# How do I write it so people don't call the police in the age of cellphones?



## ironpony (Apr 1, 2018)

Basically I have a story set in modern times.  It's a screenplay written for modern times mostly because it's lower budget that way, but also, I don't think my story would work so well in a 1990s or prior setting.  It's a crime thriller, however, there are scenarios where I want the characters to fight the villains, and be helpless and on their own, without the police knowing about everything, cause for the plot to go the way I want it to go, the police have to be kept in the dark about certain things.

However, in the age, of cellphones, why wouldn't you call the police to save your own life...  I thought maybe the gang of villains could have a cellphone jamming device that they carry with them all the time, so whenever they are in a certain range of the good characters, the good characters cannot use their cell phones when they try.

But I was told by people, that it seems far fetched that a gang of street criminals, who aren't rich white collar criminal types, would have cell phone jammer with them all the time, for this purpose.

But what do you think?  Are their more convincing ways to write around this cell phone plot hole problem?


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## Blackstone (Apr 1, 2018)

Besides the obvious lost cellphone/no signal probably the most likely (and most intriguing) reason would be because the good characters operate outside of the law themselves and would be in a situation where the police would not necessarily take their side. Like vigilantes for instance.


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## Bloggsworth (Apr 1, 2018)

Make them Amish...


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## ironpony (Apr 1, 2018)

Well if I use the lost signal idea, would the reader think that it's too convenient that the character just happen to not get a signal at the exact time he needed to?

Also, there's a scene where an innocent person gets accidentally shot.  Now for the story I want him alive temporarily to give up certain information before he dies, that drives the plot.  However, would the hero let him die, without calling an ambulance, just cause he is operating outside the law?  Sure the hero is operating off the radar, but letting this person die, just to stay off the radar, I cannot see him doing, especially when the person knows crucial information that could help the police.

But at the same time, for the plot to go how I want it to go, I don't want him to be able to call the 911 and let them know.  So I cannot figure out how to get rid of the cellphone problem, unless I use the lost signal or low battery idea, but I think it gets to the point where the reader rolls their eyes and think "of course they couldn't make a call at this exact time".


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## Char_M (Apr 1, 2018)

ironpony said:


> Basically I have a story set in modern times.  It's a screenplay written for modern times mostly because it's lower budget that way, but also, I don't think my story would work so well in a 1990s or prior setting.  It's a crime thriller, however, there are scenarios where I want the characters to fight the villains, and be helpless and on their own, without the police knowing about everything, cause for the plot to go the way I want it to go, the police have to be kept in the dark about certain things.
> 
> However, in the age, of cellphones, why wouldn't you call the police to save your own life...  I thought maybe the gang of villains could have a cellphone jamming device that they carry with them all the time, so whenever they are in a certain range of the good characters, the good characters cannot use their cell phones when they try.
> 
> ...


So a few different thoughts. Maybe the criminals are known to steal phones.  Maybe they home make EMP's to disable anything from interfering with their prey. Maybe they only hit in areas known to get no reception? Just some thoughts off the top of my head. 

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


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## ironpony (Apr 1, 2018)

Okay thanks.  If a cell phone jammer is too far fetched though, wouldn't a home made EMP device be far fetched as well?  I mean I have never even heard of a criminal using one in a crime, ever, unless I have been living under a rock.

As for hitting areas without reception, what kind of areas would these be, since it seems every area, has reception nowadays with today's technology, or at least it seems compared to ten years ago.  Basically I wanted a particular crime to take place at a self storage facility, but do those areas have reception?


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## Blackstone (Apr 1, 2018)

ironpony said:


> As for hitting areas without reception, what kind of areas would these be, since it seems every area, has reception nowadays with today's technology, or at least it seems compared to ten years ago.  Basically I wanted a particular crime to take place at a self storage facility, but do those areas have reception?



I mean, yes most would have reception but this is where 'suspension of disbelief' comes in I think.

