# Amazon, and the problem with reviews



## Ralph Rotten (Jul 27, 2019)

There is a lotta discussion (arguments really) out in the writing community over Amazon's review sweeps that often pull dozens of reviews off of books. I have even met people who got lifetime banishment from posting reviews...simply because they were a blogger or book reviewer.

The deal is that Amazon strictly prohibits _*quid pro quo*_ reviews, which is just. _Paying for reviews is a lowly thing_.
But the rub comes from their definition of _quid pro quo_.
For instance, if you send a book to a reviewer and they review it, that is considered _quid pro quo_.
If you exchange reviews with another writer, that may be considered _quid pro quo_.
If the algorithm spots you reviewing a lot of people who review you back, they may gank ALL of your reviews.


But if you were Penguin Putnam, you would have an avenue to send out review copies, and those reviews would be sticky.
But Indies & self-pubs get treated like crap, even though we now account for over 40% of the market.

Your thoughts?


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## seigfried007 (Jul 27, 2019)

Yikes. 

I suppose any action to correct for paid reviews is going to have drawbacks--especially for Indies. Professional reviewers don't get reviews in return for reviews--they get paid by a neutral intermediary (or should, if the world was perfect). But Indies don't have that luxury--we have to trade reviews, which unfortunately has led to a lot of scams and fake-o reviews proliferating.


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## escorial (Jul 27, 2019)

Since consumerism we have all been manipulated by so much but if a thing can make you like something then job done....interlectual property is prob now of more value than bullion


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## Aquilo (Jul 27, 2019)

I'm always dubious about peer reviews, to be honest. I know authors aren't going to be as critical as they should be if they know they're getting a review in return, which isn't fair to readers, even if authors are open about it is a peer review. But how Amazon has come down on the likes reviewing blogs who do speak honestly, I think that's extreme. I know a few reviewers who have been banned too.

I think what gets under my skin a little is an author having an ARC team and who offer rewards like Amazon vouchers etc (I've seen a few), where they are using their fans as their ARC team to review a release for them. It bypasses reviewing blogs, who can offer a more objective reviewing policy. Yeah, it's damn harder to get a review with a reviewing blog, but it can be a way to help scam the system if you use your own ARC team, IMHO.

No matter what, it's tough, and it's not helped one bit by the authors who know how to scam, whether it's through click farms, book stuffing, ughh.. it's endless, and I get so sick of hearing the new ways they screw the system. And that apparently includes the latest one who was banned for Amazon for unnamed reasons, and who was then taken on by a publisher to possibly get around the ban. That one seems to have hurt authors already with that publisher, as it gives the green-light on cheating the system.


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## Ralph Rotten (Jul 28, 2019)

My thinking is that Indies should have an avenue for sending out books to reviewers & bloggers, without those people being banned.
After all, Amazon is in this to make money, and I just wanna help them do it because I have a vested stake in the process.

I'm leaning towards starting a movement in the #WritingCommunity to appeal to Amazon to open up a way.


But how do you delineate something like that?
Bloggers & reviewers..okay!
Peer reviews by other authors...should be okay...?
Exchanging reviews....that is getting into quid pro quo territory.

I mean, really all Amazon has to do is add an option (right between "Order an Author Copy and Send a Proof Copy) that allows you to drop-ship books to reviewers, along with a cheat sheet (reviewer always want some details like cost, publisher, etc).
When they send out the copy, you take that *receipt number* and give it to the reviewer so they can use it to obtain a *verified review*.
All it would take is a little code, and we could sell more books.


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## Aquilo (Jul 28, 2019)

That's a cracking idea, Ralph. If the reveiwers could get listed with Amazon in a way, away from reader-reviewers on there.


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## Ma'am (Jul 28, 2019)

Also, when a review disappears, we often don't know why (and Amazon won't tell you). Something on the reviewer's end, that has nothing to do with you, could have gotten it flagged. It's also possible that the reviewer deleted it themselves for some reason.


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## Sir-KP (Jul 28, 2019)

Reviewers themselves nowadays are malicious. They don't actually review. It's all bent.

Review has become a mainstream medium for people to freely shit on something they are clueless about. And the problem is that it's still being consumed and those who work as journalist aren't doing much better either.


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## Aquilo (Jul 29, 2019)

Sir-KP said:


> Reviewers themselves nowadays are malicious. They don't actually review. It's all bent.
> 
> Review has become a mainstream medium for people to freely shit on something they are clueless about. And the problem is that it's still being consumed and those who work as journalist aren't doing much better either.



I wouldn't go that far.   It's like with anything: you always get the bad pennies. But the majority I know are very professional.


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## Ralph Rotten (Jul 29, 2019)

Sir-KP said:


> Reviewers themselves nowadays are malicious. They don't actually review. It's all bent.
> 
> Review has become a mainstream medium for people to freely shit on something they are clueless about. And the problem is that it's still being consumed and those who work as journalist aren't doing much better either.




I get most malicious reviews removed.
Amazon wants to make money, so they care not for trolls.
Remember, those reviews are in THEIR store.


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