# Has this ever happened to you?



## MzSnowleopard (Dec 6, 2015)

How did you handle it?

Well it's happened again. For the second time a concept in my novels was by someone else. The first concept that cost me an entire script- as it appeared all too closely to my own, including one of the locations- in the movie Supernova starring Luke Perry.

This time it was Joe Webb's script for an episode of Sleepy Hollow. This one is major as it's a core element in my series The Zodiac Chronicles. To drop it or to change it would ruin my work.

Those who watch Sleepy Hollow will know what I'm talking about here. In a recent episode, they had Jenny Mills handle a red crystal stone, in a puff of smoke it disappeared - absorbing in to her skin. Crane called it a binding stone.

This is remarkably like the Celestial Stones in my work. There are some differences however, the concept is the same- the stone is absorbed and has an affect on the person.

In my work, the stones appear to be black river rocks; each with different markings- on one side is the elemental symbol of one sign, and on the other the constellation. Each stone amplifies a person's Psionic abilities and grants limited telepathy (only with the other stone bearers) unless, like in Lynn's case, the character is already telepathic.

I would rather not give up another series- especially this one. I have worked so long and hard on just because someone had the same idea.

People told me I was being paranoid, that no one would want to steal my work- and yet I still burned copies of my manuscripts to disc. The dates on these files and burns clearly prove that I have been working with these stones for more than 10 years. Sleepy Hollow, the series is only in its 2nd season. So they can't claim that I scooped the idea from the episode.

After the first time, I spoke with an agent about it, she said it does happen from time to time, and may be a case for the 'collective conscious'.

So, to my original questions- Has this ever happened to you? How did you handle it?


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## dale (Dec 6, 2015)

yeah. it has happened to me. in my novel, i intertwined certain things into the story that i obviously felt at the time.
i was smashed off my ass when i wrote it, though. so i really can't go into great detail about it. because i don't remember.
but then afterwards, i read "the drowning girl" by caitlin kiernan and i kept seeing these same similarities pop up. 
and it really got to me for a couple hours. i was thinking....man....people gonna be thinking i'm a copycat of this bitch...
but i wrote what i wrote before i ever read her.....but the thing is? both me and kiernan have lovecraft as an influence.
and i think that's where it stemmed from.


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## shadowwalker (Dec 6, 2015)

James Patterson "stole" an idea I've been working on for several years ("Zoo"). But then again, my version is vastly different from his version. 

That's the thing. Same idea, different treatment. Personally, I wouldn't worry about one scene from one episode of one series that, from the articles I've seen, is on its way out anyway. I mean, it's like saying toss out an ms because OMG - Harry Potter already had a flying car! You can drive yourself nuts comparing "concepts" and ideas with other stuff. Just write a good story and forget what it _might _be like.


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## MzSnowleopard (Dec 6, 2015)

I'm with you Shadow, sadly it's not so easily done with the first concept. It was like someone had reached into my mind and copied my thoughts. It was going to be my original break in novel for the Falcon Declassified Collection. I would have never caught this craptastic film were I not a sucker for man vs. the elements movies. There I was sitting on the couch, watching and munching away at my popcorn when OMG BAM! My concept was brought to life on the screen. 

First I was shocked then I was pissed. 

In my story it was called Project Code Name Ark

I had designated locations across the planet with underground facilities that served as chryo-banks with frozen samples of species as well as residential areas etc. The writers and producers of Supernova brought this to life. 

If I had gone ahead with my script as it was- I would have been seen as a copy cat- so rather than destroy it, I'm making alterations to add enough changes / differences that will keep me out of trouble. In the end, for me, it's about the characters not the setting.


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## The Green Shield (Dec 6, 2015)

Guess this explains why I'm always afraid to commit to writing. What if I get invested into a story for years, building up an entire world to the point where it feels so real to me...only to learn that someone else had beaten me to the punch with the concepts and storylines? It would feel like a sledgehammer to my ribs; like I had wasted all that time. 

Guess I'm not ready to face that possible pain yet...


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## dale (Dec 6, 2015)

The Green Shield said:


> Guess this explains why I'm always afraid to commit to writing. What if I get invested into a story for years, building up an entire world to the point where it feels so real to me...only to learn that someone else had beaten me to the punch with the concepts and storylines? It would feel like a sledgehammer to my ribs; like I had wasted all that time.
> 
> Guess I'm not ready to face that possible pain yet...



don't worry, bub. just put on your big-boy panties and go for it.