There was a story I read once as a kid where some children got kidnapped by an African tribe (not very politically correct) and were about to get eaten or whatever when suddenly one of them realized that there was to be a solar eclipse happening in, wouldn't you know it, five minutes. So, knowing this tribe worshiped the sun, they used the eclipse to pretend the sun was being eaten, which distressed their captors enough to let them go. Ridiculous, but at the time I thought that was awesome...

So maybe you aren't writing for children so have to be a little bit more believable, but don't worry about that too much. Most adults aren't much smarter when it comes to stuff that. It causing a problem is unlikely _provided _you execute with confidence and consistency. Consider the premise of a movie like Armageddon in which the whole thing rests on the ridiculous idea it is easier to train oil drillers to be astronauts than astronauts to be drillers. It's nonsense, but the movie insists its plausible and in the moment most viewers' BS alarm does not sound.

I live near a major city and still don't get service everywhere. Here are some other ideas:

- Have them disable the phones as mentioned
- Have them actively seek out areas without coverage and then lure their targets to those areas
- Have them just not care and leave it to pure chance/stupidity on the part of the victim(s) that they don't think of it
- Have them confiscate the phones immediately at gunpoint
- Have the victims be afraid of the police - illegal aliens?
- Have them be Amish
- Have them be armless.


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## ironpony (Apr 1, 2018)

Okay thanks.  Basically in my story, the villains find out that the hero is following them around trying to get proof on when they will commit their next time.  When the villains find this out, they want to find out who this hero is and what he wants.  So maybe they could lure him into a place with no cameras, and no cell-phone coverage specifically.  I don't want the villains to take the hero's cell phone away though, cause that would mean that they would have to kidnap him, and then he would have to find some way to get away, which is even more unlikely, cause how does one get away after having people pointing guns at you.

But there is also two people that are following the villains not just one, and I want to make him unable to use his phone as well.  Perhaps I could go with the no coverage idea.

Do you think the idea I had before of the gang having a cell phone jammer is too high tech for a gang to have, like people told me?


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## Moonbeast32 (Apr 2, 2018)

Bloggsworth said:


> Make them Amish...



That would only work if you were willing to devote much time to researching and learning about such a people, and that just to sift true facts from pop media portrayal.

Or you could just take the easy way out and "invent" a new culture that ends up being the sum of all you know about that particular people minus their name


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## ironpony (Apr 2, 2018)

Well there is probably different approaches I can take, just not sure which one, especially if I want to use the idea, of not calling for help, more than once in the plot.

Here is a scene from a movie, that is similar to the situation in my story, cause in my story, a cop shoots another cop by accident, but I do not want the cop to call for help.

However, in this scene, the cop also does not call for help, but why?  The scene is a bit violent if that's okay:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRXkLLBrBtA


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## Jack of all trades (Apr 2, 2018)

Not all calls get handled correctly. It takes time for help to arrive, once called. Would the person know the address? It's harder to locate a cell phone than it seems, as there are cases where police arrive to late because they can't track the phone.


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## ironpony (Apr 2, 2018)

That's true.  However, I want the hero to frame the villains for the killing of the other cop, and clean up any evidence that he was at the scene, and frame them for it.  And get out of there, without leaving a trace that he was there.  So would he be able to do all that before, and get out of there, before the police arrive, since I am guessing he would have to go get bleach, to clean up the crime scene, and then come back to it?

But the thing with that is, is that in order for the police to not think he was there at all, he wouldn't be able to make the call in the first place at all, cause it would be traced back to him.  But at the same time, he doesn't want to let an innocent man die, before he does.


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## Underd0g (Apr 2, 2018)

High security military bases and prisons confiscate phones.
They could replace the phone later


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## senecaone (Apr 2, 2018)

This has been solved in many ways in recent years. Hacking individual phones, steering cell tower traffic, blacking out all  frequencies, etc.  Spend a few hours on netflix watching spy thriller series or movies and you will see them all employed, then pick one that works for your scene. Better yet, if you can invent a new twist? That would make your work -so- extra!


