# Passionate or trite?



## Snowflake (Aug 9, 2015)

I wrote this today.  My first attempt at building up a passionate romance, with hopes of giving the reader just a taste of things to come.  So, my question is: Is it tasty? trite? disappointing?  intriguing?  I have no idea. 

*[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]He opened the car door for me. When he got into the driver's seat, his hands held mine, and he looked at me for several long moments before saying a word. He whispered, “I'll never forget tonight.” [/FONT]


“[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]I feel the same.” I didn't want to feel the passion welling up inside of me, my heart beating fast, lost for words, the earth spinning. It was too soon.[/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]A small lock of his hair fell onto his forehead. “Dora, I have strong feelings for you.”[/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]Words of love resounded in my mind, but I could only say, "It's too soon.” It felt as if we fell into an enchanted storybook, millions of miles away from the world, in a timeless bliss. I didn't want it to end. I wanted to keep this picture perfect moment in my mind forever. [/FONT]


“[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]I think you're right." He leaned over and gently kissed my lips, looked into my eyes as he took a deep breath, and sighed. "Let's go." He put the key in his ignition. The motor hummed.[/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]I don't know what made me say it was too soon. It wasn't. [/FONT]*


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## Deafmute (Aug 9, 2015)

is this a romance novel? In that sense it seems fine. Its out of context so its hard to say if the intensity is appropriate or overstated, but taking just these lines into consideration. I think its reasonable enough.


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## InstituteMan (Aug 9, 2015)

First off, I really like the way you end that section: "I don't know what made me say it was too soon. It wasn't." That's a line that makes me envious.

On the larger issue of trite or passionate: who knows? Context matters a lot, and genre and audience matters even more. A bit from a young adult novel is going to seem awful trite to us more (ahem) seasoned adults, but will seem plenty passionate to the intended readers. Meanwhile, what us seasoned readers would call passionate might be entirely missed by the youngsters.

To me, yeah, maybe that is a bit trite. In particular, this guy sounds like a dude reading a script written by a woman. "I have strong feelings for you" is not a phrase that tumbles out of a typical guy's mouth. Of course, in the larger context of the work, maybe that's just the kind of guy this dude is. Or maybe this is a story written to appeal to women who want to know that kind of dude. It's certainly not fatally trite. Plus, you really nailed the dismount.

Keep writing.


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## Snowflake (Aug 9, 2015)

Deafmute said:


> is this a romance novel? In that sense it seems fine. Its out of context so its hard to say if the intensity is appropriate or overstated, but taking just these lines into consideration. I think its reasonable enough.



Thanks!

No, it's not a romance novel.  It's an unexpected turn of events in a novel about .. let's just say a research hospital.


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## EmmaSohan (Aug 9, 2015)

I agree with InstituteMan, great last line.

I can't imagine someone saying, “I'm glad you said that. I feel the same.”

I wouldn't think, 'I didn't want to feel the passion welling up inside of me', it's too elegant.


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## Snowflake (Aug 9, 2015)

InstituteMan said:


> First off, I really like the way you end that section: "I don't know what made me say it was too soon. It wasn't." That's a line that makes me envious.
> 
> On the larger issue of trite or passionate: who knows? Context matters a lot, and genre and audience matters even more. A bit from a young adult novel is going to seem awful trite to us more (ahem) seasoned adults, but will seem plenty passionate to the intended readers. Meanwhile, what us seasoned readers would call passionate might be entirely missed by the youngsters.
> 
> ...



He said, "I have strong feelings for you" because that's the kind of guy he is. Sensitive.  

   I don't think I know what the "typical" man would say that means the same as "I have feelings for you."  Do you?  The way he professes his love, especially the first time, says a lot about a man.  

  No, it's not meant to appeal solely to women, but I sure hope it's not a turnoff to men.


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## Snowflake (Aug 9, 2015)

EmmaSohan said:


> I agree with InstituteMan, great last line.
> 
> I can't imagine someone saying, “I'm glad you said that. I feel the same.”
> 
> I wouldn't think, 'I didn't want to feel the passion welling up inside of me', it's too elegant.



