# Will I Get the NSA looking at me?



## wainscottbl (Jan 2, 2015)

The novel I am working on is about a man making a bomb to kill people. Well, if I research the matter, do you think the NSA might start looking at me? I do not want to have my house raided for a mere novel. The cops are not always very reasonable in these investigations. I'm a bit hesitant, but the character is learning how to make a bomb himself.


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## dale (Jan 2, 2015)

if you've went to certain websites that show you how to make a bomb as research, you might get flagged, 
but i don't see them raiding your house just for that.


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## Bishop (Jan 2, 2015)

They might take notice, but I doubt they'll take action unless you start ordering parts.


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## Folcro (Jan 2, 2015)

If the cops raided every house for one of its occupants curiously checking out a sketchy website, I would have gotten a job in the police force years ago.

...Let alone if they had people reading every book looking for such things.

Tonality plays a part in it too. And detail. If you're not obviously encouraging anybody to do this, I don't think it would be a problem. And is a bomb really that hard to make? The hardest part would probably be the trigger mechanism, but I probably already stuck my foot in my moth. I think you're fine.

What I don't get is what a No-Strings-Attached relationship has to do with bombs.


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## FleshEater (Jan 2, 2015)

Chuck Palahniuk used real explosive ingredients in Fight Club. His publisher frowned upon it and he ended up changing one chemical in each recipe, simply to avoid becoming a liability. It's probably good he did, since the film adaptation has become an iconic cult film. 

My advice? Tread carefully. Yes, you'll get flagged...immediately. But, with everything that's been going on lately, I'd be wary about researching homemade explosive recipes online. 

Is this more complicated than a pipe bomb?


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## shadowwalker (Jan 2, 2015)

I've looked up _soooo _many things that would get Big Brother on my back - never gotten so much as a drive-by from the bloody snoops. Another one of those things not to worry about.


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## Sam (Jan 2, 2015)

Is this a legitimately serious question? 

I've researched everything from nuclear bombs to level-four biological agents to top secret government bases. What are they going to do -- arrest me? On what grounds? That a man with a curious mind looked up things on the Internet? That a writer researching for a book searched for information on something otherwise suspect? 

You'd have a better chance of finding Jimmy Hoffa than you would of making anything stick against someone whose only crime was to do research. Now, if you bought something, on the other hand . . .


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## escorial (Jan 2, 2015)

Sam said:


> Is this a legitimately serious question?
> 
> I've researched everything from nuclear bombs to level-four biological agents to top secret government bases. What are they going to do -- arrest me? On what grounds? That a man with a curious mind looked up things on the Internet? That a writer researching for a book searched for information on something otherwise suspect?
> 
> You'd have a better chance of finding Jimmy Hoffa than you would of making anything stick against someone whose only crime was to do research. Now, if you bought something, on the other hand . . .




...hoffa's watch...


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## Bishop (Jan 2, 2015)

I do feel like people are so terrified of the NSA, but no one's actually LOOKING at what they monitor unless the computer programs throw up serious red flags. Like, messages between you and Al-Qaeda levels of bad. I know it's tough for some people to believe, but Big Brother does not care about your internet habits unless you're ordering Uranium 238.

Do you seriously think there's people looking at every Pornhub search we've put into our browsers?


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## Deleted member 56686 (Jan 2, 2015)

Bishop said:


> I do feel like people are so terrified of the NSA, but no one's actually LOOKING at what they monitor unless the computer programs throw up serious red flags. Like, messages between you and Al-Qaeda levels of bad. I know it's tough for some people to believe, but Big Brother does not care about your internet habits unless you're ordering Uranium 238.
> 
> Do you seriously think there's people looking at every Pornhub search we've put into our browsers?



I know people who work with the NSA (It's near Baltimore). Most of them don't even know what others are doing. I wouldn't sweat. They probably have bigger fish to fry.


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## Morkonan (Jan 2, 2015)

wainscottbl said:


> The novel I am working on is about a man making a bomb to kill people. Well, if I research the matter, do you think the NSA might start looking at me? I do not want to have my house raided for a mere novel. The cops are not always very reasonable in these investigations. I'm a bit hesitant, but the character is learning how to make a bomb himself.



Yes.

No.