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## The Green Shield (Dec 6, 2015)

dale said:


> don't worry, bub. just put on your big-boy panties and go for it.


Thanks.  I'm gonna go ahead and do it now.


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## shadowwalker (Dec 6, 2015)

Yeah, if writers were afraid of "copycat" ideas, we'd still be reading the first stories ever written. It's not the idea - it's what you, the individual, do with it.


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## dale (Dec 6, 2015)

shadowwalker said:


> Yeah, if writers were afraid of "copycat" ideas, we'd still be reading the first stories ever written. It's not the idea - it's what you, the individual, do with it.



 yeah. cain slew abel. jesus. how many fucking times has that been written.


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## belthagor (Dec 6, 2015)

I remember when I made this argument, and don't worry, you didn't steal it from me.

I made a thread about there being so much writing that ideas start to overlap, and asked "Can you plagiarise an idea?"

"If 10,000 college students have to write a paper about shakespeare, there are bound to be similarities, and it is still studied in college by the way."

Wait no, here is the grand finale: "How am I supposed to come up with something original with 7 billion people and a whole lot of history."

and this thread receives honorable mention:
http://www.writingforums.com/thread...ry-single-series-serial-movie-being-like-this


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## Crowley K. Jarvis (Dec 6, 2015)

I've always solved that problem with unrestrained creativity...

A steam captain with split personalities and psionic powers, who is a thousand year old mutant that shifts form. Will some people say it's similar to Doctor Who? Probably. But it's not. It's entirely different. 

A thousand people have written about the frozen moon, Europa. IN my story, a people of nordic-descent end up living there, mining the ice for minerals. They fuse their DNA with the native species to survive in the cold temperatures. It's much different than the other books. 

My other is closer to fantasy, but the MC is a chimera, specifically, a fox-bear-owl hybrid that is often mistaken for a female because of his beauty and slim beastly figure. That one might not have been done before... I guess it's similar to some 'monster' mangas. But it's different.

A story is more than it's synopsis. Different writers may get similar broad ideas, but the *details *of the story will be different. Such as the specific characters, dialogue, situations, or the way in which these ideas are presented, and of course, the writing style. 

I think you're good. Especially since you started writing it so long ago. Should be fine.


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## BobtailCon (Dec 6, 2015)

"Everything is overdone, and everything has been done. All we can do is put our own little spin on it."

This is what I told somebody five months ago, they had the exact same worry as you. As writers, we are often times "inspired" by one another. No one should be afraid to write something because somebody bigger than them beat them to it. Write the piece, if somebody asks why it's so similar, say, "We had a similar vision."


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## dale (Dec 6, 2015)

we should have an "original story" contest. i bet no one would win.


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## Crowley K. Jarvis (Dec 6, 2015)

dale said:


> we should have an "original story" contest. i bet no one would win.


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## The Green Shield (Dec 7, 2015)

Came up with a Tolkien-esque name for a city, looked it up online and it's a city in Dragon Age: Origins with two different letters in the middle. I've never played Dragon Age: Origins but it just goes to show you that everything's been done before just about. :> But luckily, names aren't exactly copyrighted so I think I'm safe so long as I don't literally take Dragon Age's city and plop it into my own and use it as my own city. 

In essence, you've two choices:

• Keep the idea/name and write.
• Alter the name a bit so it doesn't feel like a complete rip off.

Worrying about it does nothing but stifle creativity and doesn't get the writing done.


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## Bishop (Dec 7, 2015)

My novels all have a group of mixed galactic races, living on star ships, a part of a large alliance of planets and races, utilizing warp drives for FTL travel, and find themselves on adventures of exploration and danger. Sound familiar? Probably because it's been done about 4 million times in novels and TV and movies. But I make my world my own, try to tell fresh spins on these classic space operas, and work to create memorable characters out of that universe.

So stop giving me that look, Picard.


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## The Green Shield (Dec 7, 2015)

Bishop said:


> My novels all have a group of mixed galactic races, living on star ships, a part of a large alliance of planets and races, utilizing warp drives for FTL travel, and find themselves on adventures of exploration and danger. Sound familiar? Probably because it's been done about 4 million times in novels and TV and movies. But I make my world my own, try to tell fresh spins on these classic space operas, and work to create memorable characters out of that universe.
> 
> So stop giving me that look, Picard.


