# Which books have you found most helpful?



## Justin Rocket (Jan 26, 2014)

This week I discovered a most excellent book on storycraft.  It is _The Novel Writer's Toolkit_ by Bob Mayer.  I highly recommend it.   But, it got me wondering what  books you've found most helpful as a writer.  

What are your favorite books on writing?


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## Kyle R (Jan 26, 2014)

Like you, I am a fan of the _Save the Cat! _series, by Blake Snyder. Blake breaks the code into an excellent, easy to follow roadmap.

_Story Engineering_ by Larry Brooks breaks the four-act structure into no-nonsense terms. It's a little broader than the individual beats that Blake Snyder uses in _STC!_, but Brooks goes a little into more depth in different areas that complement _STC!_ well (and vice-versa). 

The way to construct a complete character arc, as taught in _Plot versus Character_ by Jeff Gerke, will always be a part of my writing.

Dwight Swain's _Techniques of the Selling Writer_, along with the more modern companion book, _Plot and Structure_ by Jack Bickham, have both helped me tremendously in terms of better grasping the micro and macro levels of dramatic fiction. MRU's especially (Motivation-Reaction Units) have deepened my writing and enhanced my use of POV, though there was a long learning curve before I got to the point where I can apply that to my prose without conscious effort.
_
Structuring your Novel_ by K.M. Weiland takes all of the above books and combines them into one book, introducing and breaking down beats, on the plot-structure level, as well as techniques, on the micro-level. If I had read this book earlier, I'd have considered it my favorite book on writing of all time. But, since I'd already been introduced to the subjects in the earlier books, I knew most everything in there already. Still, I recommend it and consider it an excellent composite of all the necessary instruction available for novelists/storywriters out there.

Noah Lukeman's _The First Five Pages_ was a book I carried with me for over a year. I consulted it almost daily, and it helped me scrub away many of the amateur mistakes my writing was laden with.

There are over a dozen other books on the craft I've read, but I haven't revisited any of them since. The ones above are frequently on my Kindle rotation. :encouragement:


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## Pluralized (Jan 26, 2014)

Chuck Wendig has written a couple of really fun books on writing better stories - 500 Ways to be a Better Writer is my favorite so far. He's pretty crass, to the point, and no stranger to the difficulties of being a professional writer. Highly recommended. *It's cheap, check it out.*

Also, I stumbled across *this one* from Nigel Watts. Really hard to find book. I lucked up on paperbackswap.com and came away with a copy. It's really valuable reading. 

Great thread, and some excellent suggestions put out there by Kyle. 

To honestly say my 'favorite' book on writing? Probably *"How Fiction Works"* by James Wood.


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## Jeko (Jan 27, 2014)

Two things, really: The Elements of style, a kind of writer's bible, and The Bible. The latter being infinitely more important than any other book; while it doesn't teach me how to write, it guides my outlook into one that is incredibly suitable for writing.



> To honestly say my 'favorite' book on writing? Probably *"How Fiction Works"* by James Wood.



I love Wood as well, though I'd say his books are better suited for critics than for creative minds. Still, he manages to be in-depth, structuralist and inspiring on every page.

I also enjoyed Stephen King's On Writing.


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## Mr mitchell (Jan 27, 2014)

One book: Stephen King: on writing -which has helped to develop as a writer.


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## ppsage (Jan 27, 2014)

For anybody interested in fiction, _How Fiction Works _is a great read. Not so much a compositional manual though, if that's what you think you want.

Quite a few of the Watts available at abebooks.com. Mostly in the U. K. but shipped to U. S. for under ten bucks (US) total. U. K. to U. S. shipping has come down a lot past few years.


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## David Gordon Burke (Jan 27, 2014)

Cadence said:


> ...and The Bible. The latter being infinitely more important than any other book; while it doesn't teach me how to write, it guides my outlook into one that is incredibly suitable for writing.



Truthfully, I can totally get behind that idea.  Not to go off on a religious bent but just from the point of view of language in general, how many idiomatic expressions and turns of a phrase come from the Bible?  