The NSA is not going to flag you for looking up information about bombs. But, if you do so while streaming Al Queda music, watching beheading videos and chatting it up on the "Terrorism for Dummies" webchat, then, yeah, something in the _Machine That Goes Ping_ is going to "ping." Even then, unless there is something else on you, somewhere else, it's not likely to cause any heads to turn. You have paid all your parking tickets, right? You haven't just bought ten bags of fertilizer and rented a car on your credit card, right? Good. Don't do that. 

(This thread has so many hit-words on it that NSAGoogle is going to have a field day...)

As it stands, the NSA can store "the Internet" for several months worth of data, give or take. They aren't likely going to be sifting it for _you_. In fact, you are probably more likely to have a fifteen-minute telephone-tap put on you than to have someone knocking on your door. Just don't say "bomb" or "President" in the same conversation during a phone-call and you should be fine.

(Yeah, they're definitely gonna look at this thread, now.  )

I was never here.
This conversation didn't take place.
I don't know what you're talking about.
Do Not Climb Mount Niitaka!


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## J Anfinson (Jan 2, 2015)

If they haven't knocked on my door after all the crazy things I've looked up, you're probably safe. 

And for anyone who's ever wondered, pigs actually will eat the teeth from what I've gathered. It's a pretty good disposal method.


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## wainscottbl (Jan 2, 2015)

Well, I think the advice here is sensible. If we could talk politics here (which I am glad we can't), then I'd have a good deal to say. But it might get me flagged, but they have enough sense to discern between curiosity and something more sinister.


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## Laughing Duck 137z (Jan 2, 2015)

I struggle with my work as well, especially since mine has to do with cult or could be terrorist group.

But I suggest you tread carefully and if you think you can get in trouble you probably will, so be careful.


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## Sam (Jan 3, 2015)

There is a lot of unwarranted paranoia in this thread. 

Seriously, the NSA have better things to do than bash down the doors of every person who searched for "how to make a bomb" but never bought any of the components required to do so. And even if they did bash down your door, what are they going to find? A bomb? I highly doubt that. So whatever grounds they had to arrest or detain you would go out the window double time.


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## Deafmute (Jan 3, 2015)

2+2=5 yes sir it does. I love big brother.


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## Bloggsworth (Jan 3, 2015)

Highly unlikely. I used to send emails mentioning that I had a _bin laden with rubbish_... Never heard a thing from GCHQ, MI5 or 6. You would have thought that the two words _bin laden_ might have triggered something.


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## SwitchBack (Jan 3, 2015)

J Anfinson said:


> And for anyone who's ever wondered, pigs actually will eat the teeth from what I've gathered. It's a pretty good disposal method.



Pigs are  living garbage disposal units - what they can fit in their mouths goes down. Compare them to the ocean's tiger sharks. They have a strong bite so they can crush bone, chew it up & swallow it down too. 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ear-feud-members-Italian-crime-syndicate.html


wainscottbl - if you start ordering parts, you'll become more than a tiny dot on someone's radar. As it is, you maybe flagged but you won't get anymore than 2 seconds of thought. 


Some of the best crime writers research their books extensively and they are not arrested nor followed nor "raided" despite how the material they research can become very, very detailed. 


I mean, I personally have researched every sort of bomb imaginable to man. Pipe to nuclear to things like the W54 which most people overlook. 

I've investigated how to booby trap a house. How to set up a bomb beneath a car & blow up a boat.

How to hide these devices in suitcases, etc. Or smaller but no less deadly weapons.

Not to mention anthrax & other biochemical weapons. 

I've read serial killers' interviews, bank robbers, etc. I have followed cults. And even terrorism. 


At one point I had the old blueprints of a government building in NYC while at the same time investigating elevators and small timed bombs. Anyone reading that would think I was trying to blow something up.


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## Olly Buckle (Jan 3, 2015)

shadowwalker said:


> I've looked up _soooo _many things that would get Big Brother on my back - never gotten so much as a drive-by from the bloody snoops. Another one of those things not to worry about.



One wonders how you can be sure of that.


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## aj47 (Jan 3, 2015)

There's levels of concern.  Looking up something isn't very big, but, as has been mentioned, ordering parts or doing other things that might be seen as shady would tend up amp up the level.

Now, if you're afraid of a Steve Jackson[SUP]*[/SUP] sort of thing, then you need to remember it was the Secret Service, not the NSA.  

---
[SUP]*[/SUP]google it.