My sci-fi is the same thing at its core; just with my added spin to it. So stop looking at me like that, Picard. Make it so!


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## belthagor (Dec 7, 2015)

BobtailCon said:


> No one should be afraid to write something because *somebody bigger* than them beat them to it.



Bigger? earlier yes but not necessarily. You never know if someone will use/convey an idea better than the previous person who did. (as part of a larger work)


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## Red Sonja (Dec 7, 2015)

MzSnowleopard said:


> How did you handle it?
> 
> Well it's happened again. For the second time a concept in my novels was by someone else. The first concept that cost me an entire script-





The Green Shield said:


> Guess this explains why I'm always afraid to commit to writing. What if I get invested into a story for years, building up an entire world to the point where it feels so real to me...only to learn that someone else had beaten me to the punch with the concepts and storylines? It would feel like a sledgehammer to my ribs; like I had wasted all that time.
> 
> Guess I'm not ready to face that possible pain yet...


 
In all the topics similar to this one that I have read on various internet discussion boards, I have never seen the following expressed, although it's always the first thing I think:

We, denizens of this particular continuum, exist in a medium of desperation at this particular point in what we refer to as "time."

The desperation isn't just for money, status, health, shelter, etc., but for other, more intangible but equally important things, like ideas.

Humanity would never have survived this long without ideas, which are truly the coin of our continued existence.

People short on ideas behave in much the same manner as people short on food, although with a bit more subterfuge, generally over a longer period of time. But also I've seen people riot, vandalize, and commit murder over ideas JUST like they will for food. So have you, for that matter.

Will a lack of ideas kill you just like a lack of food? Yes - or it can, anyway. Not as quickly, perhaps, but you'll be just as dead. Especially if your livelihood involves having to come up with new ideas, like for instance if you are a writer for a magazine, TV show, ad company, etc.

This phenomenon is always easy to spot for anybody who has good ideas, especially if that person has had the experience already of another person wanting his/her ideas and not being ok with "no" for an answer.

Haha -- sorry, story warning -- just within the last year I e-witnessed a well-connected but woefully idea-impoverished individual making a complete ass out of himself in a brutally public way in a desperate (there's that word again) bid to gain the assistance of an idea-rich individual, so he could keep his phoney-baloney, high-paying writing job. At the time I type these words, he's still managing to hold onto his hard-won (in his case, extremely hard-won because he didn't have many ideas to begin with) status and position, but only with a lot of other idea-impoverished types propping him up and helping propel him along. He's still holding out for that idea-rich person he first tried to intimidate, then bully, then coerce, then finally beg (in a quite satisfyingly pathetic manner) to help him. He knows it won't happen but the people who are signing his checks don't know that yet; he at least has enough ideas in his head and in his bag of stolen ideas to keep his job going for now. Nope, not a TV show or something I heard as gossip; it happened over about a year and a half, on a website where I was following this individual and then I also occasionally checked out his blog and so on. I got a complete picture of what was going on because, you know, he'd been so confident at the outset that he would acquire the idea-rich person's aid, right? He saw that person as being the desperate one: Desperate for the income and recognition, desperate to be published. He bragged and boasted.

Then he was wrong; he lost and it didn't happen. (LOL. Sic semper tyrannis.)

The desperation for new and good ideas takes many forms. Idea-impoverished individuals can be quite clever at coming up with means by which to steal even carefully-guarded ideas from others. They will feel entirely justified in doing this, too! "I have to feed my kids and you can always come up with more ideas, and at some point maybe I'll let you keep one of your good ideas, so carry on." Sometimes there will be this sadistic added justification: "Bless your heart, you just can't help yourself can you? You're just coming up with ideas all the time! So you won't mind if I just help myself? THANKS!!"

Moving right along: You had a good idea and it seems as though someone took it, or somehow someone had the same idea as you at the exact same time and that person was better set up to capitalize on that idea. That sucks. It's demoralizing. AND it's inevitable.

Have you ever known anybody who did motorcycle racing? Lots of amateurs involved in that, even more so than with cars, for the simple reason that a motorcycle is more affordable than a car (if you don't include the medical bills).

If you want to catch a wide array of interesting engineering concepts, become involved in motorcycle racing. You'll see some pretty lame engineering concepts, to be sure, but they will all be more or less innovative.