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## K.S. Crooks (Apr 2, 2018)

The ordinary reasons to not call- phone is dead, no signal (out of tower range or underground, forgot to bring phone
It could be situational- phone gets damaged, phone ends up in water, they are too busy trying not to get shot to make the call, they are also doing something illegal, they want to take on the villains on their own to satisfy some desire.


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## senecaone (Apr 2, 2018)

K.S. Crooks said:


> The ordinary reasons to not call- phone is dead, no signal (out of tower range or underground, forgot to bring phone
> It could be situational- phone gets damaged, phone ends up in water, they are too busy trying not to get shot to make the call, they are also doing something illegal, they want to take on the villains on their own to satisfy some desire.



throw away the burner phone. get tracked by the burner phone. a side character makes the "bad phone call". hostage hides a phone and calls mom, or dad, or a friend. enemies and friends track the call. The plot devices with cell phones are all explored. Again, the hard part is to come up with something new. If you can do that, you win!


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## ironpony (Apr 2, 2018)

Okay thanks.  I'm having more difficult with my situation, cause I have two characters who would be motivated to call for help, but don't want them to be able to.  When it's two characters, like if both their phones got damaged, or both their phones were dead and won't work, then it might come off as more forced I feel.

When it comes to tracing GPS on a phone, does the phone company have records of where the phone is all the time?  Like if the police were to go to the company and say "We need to know where this phone was on January 10th, 2 AM, would the phone company have records of that, going back a few weeks?

As for tracking a phone, would a gang of crooks have the technology to track the main character's phone causing him to throw it away?  I was told it was too far fetched that they would have a cell phone jammer, so wouldn't it be too far fetched that they would have cell phone tracking technology?

Plus if you are in a situation where people are looking for your with guns, and one person has already been shot and needs medical attention, would you:

A. Call the police.

B.  Throw away your phone, out of fear that the people looking for you, know your phone number and are tracking it.

It seems option A, is probably what most people would choose in that situation, so does throwing away a phone out of fear of being tracked, work?


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## Bodes (May 21, 2018)

If you don't use it too much, you could do a scene-type where the 911 operator doesn't believe the person calling. Perhaps there had been a few events like that in the history of the town, so police were less likely to respond as if it were a serious call. Maybe the criminals even call the 911 center after the victim and explains that it was merely a joke, his daughter playing a prank, not knowing what she was doing, etc. Maybe he threatens loved ones until the victim calls back 911 and tells them it was a prank.

If done correctly, this scenario would likely take the fear level notch up a bit too. It's happened in the news a few times, where 911 doesn't react appropriately and someone dies because of miscommunication, and its always horrifying to think of the possibility that they could have been saved had the 911 operator talked a bit quicker or not been dismissive.


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## FireofDarkness (May 21, 2018)

As for dead battery or dead zones:
If you use foreshadowing properly about his battery being low or his car charger being broken... or it beeping low battery at him on his last phone call... The reader, will understand when he needs the phone & can't because the battery is dead & they will likely feel bad for him...

Otherwise if you foreshadow that this one area is a dead zone with previous calls dropping or knowing he can't call in this area for previous small things, when something big happens, the reader will remember that in this area he has no signal. the "why did it have to happen there? poor guy" idea...


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## FireofDarkness (May 21, 2018)

Jack of all trades said:


> Not all calls get handled correctly. It takes time for help to arrive, once called. Would the person know the address? It's harder to locate a cell phone than it seems, as there are cases where police arrive to late because they can't track the phone.



It get's really complicates if someone doesn't know quite where they are. Police can't find them & it takes a lot longer for police to arrive, if ever. The triangulation can often only narrow it down to a couple square miles, good ones can narrow it down to a city block.

For delayed PD response: if they are in a rural area it takes longer for police to arrive. If some big security event is taking all the PD or if a previous/in progress large crime is taking most of the PD elsewhere...