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## Newman (Jan 5, 2015)

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/05/arts/writers-say-they-feel-censored-by-surveillance.html


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## Terry D (Jan 5, 2015)

Sure. You might become a data point in some NSA-FBI-CIA database based on key-word algorithms, but so what? The only writer I've ever heard of who had an agency show up at his door is Tom Clancy after publishing _The Hunt for Red October._


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## shadowwalker (Jan 5, 2015)

The survey was also only among members of PEN, which is not just a writer's group but a "human rights" group, so it's not really surprising that their members would be more paranoid than typical writers. Kinda like polling a political party's membership on health care or abortion rights.

People in the US and other countries whose leaders are excessively paranoid need to be vigilante about surveillance, but it shouldn't mean living in fear of those idiots, allowing our own paranoia to take over.  (off the soapbox now  )


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## Sam (Jan 5, 2015)

Terry D said:


> Sure. You might become a data point in some NSA-FBI-CIA database based on key-word algorithms, but so what? The only writer I've ever heard of who had an agency show up at his door is Tom Clancy after publishing _The Hunt for Red October._



And that was at a time where the Internet was only in its latent stages. Clancy did most of his research for _The Hunt for Red October _via books and talking to people in the know. The government got its knickers in a twist over the whole thing and even had Ronald Reagan read it. He stepped off Air Force One a couple of days later and, with dozens of cameras facing him, told everyone that it was a fantastic story. 

Clancy never looked back.


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## dale (Jan 5, 2015)

yeah. i'd actually welcome the NSA kicking in my door over researching for a book i was writing. it could be some
great free publicity. too bad it will never happen.


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## miasma (Jan 5, 2015)

Maybe I could write a short story about having my door kicked in by a bunch of bullet proof swat guys, being taken off to a facility, for them to find themselves wondering about which agency wanted me.  DEA, NSA, FBI, Homeland, that other agency no one mentions. (gulp).  My request for a lawyer results in my being visited by a prosecuting attorney, who attempts to save the day by telling me that I had downloaded a Movie onto my computer.  Gulp.   He is sure that was the evidence, but he has not gotten the report yet.   Finding myself shuttled from one jail to another between different jurisdictions.  I overhear a guard telling another  SWAT  was supposed to grab the guy in the house next door.  Which did not have a man, but a very attractive single woman I was trying to figure out ways to talk to.    But now my potential complaint was a problem, so they were going to . . . .  Thanks.  I needed to write something to activate my account for the first time.


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## dale (Jan 5, 2015)

i once starting writing a story about a group plotting to kill the "1st black president". but i could tell after 3000 words
 that it was destined to be a novella, so i quit. sorry, but the thought of being stuck with another novella just wasn't 
worth the time it would have taken to realize this fictional plot.


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## miasma (Jan 6, 2015)

After "The Interview"   I am guessing Hollywood is obligated to do a movie about the attempt on a US President.   Else the N. Koreans were right, and "The Interview" was in bad taste.   Whoever thought Hollywood was concerned about taste.


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## Deleted member 56686 (Jan 6, 2015)

miasma said:


> After "The Interview"   I am guessing Hollywood is obligated to do a movie about the attempt on a US President.   Else the N. Koreans were right, and "The Interview" was in bad taste.   Whoever thought Hollywood was concerned about taste.




That's already been done in some form. I know of at least two movies which dealt with assassination attempts. Suddenly (1954) with Frank Sinatra of all people as the would be assassin and In the Line of Fire where Clint Eastwood is trying to prevent a presidential assassination. I have no doubt there are more examples out there. I don't think the NSA went after Eastwood BTW


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## Morkonan (Jan 6, 2015)

Plenty of Lee Harvey Oswald movies out there. And, there's plenty "B" and "C" movies about plots to assassinate the President of the United States. Heck, I think there are even a few comedies in that stable.


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## Olly Buckle (Jan 7, 2015)

Morkonan said:


> Plenty of Lee Harvey Oswald movies out there. And, there's plenty "B" and "C" movies about plots to assassinate the President of the United States. Heck, I think there are even a few comedies in that stable.



Maybe stay away from ones about N. Korean presidents


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## Terry D (Jan 7, 2015)

The difference between what was done in _The Interview_ and any of the other assassination movies, or bio-pics about Oswald, is that there has never been (that I know of) a movie depicting the assassination of a currently sitting leader.