And in the process you'll become aware of something else, another phenomenon: Anyone can have a fast bike and the necessary skills to race it over a track in competition with others. Anyone can have a great, innovative idea on how to make his/her bike just a tad faster, or how to get over the track just a tad more efficiently, so as to win the race.

But the person who is most likely to win, in almost every case, is the guy who has spent his whole life working on and owning bikes, who comes from a family where everyone rides, whose family is rich enough to buy him a new bike every time he crashes one as a kid, and who is set up with some other source of income and support besides just his one job. He may never have an innovative idea himself, but he's set up to exploit the ideas of others. All those other riders, regardless of how much better their ideas are or how much more skilled they are, are ultimately just his guinea pigs. He learns from THEIR mistakes, not his own.

That's just how life is, in other words. Stealing is something humans do and it always causes problems in human society but it always happens anyway. Some of us live by our ideas and some of us (most of us) benefit and manage to stay alive via others' ideas.

I certainly can't take credit for all the wonderful innovations that make my life easier and keep me entertained, ya know? I didn't steal them, but I'm certainly using them without the express consent of the person who thought of them. (Now, excuse me for a moment while I use five yards of toilet paper to clean dust off a printer. There... that's better!)

The first time someone kidnaps or assaults one of your good ideas there won't be much you can do. It's like those penguins in the Antarctic, right? The first time they try to hatch an egg it usually doesn't hatch because it's too tricky to keep the egg warm; there's a definite art to hatching a penguin egg. If it touches the ice once, the chick inside is a goner. But they live in ice, right? Even in high summer: Ice. Talk about a razor's edge.

What writer doesn't also experience this paradox?

The best plan to make sure your future eggs hatch involves a more complex set of behaviors.

First, keep in mind that if someone really DID steal your work, the best reward you can give him or her for doing so is to give up writing or never try to get anything published. Then the thief wins and gets to keep on thieving from people like you.

ALSO keep in mind that no matter how much it looks like someone "stole your best idea" that is probably NOT the case. Synchronicity does happen. It's one of those things that makes this continuum such a delight and a wonder. Celebrate synchronicity whenever possible and it will never score you with its claws.

But it wouldn't be very nice of me to get you to read all of what I've written here and not leave you with anything substantial, so:

In the future, if you have what you believe to be a great idea, DON'T search google, or anyplace on the internet, for it. Not from your own machine or from someone else's or even from the library. DON'T look on the internet one single time. The internet is the ice. Your idea is your egg.

(I'm not saying this should be the standard for anyone with an idea for a story, but in your case, this is what you should do to renew your own faith in your ideas and your abilities. I'm just giving you this advice and nobody else, k? This is not what I do, but what I think you should do if you want to keep going.)

If there's someone you generally talk to in order to hash out your stories, keep talking to that person, but ask him/her not to mention the content of your conversations to anyone or post about it on the internet. Again, do not engage in text or IM chats about your idea. Not at all.

Go to a public library and WITHOUT CONSULTING THE ELECTRONIC CATALOG visit the section of books likely to contain information about your idea. For example, say you thought of some means of space travel you've never seen in a movie or TV show, or read about, etc. Is it REALLY your idea? Check out an array of books about jet propulsion, space travel, etc. Again, resist the temptation to use an online search engine or ANY REFERENCE connected to the internet.

Have all your notes be handwritten at first. Transfer the notes you want to keep to a machine not connected to the internet. (There's bound to be one of those somewhere in your house!) No, not merely on an external drive or CD, unless same is connected to a machine that is not connected to the internet.

The internet is the ice, the idea is your egg.

Sure, this is a lot more work than having an idea, googling for enough scientific or historic data to make your idea seem legit, then starting on your story. But worrying about whether someone has stolen your idea is ALSO a lot of work, see what I mean? Plus, going to the library is fun. And if you don't use the electronic card catalog, people can only guess what you're reading if you don't check the book out! It drives them crazy! You'll see!

Try to make the actual writing process go as quickly as possible. Don't incubate your great idea forever. If it's truly a great idea, then the mighty goddess Synchronicity will make sure someone else has it before too long.

Finally (this goes without saying but just for the record): Don't steal others' ideas. It's simply not right and further, you may be unlucky enough to run into one of those horrid pranksters who, realizing how desperate dumb, non-idea-having assholes are for what's in his/her head, uses the same as bait for unwary schmucks. You're a nice person, you certainly don't need that in your life.