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## bdcharles (May 21, 2018)

ironpony said:


> Basically I have a story set in modern times.  It's a screenplay written for modern times mostly because it's lower budget that way, but also, I don't think my story would work so well in a 1990s or prior setting.  It's a crime thriller, however, there are scenarios where I want the characters to fight the villains, and be helpless and on their own, without the police knowing about everything, cause for the plot to go the way I want it to go, the police have to be kept in the dark about certain things.
> 
> However, in the age, of cellphones, why wouldn't you call the police to save your own life...  I thought maybe the gang of villains could have a cellphone jamming device that they carry with them all the time, so whenever they are in a certain range of the good characters, the good characters cannot use their cell phones when they try.
> 
> ...



Well why stop at a gang of street criminals? Why not have a more savvy gang, perhaps conneted to the first, take down the network, introduce a bit of shadowy cyber-thriller to it. Gives you scope as well as logic. Failing that have some unusual weather or an EMP blast. Or make it happen during a time of blackout (either accidental or deliberate)


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## Theglasshouse (May 21, 2018)

I've seen in movies where the person doesn't call because they have a hostage somewhere or a different situation where they hurt the person captive by a person who is sort of an idiot (example could be an obese person who could fit the role and could be too slow to catch someone who is faster running, or maybe a wounded person guarding them). Or maybe they could damage something valuable I imagine they own. But that would be more challenging and would require thinking outside the box.


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## Sir-KP (May 22, 2018)

I think bad signal coverage or just bad provider can be the sole reason to that. I mean, I myself live in capital city, using one of the oldest mobile phone coverage provider available and signal is total crap. The previous one can even barely call or receive call whenever I was at my home.

This can be the weak characteristic of the city in your story.


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## Renaissance Man (May 22, 2018)

ironpony said:


> Basically I have a story set in modern times.  It's a screenplay written for modern times mostly because it's lower budget that way, but also, I don't think my story would work so well in a 1990s or prior setting.  It's a crime thriller, however, there are scenarios where I want the characters to fight the villains, and be helpless and on their own, without the police knowing about everything, cause for the plot to go the way I want it to go, the police have to be kept in the dark about certain things.
> 
> However, in the age, of cellphones, why wouldn't you call the police to save your own life...  I thought maybe the gang of villains could have a cellphone jamming device that they carry with them all the time, so whenever they are in a certain range of the good characters, the good characters cannot use their cell phones when they try.
> 
> ...



Yes! Most people don't have their local P.D.'s number on their auto-dial and 911 is notoriously rigid about protocols. If you answer their questions out of the appropriate order, they can keep NOT connecting you to the police. If the call is *terminated* protocol is to send police to the last known GPS location of the call. But if the caller deems it "nevermind" I *think* it will be chalked up to crank calling.


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## ironpony (May 22, 2018)

Okay thanks.  As far as 911 not responding properly, I don't want any 911 calls to be made, cause then the person calling, their voice will be recorded, and I don't want the police to be able to ID the protagonist's voice later on, which they will, if he is able to call.  So I have to be able to remove 911 calls from going out at all therefore.



FireofDarkness said:


> As for dead battery or dead zones:
> If you use foreshadowing properly about his battery being low or his car charger being broken... or it beeping low battery at him on his last phone call... The reader, will understand when he needs the phone & can't because the battery is dead & they will likely feel bad for him...
> 
> Otherwise if you foreshadow that this one area is a dead zone with previous calls dropping or knowing he can't call in this area for previous small things, when something big happens, the reader will remember that in this area he has no signal. the "why did it have to happen there? poor guy" idea...




Well I could use the dead battery thing, but the reader might think "oh what are the odds that his battery would be dead, just as a plot convenience, when it's needed at the most crucial time".  They may see it as a perfectly timed plot convenience but not sure.  I could write it so that for one particular scenario, the villain leads the hero into a dead zone deliberately, in order so that the hero will not be able to call for help, for when the villain wants to trap him in this section of the plot.

