# finite linger



## Mesafalcon (Jun 11, 2015)

Desperate singers trading whispers for lingers
Famous faults frequent swingers
Smoking pipes reading about snipes
Little sense to comprehend 

Distant darkness lonely fingers
It figures...
Pulling out and grasping triggers
Dodging bullets marked for winners

New age rest stops employing plumbers 
Endless dancing on the highway of killers
Twisting trees slashing windmills
Finite space for massive pillars


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## musichal (Jun 11, 2015)

This shot so far above my head that I entirely missed its meaning.  I'm not even sure I'd understand if you explained it.


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## Mesafalcon (Jun 11, 2015)

Its just fun with words and ryhmes

Thats all, why look so deep？


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## musichal (Jun 11, 2015)

Mesafalcon said:


> Its just fun with words and ryhmes
> 
> Thats all, why look so deep？



See, told you I wouldn't understand, LOL.  :???:


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## Mesafalcon (Jun 11, 2015)

Now we'll have to see what the other two and a half people who comment on my poems think！


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## Sonata (Jun 11, 2015)

I did not understand it either but then I am massively sleep deprived.  

And probably just plain stupid!


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## Sonata (Jun 11, 2015)

Mesafalcon said:


> Now we'll have to see what the other two and a half people who comment on my poems think！



Who exactly is the half a person?


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## Mesafalcon (Jun 11, 2015)

Sonata said:


> I did not understand it either but then I am massively sleep deprived.
> 
> And probably just plain stupid!



No, there is Nothing to understand. Its abstract.

Just read and think, okay, thats Cool.


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## Firemajic (Jun 11, 2015)

Fabulous imagery... 'nuff said... Abstract, yeah... nice word play, so I enjoyed that... Thanks.. Peace always... jul


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## aj47 (Jun 11, 2015)

Mesafalcon said:


> Desperate singers trading whispers for lingers
> Famous faults frequent swingers
> Smoking pipes reading about snipes
> Little sense to comprehend
> ...



Stringing together random words is like stringing together random notes on a sax--it's not improvisation, it's a mess.  This reads the same way. As I believe critique would be wasted on this work, I'm not giving any.


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## Dove (Jun 11, 2015)

Actually it does make sense - one merely has to look beyond what is being said. In that sense the "mess" is superior than something that is spoken so plainly a blind man can see it. Some of the best and most famous poets wrote abstract just like this - it didn't necessarily catch cause you got to be swift for this method of writing]. 

It is a method of writing that allows the reader to make what they would of it. 

My interpretation:
I'm going to use the reference to celebs as that'd be the easiest to draw comparison for most... but the poem can apply to absolutely everyone and anyone. 

_Desperate singers trading whispers for lingers_ - singers can mean anything [famous people], the rest someone who trades whispers [gossip, whimsical] for lingers [lingers - lingering - a concrete life / concrete fact as fact lingers longer than gossip]
_Famous faults frequent swingers_ - famous faults [every famous person seems to have almost the same faults - drugs, cash, divorce, murder, etc.] ... frequent swingers [speaks for itself]
_Smoking pipes reading about snipes _- smoking pipes [the rich, those above such gossip] reading about snipes [snipes - gossip / rumors / lies]
_Little sense to comprehend_  - the wealthy don't understand why those gossip rags, etc. flaunt their faults as they too are human


_Distant darkness lonely fingers_ - the rich / wealthy as always held above the average person. Lonely. My uncle, an engineer, knows a very well off businessman in Dubai. Part of the RF actually. Wealth doesn't equal you being un-alone.
_It figures..._ - obvious statement 
_Pulling out and grasping triggers_ - Pulling out of the lime light. Grasping at straws / triggers - try to salvage what is left of a "normal" life. 
_Dodging bullets marked for winners_ - given the rest an ironical statement. Are the rich really winners? To the average joe they certainly are. 


_New age rest stops employing plumbers_ - new age [new generation - so more computer, etc. skills] and the rest stops employing plumbers [ironic statement, plumping is an old skill and often something life long. Life long actors from the 50s are far superior than most modern ones and older workers are typically better (harder working) workers.]
_Endless dancing on the highway of killers_ - "killers" is a mockery word. Endless dancing as it sounds - highway of killers... a mess up by a famous person can ruin their career [career killing moves]. 
_Twisting trees slashing windmills - _open to meaning. Twisting trees, twisted lives. Slashing windmills [windmills are influenced by the weather - you can have one barely move for an entire week and then go on a tail spin in a heavy breeze... how whimsical life is
_Finite space for massive pillars - _pillars the figurative ball and chain. Finite space - limited space. Limited movement. Limited life bound by the pillars that people set for themselves. 