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If you are convinced that this other person, somehow, in some way you can't figure but you're SURE, stole your idea, or that someone is actively stealing your ideas -- it's definitely worth figuring out how that is happening, to say the least. Wouldn't you agree? Taking the internet completely out of the equation, therefore, is a good way to start. Not easy but it's doable and worth the trouble if your sanity is of value to you.

Sorry about the length of this post, but hey: Having people steal from me (and then brag about it, usually) has been something I've lived with for a long time now. It's kind of annoying, but at least if people are stealing your ideas from you, you know you must have some good ideas, right? I can always come up with more ideas; they can't.

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Postscript: As far as names of places, people, etc: Just write down the first thing that comes to mind for minor characters and places. Wait until the writing is done to check and see if that name has been used before, or if it's the name of someone famous who might sue you. I assume you do that for major characters and places BEFORE the writing starts, but again: Try to use books and not the internet. Stuck for a name? Use a paper atlas or a phone book, not the internet. Names are small potatoes. Plot twists, settings, situations, dynamics, and other innovations that are yours and yours alone (yes there is such a thing) are rather large potatoes, on the other hand.


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## RhythmOvPain (Dec 7, 2015)

Nothing is original. Nothing is safe, either.

Your goal as someone who creates a universe is simply to do it better than everyone else.

Creative license.


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## dale (Dec 7, 2015)

RhythmOvPain said:


> Nothing is original. Nothing is safe, either.
> 
> Your goal as someone who creates a universe is simply to do it better than everyone else.
> 
> Creative license.



pillows are pretty safe. it's hard to get hurt with just you and a pillow in the room.


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## RhythmOvPain (Dec 7, 2015)

dale said:


> pillows are pretty safe. it's hard to get hurt with just you and a pillow in the room.



I mean, you can still die if you smother yourself with the damn thing.

But that isn't exactly the context I was using.


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## belthagor (Dec 7, 2015)

dale said:


> pillows are pretty safe. it's hard to get hurt with just you and a pillow in the room.



You've apparently never been in a pillow fight.

On topic: *some* concepts here and there aren't original anymore, but the big story still is, and that's what matters.


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## MzSnowleopard (Dec 7, 2015)

LOL funny guys ( referring to the Picard Posts) .... I agree that it's all been said and done before, the difference is in the writer's spin on the concept. 

This doesn't help me with the first time it happened- and I know you'll just have to take my word on how identical the concepts are. With the second go around though- they'll have to try and fight me. I'm not giving it up! I've got discs burned from back in the early 2000's  Sleepy Hollow the series probably wasn't even conceived of at the time.


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## belthagor (Dec 7, 2015)

MzSnowleopard said:


> the difference is in the writer's spin on the concept.



......and then someone said there have been so many spins on the concept, the big story is not original anymore. That'l be interesting to see, don't you think so guys? But it won't happen in my lifetime.



MzSnowleopard said:


> ( referring to the Picard Posts)



Agreed. Pillow fights are not a laughing matter.


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## RhythmOvPain (Dec 7, 2015)

Well, I'm not trying to tell you to go out there and get yerself sued.

I'm just saying you can market anything anywhere if it's good enough to market.

Sit on it for like a year or two then see what happens.


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## MzSnowleopard (Dec 7, 2015)

After learning that some of the names used in Stargate were actual places or deities I did a web search on a variety of names from my own pieces. What I discovered was that there is only 1 that's original- the name of one of the primary planets in the entire collection. I'm keeping it under wraps until the first book in that mentions it is ready for release.


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## belthagor (Dec 7, 2015)

MzSnowLeopard, is it alright if I pm you, I had an idea on how to write something completely original, and it's foolproof, but I don't really want to share it in public ^^


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## MzSnowleopard (Dec 7, 2015)

sure, PM away- that is if you're willing to trust me.


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## belthagor (Dec 7, 2015)

MzSnowleopard said:


> sure, PM away- that is if you're willing to trust me.



Sent.


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## Red Sonja (Dec 7, 2015)

RhythmOvPain said:


> Nothing is original. Nothing is safe, either.
> 
> Your goal as someone who creates a universe is simply to do it better than everyone else.
> 
> Creative license.



This statement is in the same category as "no two snowflakes are alike." Can it be proven? Oh, hell no! Hardly anyone will argue with it, however. 