However, what kind of place would a cell phone not work in?  Basically the villain wants to trap the hero and box him in and shoot him to death, so he would have to do this in a place, out of the city, where there are no witnesses around.  What kind of dead zones would there be out of the city?


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## Theglasshouse (May 22, 2018)

A cell phone does not work in mountains for instance where wireless technologies are too far away to send any information. On a roadside, where for example the very rural countryside. Imagine a cave, there would be no communication or under a tunnel network. In a tunnel where there is a highway. In the remote reaches of civilization, there isn't much demand for services. Imagine a remote desert there is no communication.


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## ironpony (May 23, 2018)

Okay thanks.  I'm writing this screenplay to be shot in a certain city though, and there are no mountains or desert around.  There are trees and grass out of town.  Is their any type of buildings or places that would work to block out cell signals?

I don't think a cave could work, cause the villain is trying to lead the hero into a trap and I don't think the hero would be dumb enough to go into a cave in that situation.  And if he were in a tunnel, if he was being shot at, he would want to get out ASAP, so I don't think that might not work either, when it comes to the hero wanting to survive.  They villains could trap him in the tunnel, but then he would have no cover to hide with, and it's all open, and he would get shot.


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## Phil Istine (May 23, 2018)

ironpony said:


> Okay thanks.  I'm writing this screenplay to be shot in a certain city though, and there are no mountains or desert around.  There are trees and grass out of town.  Is their any type of buildings or places that would work to block out cell signals?
> 
> I don't think a cave could work, cause the villain is trying to lead the hero into a trap and I don't think the hero would be dumb enough to go into a cave in that situation.  And if he were in a tunnel, if he was being shot at, he would want to get out ASAP, so I don't think that might not work either, when it comes to the hero wanting to survive.  They villains could trap him in the tunnel, but then he would have no cover to hide with, and it's all open, and he would get shot.



Would the following work?
The character doesn't use a phone contract as that would make calls traceable to him.  Or maybe couldn't pass a credit check.  So he runs an unregistered phone from top-up vouchers he buys in the newsagent shops.
Maybe you could portray him as being a bit incompetent so that he sometimes runs out of calling credit at critical moments.  Depending on characterisation, that might work better than a signal problem.  Indeed, if you want to show someone who is a bit forgetful or always too busy, it might help with that too.  Perhaps reinforce that personality trait by making him an incurable procrastinator.  Maybe he runs his fuel tank low too.  Or maybe you could think up another example?


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## sarahvdan (May 23, 2018)

I think you can get away with it as long as it's not the kind of device you use all the time. Your reader might go, huh, convenient, but if the story's good enough they won't mind. How many times have you screamed at someone not to run upstairs in a horror movie? Lost signal is a cliche, but you can use it. Are they in an area that might be bad for signal, a building or a basement? Could you foreshadow it by including them not getting a signal when they've needed it before the emergency happens?


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## Theglasshouse (May 23, 2018)

Along philisitines answer I will contribute this one: what if his telephone company plans were too expensive (it happens that they cut his services for being a bad customer or the victims in question making the phone call?), and he is low on money and signed on the cheapest plan. He forgot to pay his bill or doesn't have enough and is disorganized. It could be that he needs to reload his credit and is of low socioeconomic background or has trouble with saving money, or he simply bought something really expensive once in a lifetime recently like a house. You get it. His cell phone plans end. He rans out of credit. He can't have any options for days, since he uses pay phones to make phone calls. If your good guys are all family this solves some plot issues, maybe they live together, and share the bill.

Or the person made to many prank calls to 911. And gets filed for a report. A small misdemeanor, that is a criminal record. It speaks volumes about his character in that he is self-indulgent or humorous.

For dead zones, I know for example where you sometimes go to a parking lot. That is subterranean in a mall or in an ikea store for example there is no signal. Places uninhabited by civilization where communication is not too important to have. You can try this in real time as well whenever you go to a mall or ikea store. Maybe a building built for earthquakes has subterranean floors. That should also give you more ideas.