*Personally I absolutely LOVE it. 
*
It is so hard to find people with this talent nowadays as said the average writer types stuff out you could be blind and still grasp it. 

Kudos Mesafalcon. 

Incredible work.

I'd say keep it up but... not sure what sort of response you'd get if publish for the above mentioned reasons.


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## Mesafalcon (Jun 11, 2015)

astroannie said:


> Stringing together random words is like stringing together random notes on a sax--it's not improvisation, it's a mess.  This reads the same way. As I believe critique would be wasted on this work, I'm not giving any.



Its about ryhme and rythm.

And just having fun with words. Just enjoying connecting sounds. Why would i pressure myself for a meaning everytime?


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## Dove (Jun 11, 2015)

Personally I think it's fantastic. It's like an abstract painting - each person views it as they want and see what they wants. 

Essentially you have to see *behind / beneath *the words written. 

I am guessing it maybe easier for me to visualize seeing as my background is painting [that's what I do to make some extra cash]. 

However, for me it reads about the lamented life of some celeb or likewise "rich" person held above the norm of society. You just got to look to see it.


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## Mesafalcon (Jun 11, 2015)

Dove said:


> Personally I think it's fantastic. It's like an abstract painting - each person views it as they want and see what they wants.
> 
> Essentially you have to see *behind / beneath *the words written.
> 
> ...



_Thank you very much Dove! I appreciate your comments!

_I see you understand that my poems are really for the reader to fill in there own meaning. My poems do not aim to tell you how to feel or try and express how I feel. They are just food for the imagination. 

 I just write and think later.


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## escorial (Jun 12, 2015)

abstract words..i'm intrigued....I like abstract art and my mind is trying to mix abstract words....you touch on random notes you like to play....your ok with the reader to interpret the meaning but there is none from the author of the piece....I can't get my head around it..it's like punk poetry to me when music was stripped back to basics and the experience was more important than the content...an odd experience for me this piece...but intrigued man


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## -xXx- (Jun 12, 2015)

*volunteers*
*1/2 peep*


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## JustRob (Jun 12, 2015)

So we must interpret it for ourselves. A sandcastle facing the incoming tide, its apparent form a transient illusion. We may perceive how much effort went into its construction but ... too late, only the endless beach of words remains. It's always a pleasure to take a walk along the beach though.


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## Harper J. Cole (Jun 12, 2015)

Kind of reminds me of "I am the Walrus".

I can see why it wouldn't be to everyone's taste, but I rather like the flow of it.

HC


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## Mesafalcon (Jun 12, 2015)

HarperCole said:


> Kind of reminds me of "I am the Walrus".
> 
> I can see why it wouldn't be to everyone's taste, but I rather like the flow of it.
> 
> HC



Im a big Beatles fan... that is an interesting comment. 

I think I may have a love/hate type style.

Thank-you for pointing that out.


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## musichal (Jun 12, 2015)

koo koo kachoo   :star::star:


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## Mesafalcon (Jun 14, 2015)

musichal said:


> koo koo kachoo   :star::star:



Best response I ever got on a forum

And Ive been surfing forums since forums were forums

Maybe out of boredom

Probably out of longing

For

More


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## ArrowInTheBowOfTheLord (Jun 14, 2015)

Good rhyming, and there is meaning, even if that meaning is simply the feeling of chaos. It references the modern world a lot too, I think, so it seems to be about the chaos of the modern world.

Specifically, to me, the first stanza is about how people trade "whispers" of truth, for pleasure, but then they find they can't understand truth anymore. .."reading about snipes" references how a lot of mainstream media is pointless. The second stanza is about how people want to hold onto something, but their "lonely fingers" only touch darkness and "triggers," which I imagine to mean the triggers of guns, so they end up harming other people and themselves. The third stanza is about how this "new age" is so broken up and chaotic, and that last line is about how when you keep your mindset limited to the finite, there's no room for the "massive pillars" of life. The title "finite lingers" is about how the things that seem to last are really just finite--they will end.

All of this may not necessarily be what you meant, but that's what it felt like to me, and it at least seems to be about how our world is chaotic and finite.


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## Darkkin (Jun 14, 2015)

In all honesty, I don't care for ink blot poetry, (a.k.a. free verse with no purpose, let's just let people make up their own meanings...).  Some people find it intriguing, but I have to agree with astroannie.  Poetry needs to have a purpose or a point, whether it is nonsense for the sake of nonsense, e.g. Lewis Carroll's _The Jabberwocky_ or Edgar Lear's _The Owl and the Pussy Cat _or simply a classical sonnet.