Let's not be naive: Universe creation isn't the reason someone steals a story. It sounds as though someone was after the large potatoes, here, if they were after anything at all. 



> After the first time, I spoke with an agent about it, she said it does happen from time to time, and may be a case for the 'collective conscious'.




Your agent was telling you that she wasn't going to help. I know, right? It totally sucks. 

Are you interested in pursuing the issue in court? It doesn't sound like it, but if so: Talk to an attorney. Try to establish some evidence; a paper trail. The attorney may tell you to drop it, too. Don't be surprised if that happens. 

One last item: Your idea of magic stones that absorb energy is not all that new. (Granted, not many people spend time reading old magic grimoires, like I do -- but there's a reason you thought of it, and that's because humans have done similar magic with rocks like that already.) 

From your description, it doesn't sound as though your stones are an exact match to the ones in the TV show. Can the person/people who wrote the script accuse you of plagiarism and if they do, will any of that stick? If not, then just keep going. Have your agent or your attorney hash the details out after you're done. It's always easier to change things in a story once you're done, always. 

You say you've been working on this for ten years. I'm gong to throw in with your agent here: It was a synchronous thing. Somehow, someone else caught your idea. Don't let it phase you! Get it finished. By the time you're done, you'll have an entirely different set of problems to work with, anyway, is my guess.


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## MzSnowleopard (Dec 7, 2015)

Let me make this clear- I'm not talking about someone out right stealing an idea, concept, you name it- I'm talking about happenstance, 'the collective conscious, or synchronicity as Red Sonja called it. 

This is where two people with zero connections to each other have the same idea ( not necessarily at the same time). The only difference is that one person is 'working on their piece' while the other was successfully produced.

This is why i say you'll have to take my word for my claim. Yes, I'd been working on my concept for some time, it's a piece of backdrop for the collection of works- BUT- the writers / creators behind the movie Supernova starring Luke Perry had the same ( eerily identical ) idea and they got it done first.

This isn't a case of idea stealing, I never spoke to anyone about my concept until after having seen the movie. So, rather than chuck the novel, I'm adjusting it so that I can use it. Lemons to lemonade.


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## belthagor (Dec 7, 2015)

I love fiction. The only genre where if you feel too much has been written to make anything really new and original, you have the ability to start making things up.


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## Red Sonja (Dec 7, 2015)

Definitely, definitely do not chuck your story. (I know you won't but just letting you know I don't want you to.)

When something similar happened to me in the past (I'm not a professional writer or planning to be, keep in mind, but--), and it was clear that Synchronicity, rather than human mischief, had inconvenienced me, I was angry. I WANTED to think my great idea had been purloined and I was hella pissed. 

But that was not the case, it was just "one of those things" and eventually I realized my anger was simply jealousy/envy that someone had beaten me to the punch in writing about what I thought was my idea. Once I realized that I was calm again, and then once calm I thought of a way to change my project to get rid of those elements that suggested I had copied someone.


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## MzSnowleopard (Dec 7, 2015)

> One last item: Your idea of magic stones that absorb energy is not all that new. (Granted, not many people spend time reading old magic grimoires, like I do -- but there's a reason you thought of it, and that's because humans have done similar magic with rocks like that already.)


 
Saonja, in response to your last post- the stones do NOT absorb energy. They are absorbed into the person. 

I don't know where I got the idea from- I am not versed with the history of this sort of thing. It was an idea that I had a dream of and I went with it. So that is to say- I don't know what inspired my dream of the stones. What I don know is that I get a lot of my ideas from my dreams.



> From your description, it doesn't sound as though your stones are an exact match to the ones in the TV show. Can the person/people who wrote the script accuse you of plagiarism and if they do, will any of that stick? If not, then just keep going. Have your agent or your attorney hash the details out after you're done. It's always easier to change things in a story once you're done, always.



They are close enough- in the SH episode they talked about it not being for human use. In my novel they are but specifically for Psionics ( think Gene Grey and Professor X for a known comparison). I have not explored what might / could happen if a normal human ( called Norms in my work) were to absorb one. I have it set that the stones can only be absorb by one who accepts the challenge / destiny of becoming a stone-bearer.



> You say you've been working on this for ten years. I'm gong to throw in with your agent here: It was a synchronous thing. Somehow, someone else caught your idea. Don't let it phase you! Get it finished. By the time you're done, you'll have an entirely different set of problems to work with, anyway, is my guess.