Depending at the time of day no one likes parking at night in an abandoned parking lot with no cars in the dark which would speak of his foolishness.


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## ironpony (May 23, 2018)

Yeah maybe some of these can work.  Basically for this scenario, the villains know that the hero is onto them and surveying them.  The hero is a cop surveying them on his own.  So the villains lay a trap for him to try to kill the hero and get him off their backs, but hero ends up accidentally killing, another cop, who is there for other reasons, by accident.

So the hero wants to cover up that he accidentally killed the other cop, and frame the villains for it.  But in order to pin it on the villains, and create deniability, the hero cannot call 911 cause then his voice will be recorded.  But if the hero accidentally shoots the other cop, his motivation would then be to call 911 cause he is going to panic and does not want to responsible for killing another cop.  So he is going to be compelled to call 911 to save him, but to also save himself from this shootout with the villains.

Once the other cop dies and is failed to be saved, then the hero comes up with the plan to pin it on the villains later, but he is still going to be compelled to call 911 for help originally, after shooting the cop, and I need to figure out a way to keep that call from being made.  Even if 911 think it's a crank call, they are still going to respond to it, if you say someone's been shot and needs help, and the hero's voice will still recorded, thus taking away his deniability, while pinning it on the villains.  So I need some reason for that call not to be made.


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## moderan (May 24, 2018)

There are lots of ways to disguise one's voice, even from the kind of sophisticated equipment the cops are gonna have. A comb and a piece of toilet paper would do the trick...and that one's older than I am.
Why does he have to make the call? Just shut up and let the cops investigate, and take advantage of the window to do something else. This seems overcomplicated. Have the other cop die in his arms for drama's sake, and get on with the 'trouble is my business' bits.


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## ironpony (May 24, 2018)

Well the reason he has to make the call is in an effort to save him.  Why is he going to let the cop die in his arms?  Why would not not try to call an ambulance to save him?


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## JustRob (May 24, 2018)

This is a fundamental aspect of fiction writing and how you tackle it determines how good a writer you are. Society is continually changing to close up all the loopholes that permit abnormal things to happen, so a writer inevitably has to introduce deviations from normal society to enable their story to develop. This is most likely why it is said that characters have to be flawed, but it can actually apply to any aspect of a story, such as the quality of cellphone coverage in a particular area. Our stories are intriguing because they go against the norm and in a way that reassures the reader because they are aware that the events in them are most unlikely to happen in their own secure reality. The skill comes in building up a collection of relatively trivial flaws that the reader does not realise will converge to produce a significant deviation from normal. However, the experienced reader will be on the lookout for these and will be unimpressed if you make it too easy to see them. 

The skill is in supplying the reader with the necessary information in good time so that you don't spring it on them at the last minute but you should do it obliquely, maybe putting it considerably earlier so that they have forgotten about it or putting it in a different form so that they haven't realised the implications. Personally I don't use a cellphone but my angel did buy me one for use in emergencies last year. However, as it is only for use when I am away from home I leave it in my jacket pocket and I have more than one jacket. When I leave home I choose which jacket to wear and then transfer the things that I may need to that jacket's pockets. There is always the possibility that I will overlook the phone while doing that. In fact I don't even wear a wristwatch normally either and only put mine on when I know that keeping an eye on the time while I am out will be necessary. Maybe in modern society this behaviour could be seen as a character "flaw" but it is just characteristic of me. How do "regular" people ensure that their phones stay with them at all times? Have they become part of their clothing that they would feel naked if they didn't have them? I suppose so, but we real people aren't all like that and as writers we are encouraged to avoid making our characters stock types, so why should a character obsessively carry their phone around with them all the time? Do they only own one jacket? Have they never left their phone somewhere? Are they such a safe sensible regular person that nothing worth mentioning in a story can ever happen to them?  