On a different note, there is a universality about the bible (and the torah and koran etc.) that speak to the human experience.  Wake up some of that deep human yearning in your writing and you have something....well, DEEP.  Life, death, sex, violence.  Those are some hefty themes.  

My first two books deal a lot with spiritual issues ... (indirectly) 
I always write about God...I mean Dogs....I mean God.

David Gordon Burke


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## Deleted member 49710 (Jan 27, 2014)

I like John Gardner's _Art of Fiction._


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## bookmasta (Jan 27, 2014)

Never ready any books of such genre and don't plan on starting.


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## Justin Rocket (Jan 27, 2014)

David Gordon Burke said:


> Truthfully, I can totally get behind that idea.  Not to go off on a religious bent but just from the point of view of language in general, how many idiomatic expressions and turns of a phrase come from the Bible?
> 
> On a different note, there is a universality about the bible (and the torah and koran etc.) that speak to the human experience.  Wake up some of that deep human yearning in your writing and you have something....well, DEEP.  Life, death, sex, violence.  Those are some hefty themes.
> 
> ...




While I'm a Christian, I'm also trained as an anthropologist.  As such, I draw on myths from around the world, not just from the Bible.  Storytelling has a special kind of magic and always has.  I fear that our culture's emphasis on science and technology puts that in jeopardy.  I hope it survives, because I can't imagine a world (and don't want to imagine) a world without mythology.


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## BobtailCon (Jan 27, 2014)

Justin Rocket said:


> I can't imagine a world (and don't want to imagine) a world without mythology.



There will always be mythology.


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## Bruno Spatola (Jan 27, 2014)

I don't know. Hasn't science and technology brought us films, videogames, and the internet? If anything, it's enriched mythology. 

Just my take. Anyway, yeah, thanks for the suggestions of books on writing. Will source some of them out. I need to get to the next level of my ability. I'm sick of floundering on my keyboard at five in the morning.


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## BryanJ62 (Jan 27, 2014)

*FOR WRITERS ONLY by Sophy Burnham*

*I loved her style. It makes you realize we all share the same stuff in this crazy thing we love doing.*


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## Jeko (Jan 28, 2014)

> I fear that our culture's emphasis on science and technology puts that in jeopardy. I hope it survives, because I can't imagine a world (and don't want to imagine) a world without mythology.



Science and technology only contribute to mythology; they are evolving it as we speak.

Furthering that, studying such interesting quirks of human society is, IMO, far more creatively enriching than reading a book on how to write.


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## Alexa (Jan 28, 2014)

I instinctively wince when I see _The Elements Of Style_ recommended in threads like this. It wasn't originally written for fiction-writers, has nothing to do with that at all and seems to me to be responsible for untold problems and difficulties of aspiring writers. Just my perspective, of course.

The writing book that I've found most useful is Andre Jute's _Writing A Thriller_. It's great, whether what you're writing is a thriller or not.

My next two, each very commonly recommended by successful authors, are Jack Bickham's _Writing And Selling Your Novel_ and Dwight Swain's _Techniques of the Selling Writer_.

The one I've found most interesting and enjoyable is Rosemary Friedman's _The Writing Game_ (it's the literary autobiography of a successful British novelist, together with some writing observations and advice).


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## Jeko (Jan 28, 2014)

> It wasn't originally written for fiction-writers, has nothing to do with that at all and seems to me to be responsible for untold problems and difficulties of aspiring writers.



While you say the other books are 'commonly recommended by successful authors', The Elements of Style is as well. And how does it have nothing do with writing fiction?


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## Justin Rocket (Jan 28, 2014)

Cadence said:


> Science and technology only contribute to mythology; they are evolving it as we speak.
> 
> Furthering that, studying such interesting quirks of human society is, IMO, far more creatively enriching than reading a book on how to write.



Joseph Campbell would vehemently disagree with you over whether studying the structure of story is enriching.
I disagree with you as well.


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## Justin Rocket (Jan 28, 2014)

Alexa said:


> seems to me to be responsible for untold problems and difficulties of aspiring writers. Just my perspective, of course.



