signed up with that Amazon program (I forgot the name of it). I believe you get the same amount regardless of the cost of the book, about 1/2 US cent per page read. So the price of the ebook itself doesn't matter that much. 

However, most of mine are priced at $2.99. The problem with that is it could mark a book, in customers' minds, as self-published or "bargain bin" (lower perceived quality). But mine are short how-to guides and I think customers' pricing expectations are different for them than they are for novels anyway.


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## Aquilo (Jul 25, 2019)

Ma'am said:


> Most of my ebook revenue is from loans, where people sign up to pay $10 per month to read unlimited ebooks, up to ten at a time, from authors who have signed up with that Amazon program (I forgot the name of it)



KENP (through KU and Koll)?



> However, most of mine are priced at $2.99. The problem with that is it could mark a book, in customers' minds, as self-published or "bargain bin" (lower perceived quality). Bu mine are short how-to guides and I think customers' pricing expectations are different than they are for novels anyway.



See, now I don't see low cost as a sign of lower quality. Most times I see mostly as page length, although I have one on Amazon at .99 which is a 90k novel, but then readers had been so patient over my rights reversal, I wanted one novel offered at a continuous low price for them. You can't do a Perma free on there, so this was the next option.


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## Art Man (Aug 17, 2019)

PiP said:


> I'm curious, how much would you (as a reader) be prepared to pay as for an e-book, especially by a new author?
> 
> 
> I found this article interesting
> https://www.thebookdesigner.com/2018/01/the-price-is-right-6-secrets-to-pricing-your-ebook/




I would never purchase an Ebook. I'm old fashioned and like a physical copy. If I'm reading stories online they are going to be posted on forums or blogs and done for the love of the craft without the pressure of impressing Simon or astounding Schuster. I don't like the idea of an Ebook and reject the idea of reading a 1000 page novel on a razor thin electronic tablet. I want that physical mass that comes with it and that feel of the pages between my fingers. I want to use it as a coffee coaster or let it plop on my chest when I fall asleep so I can scramble for the bent up bookmark when I wake up and try and remember where it should go and dammit I might have to throw it at the cat when it scratches at the door frame. No, Ebooks suck. One Ebook is too much.


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## RLBeers (Aug 18, 2019)

I have a massive (more than a ton in weight) of books, hardback, soft... but I found that I really appreciate the convenience of being able to carry my library with me on a small thing device. That being said, an ebook, because of issues with electricity and technology, does not have the permanency of a hardback. Therefore, a new novel in epub should be a much lower price than one where you can flip the pages. I will not pay above $3 per download. Kindle unlimited is a good way to go.


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## Cephus (Aug 19, 2019)

RLBeers said:


> I have a massive (more than a ton in weight) of books, hardback, soft... but I found that I really appreciate the convenience of being able to carry my library with me on a small thing device. That being said, an ebook, because of issues with electricity and technology, does not have the permanency of a hardback. Therefore, a new novel in epub should be a much lower price than one where you can flip the pages. I will not pay above $3 per download. Kindle unlimited is a good way to go.



Same here. I used to be a physical book only guy, but my bookshelves are full. I can't fit anymore. So now, I only get ebooks. I can carry thousands of books with me anywhere I go. My device keeps track of where I am. I can take notes, I can mark up the book if I want, and it remains pristine forever, no matter how many times I want to read it. There really are no downsides to ebooks. I will never buy another physical book again.


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## Ralph Rotten (Aug 19, 2019)

Cephus said:


> Same here. I used to be a physical book only guy, but my bookshelves are full.



Funny thing; although I sell far more eBooks than print, and am quite computer literate, when I am serious about evaluating a new book of mine, I always request a printed proof.

There is just something about a print book that gives me a better feel for a story than the electronic version.

But RL is right: There should be a substantial discount for an eBook versus a print book.
Patterson is an ass for charging $14 for one of his eBooks...especially since half of them are ghost-written by lesser writers.

I buy ebooks in the $4-$7 range.


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## Elvenswordsman (Aug 19, 2019)

Thinking as a buyer, I find anything over $10 sends me looking for other content, unless it's a necessary read.


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## Ralph Rotten (Aug 19, 2019)

Even when I sold Calizona 3.5, which was actually 2 books in one (Season 3 & Book 4) I only sold it for $6.99.
And that's almost a half million words worth of binge-reading.

*Note*: I sold it that way to avoid half-life. I sold just as many copies of book 4 as 3, and still made more than $2 each.


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## Bayview (Aug 19, 2019)

I value books based on the content, the words inside - I prefer reading e-books, and I value my time too highly to waste it reading things I don't think I'll like, so I pay what it takes to buy the words I expect to like.


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## James Wolfe (Aug 19, 2019)

If or when I do self-pub my books (eBooks), I plan to put it for about $3 to $5, so that readers can enjoy and if they end up liking my works, won't have to much regret. 

Though this logic is coming from personal experience where I have bought some awful crap for $3 to $5 dollars, and only a couple times I regretted spending that. Hopeful that won't be the case with my stuff. Plus alot of my books are part of series with the current one having about 4 books, so a set would be around $12 to $20 dollars.


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## Cephus (Aug 20, 2019)

James Wolfe said:


> If or when I do self-pub my books (eBooks), I plan to put it for about $3 to $5, so that readers can enjoy and if they end up liking my works, won't have to much regret.
> 
> Though this logic is coming from personal experience where I have bought some awful crap for $3 to $5 dollars, and only a couple times I regretted spending that. Hopeful that won't be the case with my stuff. Plus alot of my books are part of series with the current one having about 4 books, so a set would be around $12 to $20 dollars.



Keep in mind that with Amazon's royalty structure, anything under $2.99 or over $9.99, you only get 30%, as opposed to 70% in the sweet spot.


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## James Wolfe (Aug 20, 2019)

Cephus said:


> Keep in mind that with Amazon's royalty structure, anything under $2.99 or over $9.99, you only get 30%, as opposed to 70% in the sweet spot.



I will keep that in mind,  .  

so if I read it correctly $5 is fine for 70%, sorry I easily confuse myself.


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## Cephus (Aug 21, 2019)

James Wolfe said:


> I will keep that in mind,  .
> 
> so if I read it correctly $5 is fine for 70%, sorry I easily confuse myself.



Yup, that works.


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## Ralph Rotten (Aug 21, 2019)

Well...it's 70% BEFORE they add any download fees.
If you have a lotta images in your book, then you may pay extra.
But you do not wanna compress the crap outta your pics if you do.
Always use high quality pics in case the reader wants to double-tap an pinch-zoom the image.


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