As a reader, if I've just winnowed my way through a poem with no meaning or purpose, I come out feeling shortchanged.  It isn't up to the reader to complete the writer's thoughts, ideas, and motivations.  That is in essence the very heart of writing, the purpose of writing:  to give voice to thoughts, stories, ideas that might, otherwise, be lost.  Pieces like this come across as incomplete homework, due five minutes ago...ideas plucked at random from around a room and jerryrigged together to seeming immensely thought provoking and deep.  People being people, will follow the line.  Great for a sociology experiment, not so much if one is looking to improve one's writing.

I don't play the fool, so I don't go digging for meaning, I am I too dense to see it, (very strong probability, but there just might be the other chance that there is no meaning.  Po, would understand the whole secret ingredient dilemma.).  One of the main purposes as a writer is to help a reader understand, more often than not fault lays with the material, not the reader.  The whole purpose of critique is to look at one's own work from an outside perspective, to improve.  But how does one critique if there is no meaning, no point?  I'm rank among those to desperately thick to figure that point out.


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## Mesafalcon (Jun 14, 2015)

Darkkin said:


> I don't play the fool, so I don't go digging for meaning, I am I too dense tosee it, (very strong probability, but there just might be the other chance thatthere is no meaning. Po, would understand the whole secret ingredient dilemma.).One of the main purposes as a writer is to help a reader understand, more oftenthan not fault lays with the material, not the reader. The whole purpose ofcritique is to look at one's own work from an outside perspective, to improve.But how does one critique if there is no meaning, no point? I'm rank amongthose to desperately thick to figure that point out.



Okay. You just made a HUGE statement in my opinion with this : O_ne ofthe main purposes as a writer is to help a reader understand..._First of all, writing is an art form, not only that is the art form with the most freedom you can possibly allow one. 

There is no close to zero budget needed to embrace the hobby opposed to recording music, painting or the most expensive, making your stories/thoughts visual in the form of video/movies.

When you have an art form so diverse and easily accessible, can you really saywhat one of it's "main purposes" is? The only purpose I can find for writingis making someone feel something. The quality of the feeling varies is the onlything. Would you want writting to have a main purpose? If it did,recording history seems like number one far and away.

But, let's stick with poetry... 

I think, when many people think of poetry, they try to make a body ofwork that is written in stone, or written in the stars for the words to beheavy, emotional, and convey wisdom, show feelings and get their personal message across. Or, in other words, something "solid."

I like to look at poetry as giving the reader a piece of clay, something that is flexable, something they can manipulate to what they want. This is done bycombining words that you normally wouldn't see together and usually have no reasonby to used together like this :_Desperate singers trading whispers for lingers _From my POV, this meaning is cut and dry, and if I explain it, it should be easy for anyway whoever fantasized of becoming a famous singer knows.

When you try to break into the music industry, you have a voice, you can perform, but in comparison to how loud the singers are who have already madeit, it is low - like a whisper. 

Most singers are pretty "desperate" to get breaks, make contacts and generally get a foot in the door. It's important, time is of the essence. The older you get, the harder it gets. 

Most singers try for a loooong time but do not make it in te business, they perform and try to make it, so these performances over the years of trying to make it are the whispers that linger. 

This is what I got, and a few posters got something totally different, which isthe beauty of it.

If you write some line like:

And I loved you December
without you cold lingers
I remember your whispers
you wished you could be a singer

How much can you get out of “simple words” no matter what order I put them in?Sure, everyone may get _something slightly different,_ but the flexibility of "normal" words is low is comparison to the exotic...


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## escorial (Jun 14, 2015)

I've come to terms with dada poetry...


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## Darkkin (Jun 14, 2015)

Mesafalcon said:


> And I loved you December
> without you cold lingers
> I remember your whispers
> you wished you could be a singer



You made ten times more sense here with those four simple lines than you did in your entire poem _because_ you had a point, a purpose.  _That _is what poetry is, verse with purpose, not a morass of oblique regurgitation there for the reader to shape as they please.  I read for the writer's insight, not my own.  I know my own thoughts, which is another reason why I even bother to read.  I'm probably an idiot because I find way more meaning in those four simple lines, but then that is simply life, isn't it.