Can you imagine if Samuel Clemens clung to a book like the Elements of Style while he was writing Tom Sawyer or Huckleberry Finn?


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## BryanJ62 (Jan 28, 2014)

*I have always enjoyed books on this subject that tell the experience of writing. Either the journey to get published or the experience they had writing the novel. I think most of us know how to write. We all have our own style and if you work at it long enough you'll get it. It's the stories that I find fun.*


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## Justin Rocket (Jan 28, 2014)

As for why I say that science and technology are crowding out mythology, ask any Hitchens style atheist.


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## Jeko (Jan 29, 2014)

> Joseph Campbell would vehemently disagree with you over whether studying the structure of story is enriching.
> I disagree with you as well.



I wan't talking about studying the structure of stories in that post. I was espousing studying what to write over studying how to write as a means of creative enrichment.

Regardless, structure is a tool and an aid for design. Working out how to use that tool allows you to consciously make decisions on the organization and presentation of your story. It also helps you to better liberate yourself from it if that benefits your work.

If people have issues with The Elements of Style, could we have examples? I haven't found a word or piece of advice in that book which I've disagreed with or which hasn't benefited my study of the craft.


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## Justin Rocket (Jan 29, 2014)

Cadence said:


> I wan't talking about studying the structure of stories in that post. I was espousing studying what to write over studying how to write as a means of creative enrichment.



I was pointing out that knowing what works and what has worked (which the study of structure as per Campbell offers) can never be a bad thing to learn as a writer.



Cadence said:


> If people have issues with The Elements of Style, could we have examples? I haven't found a word or piece of advice in that book which I've disagreed with or which hasn't benefited my study of the craft.



I believe Samuel Clemens' work is one example of what happens when a writer let's the rigor of "approved grammar" fall by the wayside and focuses, instead, on verisimilitude.


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## stephpend (Jan 29, 2014)

I like _Elements of Style_, _On Writing_ by Stephen King, _Outlining Your Novel_by K.M. Weiland, and, of course, my thesaurus.  

I lurve my thesaurus!


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## Jeko (Jan 30, 2014)

> I believe Samuel Clemens' work is one example of what happens when a writer let's the rigor of "approved grammar" fall by the wayside and focuses, instead, on verisimilitude.



And he is commendable for it. What is your point? That a writer was successful without the book? I can give you a writer who was with it, and then we'd be back where we started.

Specifics, please. In what way are the Elements definitely incorrect, or harmful, to a learning writer? If it's a matter of opinion and preference then that's respectable. But if anyone believes it is a 'bad' book to guide yourself with, that needs some strong justification.


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## Gavrushka (Jan 30, 2014)

Read what you feel the need to read, but then turn your mind to your own words rather than those of others. I find that posting work here, and having others dissect it, is of far more benefit than intellectual sparring matches over what is an is not the best source of writing inspiration.

You both come across as technically proficient, and that is good. - I'm sure many of us would appreciate it if you offered up those skills in critiquing our work. Hell, I certainly would! - I'm light years behind you both, technically, and perhaps I could grow as a writer from your advice.


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## Jeko (Jan 30, 2014)

> is of far more benefit than intellectual sparring matches over what is an is not the best source of writing inspiration.



Apologies if it comes across as such, but I'm not trying to have a sparring match. A book I love has been attacked without justification; hence, I would like that justification. That's all I'm asking for at the moment.


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## Gavrushka (Jan 30, 2014)

LOL... My intent was selfish... You're both people I respect on this site, and I was trying to goad you into a critique! 

It's time I read Elements of Style again... As with any book, we can take as much or as little as we like from it. - We don't have to mirror the author's views to find merit within the pages.


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## Jon M (Jan 30, 2014)

Gardner's _On Becoming A Novelist_ has always been my favorite; first two-thirds of _Art of Fiction_ is a little too philosophical for my tastes, but the last part is great.


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## Justin Rocket (Jan 30, 2014)

Cadence said:


> And he is commendable for it. What is your point? That a writer was successful without the book? I can give you a writer who was with it, and then we'd be back where we started.
> 
> Specifics, please. In what way are the Elements definitely incorrect, or harmful, to a learning writer? If it's a matter of opinion and preference then that's respectable. But if anyone believes it is a 'bad' book to guide yourself with, that needs some strong justification.