Ok, I think I agree with you about, "I'm glad you said that." I'll have to delete it.

Your comment saying, it's too elegant confuses me.  What's wrong with elegance?  That's exactly what I want it to be.


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## InstituteMan (Aug 9, 2015)

Snowflake said:


> That's the kind of guy he was.   I don't think I know what the "typical" man would say that means the same was "I have feelings for you."  Do you?  No, it's not meant to appeal solely to women.



Well, a typical guy might drool or something. If he was verbally advanced, he might say, "you're really hot."

There's a reason books are seldom written about a truly typical guy.


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## Snowflake (Aug 10, 2015)

InstituteMan said:


> Well, a typical guy might drool or something. If he was verbally advanced, he might say, "you're really hot."
> 
> There's a reason books are seldom written about a truly typical guy.




You're right!  Let's face it.  Guys come in differing age brackets, educational levels, socioeconomic levels and quite a few more variables, so I guess there's lots of different ways to say I love you. 

_"You're really hot"_ may appeal to the masses, but for this particular couple, subtle works better. They read each other well.  I don't think a steamy love scene belongs in my book, but I'm thinking about it. 

I've gotten up to about 51,000 words and now I'm struggling. Hmm, now that I think about it, a few love scenes might fill the bill, but it also may be an easy way out.  Quandry!


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## Moody (Aug 10, 2015)

If this guy doesn't get a steamy love scene after _*those*_ lines, justice doesn't exist.


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## Snowflake (Aug 10, 2015)

Moody said:


> If this guy doesn't get a steamy love scene after _*those*_ lines, justice doesn't exist.



Admittedly, I had a good belly laugh when I read your reply. 

 Well, if I gotta, I gotta.  This was my first love scene.

  I guess I'll have to do at least one more ... so my readers won't despair.


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## Guy Faukes (Aug 10, 2015)

It seems rounded enough for someone like myself who's not versed with romance scenes. I think the line "It felt as if we fell into an enchanted storybook, millions of miles away from the world, in a timeless bliss. I didn't want it to end. I wanted to keep this picture perfect moment in my mind forever." will have to do a lot of work to really sell her emotions in this part. 

Make it personable and detailed (but also concise), e.g., "it felt like falling into one of those fairy tales mother read to me at bed time", "I wanted to stay here, in the pristine warmth of his presence". My two cents.


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## Snowflake (Aug 10, 2015)

Guy Faukes said:


> It seems rounded enough for someone like myself who's not versed with romance scenes. I think the line "It felt as if we fell into an enchanted storybook, millions of miles away from the world, in a timeless bliss. I didn't want it to end. I wanted to keep this picture perfect moment in my mind forever." will have to do a lot of work to really sell her emotions in this part.
> 
> Make it personable and detailed (but also concise), e.g., "it felt like falling into one of those fairy tales mother read to me at bed time", "I wanted to stay here, in the pristine warmth of his presence". My two cents.



Interesting comment. My question to you is this:  Will taking your suggestion improve my writing, or my _style_ of writing (the first being objective, the second, subjective).


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## Guy Faukes (Aug 10, 2015)

All eventually learn to take my advice is gospel. Kidding, kidding, of course. 

I'm not sure I understand. A lot of critiquing and criticism is just subjective. How your intended audience takes it is more important and near impossible to predict. Personally, it's something I view as effective, but ultimately, I hope it's something to digest along with other design considerations. A concern of mine is if it will improve your style of writing, or just be implementing mine onto yours.


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## John Oberon (Aug 10, 2015)

I'm a bit confused. You say the man got into the passenger's seat, but then he puts the key in his ignition. So is the girl driving the guy's car or what?




Snowflake said:


> I wrote this today.  My first attempt at a buildup to a passionate romance, with hopes of giving the reader just a taste of things to come.  So, my question is: Is it tasty? trite? disappointing?  intriguing? I have no idea.
> 
> ------------------
> 
> ...