Regarding the possibility of bad cellphone coverage, just stating at the very last moment that this is so without giving the reader earlier clues is minimalist writing. It would be better to describe the setting for the events adequately in advance in such a way that the reader doesn't realise that you aren't just painting a a pretty picture but actually giving them pertinent information. The location may be a gloomy one because of high buildings surrounding it or there may be structures overhead, it even being effectively underground as someone suggested earlier. You may be able to mislead the reader into thinking that you are just creating an ominous atmosphere, not providing a reason for there to be no cellphone coverage just there. Equally you may have mentioned quite casually earlier a reason why the character wore a different jacket, the one without the phone in the pocket. The skill is in making the essential components of the story seem quite trivial at the time that you mention them.

When I wrote my solitary novel I included many apparently trivial details that were mildly entertaining at the time but not evidently important to the story in the long run. When it came to the climax of the story I brought many of these previously mentioned details back to the reader's attention as they provided the solution to the apparently insurmountable problem facing my characters. In effect I told the readers that they could have worked out that solution for themselves had they realised which earlier details were relevant. Even though the reader may not have realised it they were effectively reading a mystery story with clues spread throughout it. I favour my laid back rambling style of writing because it gives me such opportunities to surprise the reader. If you write too economically, including only what is absolutely essential to the story, then you don't get the same opportunities. 

To consider the extreme, they say that one shouldn't write long descriptions of sunrises because that is pointless prose, but what exactly lies in the direction of the sunrise and what exactly has caused the unusual pattern of colours in it that the writer has just described? It isn't so much what plot devices you use but more how you present them to the reader and what purpose they actually serve in the story that makes good writing.


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## moderan (May 24, 2018)

ironpony said:


> Well the reason he has to make the call is in an effort to save him.  Why is he going to let the cop die in his arms?  Why would not not try to call an ambulance to save him?



Then make the call, disguise the voice with a kleenex and comb, and get on with the story. Trying to influence the investigation is a blind alley.
To your question, for drama and personal motivation. Have you ever thought about acquiring a beta reader? Normally, that's who helps you think through or around these kinds of points.


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## Theglasshouse (May 24, 2018)

The example about a prank call, could be something someone in his family does. I use to phonecall the fire department after I went in a field trip to one when at a us school when I was was 5-7 years old and as a memory then I remembered I would always hang up. I think if you give your character a flaw, and try that out. He can eventually even get out of that situation by borrowing someone else's cell phone, by negotiating with a person and saying there is a police man that possibly is going to die. There are many ways one can be humorous, and that could be the joke that finally brings it sting to bear. Know the story about aesop's fable with the wolf and the sheep (the ending of the story is the wolf comes one day after lying that it came so many times)? Same example. Being humorous can be a flaw, one that can turn a situation upside down. Agreed with moderan and justrob's posts. Humorous is a dominant trait in a lot of people. I think I am learning more about writing characters analyzing this post. You need to improve the characterization. That way the plot twist becomes more believable.

So at first there is fear and trepdiation of not making the phone call. Then he summons the courage, or he tells someone else to make the phone call. With the condition his report be confidential. That may thicken the plot too.

Or maybe he used he did imitate people at a stand-up comedy of people he detested too. This goes along with the humor dilemma. 

More research needs to be done on this I know.


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## ironpony (May 24, 2018)

moderan said:


> Then make the call, disguise the voice with a kleenex and comb, and get on with the story. Trying to influence the investigation is a blind alley.
> To your question, for drama and personal motivation. Have you ever thought about acquiring a beta reader? Normally, that's who helps you think through or around these kinds of points.



Yeah I am going to get some newer beta readers once I figure out to write it .  If he calls the police with a disguised voice though, they will know to come and then he doesn't have time to frame the villains for it, if the police are on the way.

Why is influencing the investigation a blind alley?  The way the story goes, the hero framing the villains actually works, or that is how I want it to, so why is it a blind alley, if it achieves the result the hero wants?


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## moderan (May 24, 2018)

You're talking in circles.