Writers need to know when to break the rules, but The Elements of Style is all about adhering to the rules.


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## Kyle R (Jan 30, 2014)

Since my last post in this thread I've read two more books that I'd like to add to my list of helpful titles:

_Writing the Romantic Comedy_ by Billy Mernit, and _Writing Screenplays that Sell_ by Michael Hauge. Both excellent resources and instruction in their respective categories. 

Most especially in Mernit's book, I learned a simplified, easy to apply way of using thematic axioms to structure a story (every story should have a thematic argument at its core, and every scene should prod that theme in one direction or another. A scene may be great, but if it doesn't relate to the theme in some way, it can probably be left on the cutting room floor). 

With Hauge's book, my favorite snippet of knowledge was his method of constructing a scene from the end and starting out with "on the nose" dialogue, as well as his identification of the four main archetypes (which other books do as well, but he applies it in the simplest manner): Hero, Nemesis, Romance, Reflection.


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## Gavrushka (Jan 30, 2014)

Justin Rocket said:


> Writers need to know when to break the rules, but The Elements of Style is all about adhering to the rules.



One of the things that sticks in my mind about reading Elements of Style is that it states that if you're going to break the rules, make sure you have a good reason.

NOW, for someone as inept as I, it's a good idea to_ know_ the rules in the first place so I can make an informed choice as to whether to follow them or not. One way or the other, a writer does need to become technically proficient, and be aware of the common mistakes that can be made, but I don't suppose it matters where you learn them from. From my perspective, Elements of Style is a good source but I respect that there will be plenty of others.


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## Justin Rocket (Jan 30, 2014)

Gavrushka said:


> it's a good idea to_ know_ the rules in the first place



whose rules?  For example, Clemens was following the rules of grammar in place among the people of the geographic region he was writing about.


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## dale (Jan 30, 2014)

the books i have found most helpful are well written prose fiction ones. i've read non-fiction books on writing before, and i really found nothing
very helpful in any of them.


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## Justin Rocket (Jan 30, 2014)

KyleColorado said:


> in Mernit's book, I learned a simplified, easy to apply way of using thematic axioms to structure a story



This sounds really intriguing, but I'm afraid it might be too much like Dramatica.  I'm going to have to read up on it.


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## Gavrushka (Jan 30, 2014)

Justin Rocket said:


> whose rules?  For example, Clemens was following the rules of grammar in place among the people of the geographic region he was writing about.




I accept there are other sources and, yes, other rules...

BUT you've missed the point of my post (perhaps intentionally). You stated, as an original reason for dismissing Elements of Style: 





> Writers need to know when to break the rules, but The Elements of Style is all about adhering to the rules.



and I said it states quite the opposite! SO you're changing your argument so you can stick to your original premise rather than changing your mind?



> Rather than searching out that which reinforces our view, we should seek out that which challenges it. Only then can we become all we are capable of being.


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## The Tourist (Jan 30, 2014)

For me, it's not a book, per se.  Let me explain.

I have a lot of dialog in my tale, and one of the major flaws I find in literature is that author tries to make the discussions catchy, striking and usually utilizing too much jargon and buzzwords.  If anything, the books I've read serve as *bad examples*.

I finally just started doing those sections of my book at 2:00AM and reading the quotes aloud.  I remove all of the clumsy over-the-top nonsense the moment my tongue trips over the problem.

What I did find useful was remembering all of the discussions I heard in saloons--_in fact, if any of you can name a good book in that genre I'd appreciate it_.  I found that all of the human foibles manifest themselves as folks drink, play silly games, hustle up women, pull pranks, and lament about their jobs.

If I could convey those ideas in smooth, easy dialog I'd consider it a success over forced popular vernacular.  To be frank, the discussions within most books is a let down for me.


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## Justin Rocket (Jan 30, 2014)

Gavrushka said:


> you're changing your argument so you can stick to your original premise rather than changing your mind?