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## Winston (Jan 7, 2015)

I extensively researched Persian (Iranian) history and culture, along with physics queries including fission and fusion.  Flag, anyone?

It was an alternate history work where Persians were ascendant over the Greeks in antiquity.  In that reality, they launch the first interstellar spacecraft today.  
Anyway, no knocks on my door.  Although I do occasionally hear a click or two on my phone line...

Seriously, if you're concerned, search using a protected browser like Tor.


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## tabasco5 (Jan 8, 2015)

wainscottbl said:


> The novel I am working on is about a man making a bomb to kill people. Well, if I research the matter, do you think the NSA might start looking at me? I do not want to have my house raided for a mere novel. The cops are not always very reasonable in these investigations. I'm a bit hesitant, but the character is learning how to make a bomb himself.



If you really do live in KY, or the US in general, then the NSA is already looking at you.  Don't worry about it - write away!


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## FleshEater (Jan 8, 2015)

Terry D said:


> The difference between what was done in _The Interview_ and any of the other assassination movies, or bio-pics about Oswald, is that there has never been (that I know of) a movie depicting the assassination of a currently sitting leader.



Yeah, but the leaders of North Korea dehumanize the population until they're dead. So...why wait for that day? Might as well poke fun while another tyrant sits in office. I'm pretty sure Team America bashed Kim Jong Il quite extensively. Though they didn't assassinate him.


As for paranoia, I suppose it depends on other factors. Personally, mine is justified, since I have to clear a background check every five years for my employment. If you don't have that to worry about, then there's probably no reason to be paranoid.


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## dale (Jan 8, 2015)

Winston said:


> Seriously, if you're concerned, search using a protected browser like Tor.



the TOR browser network was actually created by the government to more easily keep tabs on people with something to hide.

*that's a joke, really. i just enjoy getting conspiracy theories started*


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## dvspec (Jan 9, 2015)

Let me tell you a story.  

Once upon a time there were two people.  Neither one was right in the head and their insanity fed off each other.  One of them, a former government contractor, designed bits and pieces for use in Air Force One, but had since gone private sector.  Those bits are still in Air Force One.  He had reason to believe he was still being monitored, as every week there would be a phone truck outside his house and mysterious clicking and feed back on his phone that seemed to happen most when he was talking to the other nut.  

The other nut job was the creative, rational side of the relationship.  She, just for fun mind you, during one of those calls began throwing out random words: bomb, jihad, president, package, nuclear, etc...  He, picking up on the fun, began throwing out his own random words:  238, dirty bomb, fall out, maximum kill count, glorious, etc...  After this, the clicking was still there, the feed back was still there, but now voices could be heard at times, as well.  

The two nuts began talking to the people who were listening to their conversation.  Basically criticizing the lack of skill and ham fisted way "the others" were doing their jobs and how to go about improving their skills.

The two nuts talked extensively, in public, about how to most effectively screw up water supply, railways, power grids, etc...

They got a copy of the "Anarchist Cookbook", with which, they were sorely disappointed and began editing for accuracy and usability.

Fast forward, a couple of years.  The female party moves away, dates a guy that works for another government contractor who "just happens" to build the detonation devices for nuclear devices.  She decides to write a book of the "Red Dawn" variety.  She does extensive research online.  Then "just happens" to meet a useful source, a former Army Ranger, and queries him by email about how he would invade the USA...

Point being, if this crazy chick (me) isn't behind bars yet, you might have a file, but you will have nothing to worry about.  Research away.  

My files is bigger than your file and it's gonna get bigger... I want a passport.


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## Xander416 (Jan 10, 2015)

On the other side of the bridge, I read a story some years back about a 14-year-old who wrote a story about zombies invading his school and got arrested for "terror threats". So it may be a crap shoot situation.

I'd say don't get paranoid about it, but if anybody comes asking around, be nice and cooperative and always look up and to the left when you're thinking about an answer, because when trying to come up with a lie, most people instinctively look down and to the right_._


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## J.T. Chris (Jan 10, 2015)

The NSA is only interested in your naughty searches.


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## Westwood (Jan 10, 2015)

Ya, the NSA won't come breaking in, however... watch over your shoulder...?


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## Olly Buckle (Jan 11, 2015)

J.T. Chris said:


> The NSA is only interested in your naughty searches.


This explains, I was wondering why th National Space Authority would take notice, it's not them, it's the Naughty Search Authority. Ah-Ha.


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