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## Snowflake (Aug 10, 2015)

John Oberon said:


> I'm a bit confused. You say the man got into the passenger's seat, but then he puts the key in his ignition. So is the girl driving the guy's car or what?



John, thanks. You caught a glaring error.   I fixed it.    He helped her into the car, then got into the *driver's* seat.

Sheesh, I'm glad you caught that!   




**I'm sooo embarrassed


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## John Oberon (Aug 10, 2015)

A Spock to the rescue!


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## Snowflake (Aug 10, 2015)

John Oberon said:


> A Spock to the rescue!



Definitely! And thank you!

Now, Mr. (Left Brain) Spock, what's your take on this little (Right Brain) romance scene ?


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## John Oberon (Aug 10, 2015)

I liked it overall, but I think weak verbs and expression hinder it a bit. Read this:

_He opened the car door for me. When he sat in the driver's seat, he held my hands and gazed at me for a long moment, then whispered, “I'll never forget tonight.” 

“I feel the same.” I fought against the passion welling inside me, my fast beating heart, and the screaming quietness, as the world swam before my eyes. It was too soon.

A small lock of his hair fell across his forehead. “Dora, I have strong feelings for you.”

Words of love resounded in my mind, but I could say only, "It's too soon.” It felt as if we fell into an enchanted storybook, millions of miles away from the world, in a timeless bliss I didn't want to end. This moment, with each pause, each touch, each expression burned itself into my mind. 

“I think you're right." He gently kissed my lips, and his eyes reflected my own desire as he sighed deeply. "Let's go." He turned the key in the ignition. The motor hummed.

Why did I say it was too soon? It wasn't__._

Does that seem stronger to you?


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## Snowflake (Aug 10, 2015)

John Oberon said:


> I liked it overall, but I think weak verbs and expression hinder it a bit. Read this:
> 
> _He opened the car door for me. When he sat in the driver's seat, he held my hands and gazed at me for a long moment, then whispered, “I'll never forget tonight.”
> 
> ...



Wow!  You took the words right outta my mouth.   

Yes,  well done... differentiates novice from pro. 

Thanks. Good pointers you shared!


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## YoungScholar (Aug 10, 2015)

I can feel the tension between the two, If I may though I have a suggestion. This line is a little awkward, meaning it doesn't flow in my opinion:
"“I feel the same.”  I didn't want to feel the passion welling up inside of me, my heart beating fast, lost for words, the earth spinning. It was too soon."

My suggestion:
I didn't want to feel the passion welling up inside of me. My heart was beating fast and the earth seemed to be spinning around me. I was at a loss for words. It was too soon.

The reason I use so many periods is because the periods require pause. In my opinion this is the line where time is slowing down for her, she is trying to comprehend what is going on. The periods give that effect for the reader. Pausing. After each line. It makes it more dramatic. Just a suggestion, do what you like though.


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## John Oberon (Aug 10, 2015)

Snowflake said:


> Wow!  You took the words right outta my mouth.
> 
> Yes, very well done... differentiates novice from pro.
> 
> Thanks. Good pointers you shared!



You can find my list of empty verbs in "About Hammer & Tongs" on the Hammer & Tongs page of my website. If you try to replace those verbs with better verbs or re-word to eliminate them as much as possible, you typically end up with much better writing. If you read your original post, you'll see the empty verbs I eliminated like "look", "do", "got", "want". It takes a little practice, but you can improve very quickly into "pro" status, lol.


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## Snowflake (Aug 10, 2015)

John Oberon said:


> You can find my list of empty verbs in "About Hammer & Tongs" on the Hammer & Tongs page of my website. If you try to replace those verbs with better verbs or re-word to eliminate them as much as possible, you typically end up with much better writing. If you read your original post, you'll see the empty verbs I eliminated like "look", "do", "got", "want". It takes a little practice, but you can improve very quickly into "pro" status, lol.