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## Mesafalcon (Jun 14, 2015)

Darkkin said:


> You made ten times more sense here with those four simple lines than you did in your entire poem _because_ you had a point, a purpose.  _That _is what poetry is, verse with purpose, not a morass of oblique regurgitation there for the reader to shape as they please.  I read for the writer's insight, not my own.  I know my own thoughts, which is another reason why I even bother to read.  I'm probably an idiot because I find way more meaning in those four simple lines, but then that is simply life, isn't it.



Right. But it's dull in my personal opinion, and there most be literally _millions _of poems like it out there. Which is my point.

Why would I want to read variations of the same over and over... *_sigh_* and over...

I like fresh words and new mixtures. Something that stimulates my mind. I don't like creating the familiar with a tool that gives me so much freedom to roam and explore.

Why would you keep calling yourself an idiot and "thick"? I am not completely sure the point you are trying to get across with it...


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## Kevin (Jun 14, 2015)

> I'm probably an idiot because I find way more meaning in those four simple lines


 baloney. You don't like abstract. So? You're allowed. 





> _Desperate singers trading whispers for lingers _From my POV, this meaning is cut and dry,


 I thought so too. The rest sort of lost me. Sort of like impressions of ideas but I struggled to find a connection between them. JMO


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## Mesafalcon (Jun 14, 2015)

Kevin said:


> baloney. You don't like abstract. So? You're allowed.



This is true. Like and dislikes are of course a right every reader has.

But, I think it is clear to see, this has caused quite a discussion, which it what lies at the heart of a forum. 

It is meant to stir things up and bring out something in you that may not have come out had I just posted type B:

And I loved you December
 without you cold lingers
 I remember your whispers
 you wished you could be a singer

How much can be said about this before discussion runs out and/or repeats?


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## Darkkin (Jun 14, 2015)

Think Drax from _Guardians of the Galaxy_, metaphors go straight over my head.  I translate on a literal level; abstract poetry cripples my thought process.  It isn't something I can ever comprehend.  Many would call that dense, thick, or in some cases, stupid, (I'll spare the details).  Something basic, like what do you see in this ink blot, I will tell you quite simply, a mess.  

I cannot extrapolate from an existing, ambiguous set of criteria.  I need clear lines or a completely blank slate.  Partial or prefabricated content without reason or purpose has me asking the question, why?  Why should I have to do this, to find my own definition out of someone else's work?  Why can't I do my own?  To this day, no one has been able to answer that question.  

Poetry is a medium of measurement, beauty, and logic.  You say it is simplified and overdone, boring...There is beauty in a perfectly tuned C.  Simple, widespread, but so essential to music.  But it is boring, so cut it away and fill in the holes with what?  This is what ambiguous poetry does, leaves gaping holes in the weave of a symphony.

Some people love the abstract, as is their right, but it is a simple concept I will never comprehend and it isn't from lack of trying.  I'll be sticking with my boring, million other like type poems.  There is a reason I'm Darkkin, the Tedious, after all.  Interesting debate, though.  :applause:


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## Mesafalcon (Jun 14, 2015)

Darkkin said:


> Think Drax from _Guardians of the Galaxy_, metaphors go straight over my head.  I translate on a literal level; abstract poetry cripples my thought process.  It isn't something I can ever comprehend.  Many would call that dense, thick, or in some cases, stupid, (I'll spare the details).  Something basic, like what do you see in this ink blot, I will tell you quite simply, a mess.
> 
> I cannot extrapolate from an existing, ambiguous set of criteria.  I need clear lines or a completely blank slate.  Partial or prefabricated content without reason or purpose has me asking the question, why?  Why should I have to do this, to find my own definition out of someone else's work?  Why can't I do my own?  To this day, no one has been able to answer that question.
> 
> ...



That clears it up better for me.

I respect this honesty : _metaphors go straight over my head.  I translate on a literal level; abstract poetry cripples my thought process.  It isn't something I can ever comprehend.  Many would call that dense, thick, or in some cases, stupid.
_
But umm, I think you have the ability to comprehend it, right? Maybe not my writing, but perhaps more streamlined methapors?

And ya, they can be "stupid." I'll admit that. 

If you ever listened to Beck, and especailly his earlier and mid-career work, you realize he is a brillant musician who writes random, ridiculous lyrics. After a while, you realize what's being said, doensn't mean that much in the end. It's all about how it sounds. It's almost as he is poking fun at serious lyrics (successfully) and showing with great music behind it, all that lovely, dovely, try-hard to win your heart stuff is just as "stupid" as just putting down what comes to mind. 

Like : 

Alphabet, alphabet
 Can't afford a telephone
 Black hole, black hole
 Nothing's gonna harm you


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