Forget it, man.  There's nothing productive in talk with an Internet stranger once they shift their focus from the topic and onto the other person.


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## Jeko (Jan 30, 2014)

> Forget it, man. There's nothing productive in talk with an Internet stranger once they shift their focus from the topic and onto the other person.



Unless I'm missing something, I don't think Gavrushka said anything about you; only that he's unclear what your actual view is, since you appear to have changed it.



> Writers need to know when to break the rules, but The Elements of Style is all about adhering to the rules.



'It is an old observation that the best writers sometimes disregard the rules of rhetoric. When they do so, however, the reader will usually find in the sentence some compensating merit, attained at the cost of the violation. Unless he is certain of doing as well, he will probably do best to follow the rules. After he has learned, by their guidance, to write plain English adequate for everyday uses, let him look, for the secrets of style, to the study of the masters of literature.' - _Introduction to the original text
_
'Up to this point, the book has been concerned with what is correct, or acceptable, in the use of English. In this final chapter, we approach style in its broader meaning: style in the sense of what is distinguished and distinguishing. Here we leave solid ground. Who can confidently say what ignites a certain combination of words, causing them to explode in the mind? Who knows why certain notes in music are capable of stirring the listener deeply, though the same notes slightly rearranged are impotent? These are high mysteries, and this chapter is a mystery story, thinly disguised. There is no satisfactory explanation of style, no infallible guide to good writing, no assurance that a person who thinks clearly will be able to write clearly, no key that unlocks the door, no inflexible rule by which writers may shape their course. Writers will often find themselves steering by stars that are disturbingly in motion. 
The preceding chapters contain instructions drawn from established English usage; this one contains advice drawn from a writer's experience of writing. Since the book is a rule book, these  cautionary remarks, these subtly dangerous hints, are presented in the form of rules, but they are, in essence, mere gentle reminders: they state what most of us know and at times forget.' _V - An approach to style_

Have you actually read The Elements of Style? You demonstrate the most common misunderstanding of the text, and you still aren't giving proper examples. You're giving interpretation without evidence. 

I'd happily have a discussion about the validity of parts of the text; I often do so with myself.  But this interrogation of the advice is as useful as the advice itself; a writer not only trains by understanding the rules, but by questioning the rules to understand them further as well.


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## Gavrushka (Jan 30, 2014)

*removed* and apologies once again


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## The Tourist (Jan 30, 2014)

Gavrushka said:


> *removed* and apologies once again



Hey, Leroy Jethro Gibbs Rule Number 6.  It applies to life, and certainly in here.  Personally, I like your stuff, never quit talking, and never be dissuaded.


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## Gavrushka (Jan 30, 2014)

LOL. - I never do quit talking, I've a sphincter bypass for when my mouth needs a rest... The transition is seamless. I'm horrified at the thought I caused someone offence. (Other than to you, Mr Tourist, you grubby little man! *snickers*)


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## The Tourist (Jan 30, 2014)

Gavrushka said:


> (Other than to you, Mr Tourist, you grubby little man! *snickers*)



LOL.  The proper epithet in my case is "scruffy."  Sorry, I was an English minor in college.

I never did see the sin in a little thread drift.  Yikes, be an adult, if you don't like the rhythm of the post, skip over it.  If you don't like the member, put them on 'ignore.'

Again, you're a guy I seek out to read.  I don't want those members hesitant to post.  BTW, if the I'm the OP of a thread, drift away all you want.  I'd like to hear your opinions, and perhaps I've missed something.


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## Terry D (Jan 30, 2014)

This thread was started to ask about books we find helpful. The simple fact is that most writers find _The Elements of Style_ very helpful--I know I do. I've also found a number of books on writing fiction by Lawrence Block very helpful; books like _Telling Lies for Fun and Profit_, _Spider Spin Me a Web_, and _Writing the Novel from Plot to Print_. Mostly, though, the books which taught me the most about writing are the stories I love reading.

BTW--Twain's use of the vernacular in _Tom Sawyer_ and _The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn_ worked because of his mastery of proper writing techniques. As a skilled journalist he knew how and when to break the rules because he knew the rules.


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