I found a "TO BE verb analyzer" on your site and it's great, but didn't find a "empty verbs" finder. Did I miss it or are they the same?

It's interesting to know more than over 20% of TO BE words and derivatives indicate a weakness in the writing.  Does that mean an even lower the percentage yields better writing?  

It's a tough row to hoe for someone who's a novice at writing fiction, but it's definitely worth the effort.  Again, thanks!


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## John Oberon (Aug 10, 2015)

Go to the Hammer & Tongs page of my website, then click "About Hammer & Tongs" just above the "Search for" box. That displays a bunch of advice I've found improves writing very quickly. #3 is all about empty verbs.

A lot of "to be" verbs in writing deadens the writing. Not only is "to be" an empty verb itself, but it can change a good, strong past tense verb into a passive voice verb. Excessive passive voice just kills impact in writing. So yeah, the more you can eliminate it from your writing, usually the better. This is also part of what I discuss in "About Hammer & Tongs".


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## Snowflake (Aug 11, 2015)

John Oberon said:


> Go to the Hammer & Tongs page of my website, then click "About Hammer & Tongs" just above the "Search for" box. That displays a bunch of advice I've found improves writing very quickly. #3 is all about empty verbs.
> 
> A lot of "to be" verbs in writing deadens the writing. Not only is "to be" an empty verb itself, but it can change a good, strong past tense verb into a passive voice verb. Excessive passive voice just kills impact in writing. So yeah, the more you can eliminate it from your writing, usually the better. This is also part of what I discuss in "About Hammer & Tongs".



Thanks.  Good stuff there. Maybe you could post a link for others to check it out?


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## Snowflake (Aug 11, 2015)

YoungScholar said:


> I can feel the tension between the two, If I may though I have a suggestion. This line is a little awkward, meaning it doesn't flow in my opinion:
> "“I feel the same.”  I didn't want to feel the passion welling up inside of me, my heart beating fast, lost for words, the earth spinning. It was too soon."
> 
> My suggestion:
> ...



I'm glad you can feel the tension between them. That's a good start.  

Sometimes I think, barring rule-breaking, a lot of writing comes down to the style and idiosyncrasies of the writer.  For major rule-breaking, check out  e e cummings.


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## Deleted member 56686 (Aug 11, 2015)

Snowflake, he has a link in his signature that will link you to the site he is talking about.


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## Snowflake (Aug 11, 2015)

mrmustard615 said:


> Snowflake, he has a link in his signature that will link you to the site he is talking about.



Thanks. I saw it.   

I'm still fishing for answers as to whether this little scene is passionate or trite.  I also wonder if women would see it differently than men.

My guess would be women would find it romantic.  Men would find it lacking/trite, but it _may_ encourage some to keep turning the pages.


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## John Oberon (Aug 11, 2015)

As a man, I thought it was fine...I mean with not knowing the context or the characters. The ten pages before and after this excerpt might speak otherwise.


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## Snowflake (Aug 11, 2015)

John Oberon said:


> As a man, I thought it was fine...I mean with not knowing the context or the characters. The ten pages before and after this excerpt might speak otherwise.




Thanks for the feedback, John.  As a novice, it's tough to gauge how readers might feel, but as long as people aren't gagging, I'm okay with it.

Quite a few said they liked the last line. The twist ending.


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## Miranda de la Costa (Aug 15, 2015)

I really couldn't say. I don't have a connection to the main character or the couple so I couldn't tell you whether or not I'm excited about them getting together.


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## Snowflake (Aug 15, 2015)

Miranda de la Costa said:


> I really couldn't say. I don't have a connection to the main character or the couple so I couldn't tell you whether or not I'm excited about them getting together.



Thanks for your reply.  This is the first romantic scene I've written and I asked if it would be considered passionate or lacking (in other words, it's not about the couple themselves, but the scene).   The WF fellow who replying saying if there's no steamy scene to follow, there's no justice.  I think that pretty much sums it up.... at least I hope so. 

However, if I were responding to my own post, I'd say it was too short to say whether it was passionate or not.


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