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## ironpony (May 24, 2018)

Okay thanks.  Well I could just write it so that maybe being shot at causes him to drop his phone too, or that the lead villain, just says to his goons, that we have to lead the man into this area, cause cell phones don't work out there, without any further explanation, if that works?

Also why is manipulating the investigation to a personal advantage a blind alley?


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## moderan (May 24, 2018)

It doesn't need to be done, from what I can see. The possible negative consequences for your mc, should he be discovered, outweigh any advantages he might gain thereby.


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## ironpony (May 24, 2018)

But the MC is obsessed with nailing the villains and wants revenge on them from what they have done before, so the MC, now that he has the body of a dead cop, can make it look like they did it, and thereby achieving his revenge goal.  So that goal for him is worth it, or so I thought.


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## moderan (May 24, 2018)

You're trying too hard to make this thing fit preconceived boundaries and not really thinking it through. This has been evident in the threescore or so of posts you've made regarding this 'screenplay'. This is the stuff you bounce off of beta readers, who can help you to shape your narrative. That includes the 'research' stuff, most of which is easily found by a casual google.
Cart before the horse. Do all of the research and then frame the story. I'd look especially into cases of obsessive behavior for the hooks, instead of making stuff up. It's better to proceed from a point of understanding, in my experience, than to conjure out of whole cloth.
You think tv crime show writers just pull stuff out of their butts? I know a few. They spend most of their time researching, and a good percentage of that time studying human nature. Doesn't always make it to the final product, but there's a hell of a lot of prep involved in a shooting script.


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## ironpony (May 24, 2018)

Okay thanks.  You say cart before the horse, but one thing I keep reading in writing books, is to know how you want to end your story and then build into that ending. Would that be wrong, and the ending should be the absolute last thing, and I should plan out the whole story completely linearly?

Even John Truby said to come up with your ending very earlier on so everything can build into that, so I am not sure what writing philosophy to follow now, if that is putting the cart before the horse.

I did come up with the ending and all rest of the story first, and then I was revising it I thought, oh crap, what am I going to do about the cellphones being a problem.  But is this a fixable problem and I can still keep the same story?


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## JustRob (May 25, 2018)

moderan said:


> To your question, for drama and personal motivation. Have you ever thought about acquiring a beta reader? Normally, that's who helps you think through or around these kinds of points.





ironpony said:


> Yeah I am going to get some newer beta readers once I figure out to write it .



I should mention that the beta reading forums here are currently offline while they are being reorganised because they had become a bit of a mess.


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## moderan (May 25, 2018)

ironpony said:


> Okay thanks.  You say cart before the horse, but one thing I keep reading in writing books, is to know how you want to end your story and then build into that ending. Would that be wrong, and the ending should be the absolute last thing, and I should plan out the whole story completely linearly?
> 
> Even John Truby said to come up with your ending very earlier on so everything can build into that, so I am not sure what writing philosophy to follow now, if that is putting the cart before the horse.
> 
> I did come up with the ending and all rest of the story first, and then I was revising it I thought, oh crap, what am I going to do about the cellphones being a problem.  But is this a fixable problem and I can still keep the same story?



That's not at all what I meant. Yeah, come up with your climax, make everything build toward it. But you're building a house of cards. I don't do things in linear fashion myself -- you have to find the method that works best for you. Of course it's a fixable problem...but _it's up to you to figure out the fix_. That's how pros do it -- they put the character in a situation and then figure the way out of it. That process informs the narrative and the solution of the problem draws the reader in to the narrative.


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## ironpony (May 25, 2018)

Okay thanks.  Well right now the character is in a situation that I have to think of a way out of.  Character is in a situation, where he would logically use a cellphone, but I don't want him to communicate with anyone else in the outside world for this story to go where I want it to go.  So I guess it's just a matter of figuring out a way to cut off that communication.

As for framing the villains for the killing of the cop, the main character's situation is that he is sick of the villains always getting away with their crimes, and his way out of it, is to frame them for murder, now that he has a dead cop's body at his advantage to frame them with.


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