 
I'm not letting it phase me, I'm not even concerned- I started this topic wondering if this situation had happened to others and how they dealt with it. The thing is, since I first started working on The Zodiac Chronicles, I have been burning content to CD's every few months. Some people have said 'this is unnecessary; you don't need to do this'. Well, I think that what's happened is proof that it was indeed necessary. This is my proof / evidence that I've been working on novels with this concept for over 10 years now. The first disc was burned on 5-29-2005. This one disc alone is my evidence. I've burned more off and on since because of changes and updates.

On a related issue- when I started working on this series it was the only one with the title The Zodiac Chronicles. Now, in the last few years, at least 2 other writers are using this title. Then there's Zodiac: A novel, though it uses the astrological signs for character and social base- much like Battlestar Galactica, that's where it ends. Russell builds her own galaxy in her own way. I'm not in the least bit worried about her work either. I do wish her well and success with it. One of the 2 using the actual title has her work focused on vampire clans based on the zodiac. The other is a guy I know nothing about accept that he had asked the woman if any of her works were titled Cancer. I wanted to message him to say that one of mine is- but his controls block this feature (Facebook) I can only assume that it's from parental or user controls.


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## belthagor (Dec 7, 2015)

MzSnowleopard said:


> Let me make this clear- I'm not talking about someone out right stealing an idea, concept, you name it- I'm talking about happenstance, 'the collective conscious, or synchronicity as Red Sonja called it.



You're with friends here. No one thinks you stole an idea.


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## MzSnowleopard (Dec 7, 2015)

belthagor said:


> You're with friends here. No one thinks you stole an idea.



I'm not saying that- I was originally asking if the situation had happened to anyone else and how they handled it and detailing what that situation was. It's that simple.


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## Red Sonja (Dec 7, 2015)

One more thing (I kept remembering this as I was reading your posts and typing my replies, but then forgetting it DARN THIS SHORT-TERM MEMORY LOSS): 

Don't watch TV. Get rid of your TV. If you are a writer, ESPECIALLY if writing is your job, your TV is your enemy. That's part of the "ice" that I was talking about: Not just the internet, but TV. 

The day I stopped watching TV forever I recount as one of the happiest, most memorable days of my life. I always got along just fine without it. I know that advice sounds a bit radical. You may have difficulty imagining your life without TV, but especially now, you can get everything from the internet that was good about TV (news, for instance) much more cheaply and portably, and much more conveniently. 

I know, now you're going to remind me that there's sports and who can afford to attend events anymore and blah-de-blah; no, my friend, that's what the local bar is for! Watch sports at the local bar and get your much-needed socialization there. 

Synchronicity tends to leave one alone who avoids mass media as much as possible.


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## Minu (Dec 7, 2015)

MzSnowleopard said:


> Well it's happened again. For the second time a concept in my novels was by someone else. The first concept that cost me an entire script- as it appeared all too closely to my own, including one of the locations.
> 
> This time it was Joe Webb's script for an episode of Sleepy Hollow. This one is major as it's a core element in my series The Zodiac Chronicles. To drop it or to change it would ruin my work.
> 
> ...



No insult intended but the "modern novel" is over 400 years, if not older even. There are very few original ideas floating around nowadays. 


Second your idea really isn't all that original. Magic stones have been part and parcel of thousands of books, hundreds of PC, playstation, Gameboy, etc., games and other things for years. I am in the midst of playing Witcher 3 where there's magic stones [almost exact to those found in other similar games] and magic tablets [again easily found in different games]. 

I believe, and I'll have to look around, but magic stones amplifying psionic abilities was already covered in a book I read years ago. Or very similar. Items that amplified unique skills, magical skills, etc. [known as talismans] are again nothing new. 

The only thing that maybe unique is the usage of constellations but given as constellations have been tied with magic and supernatural for years [centuries even] doubtful. 



As Red Sonja said get rid of your TV or at least stay away from related TV shows. Don't read books like what you are writing. 

Otherwise you're going to be copying what you see because *that *sold expecting yours to likewise sell. You can't make something original if you're merely copying something - either subconsciously or not.


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## MzSnowleopard (Dec 7, 2015)

Minu said:


> No insult intended but the "modern novel" is over 400 years, if not older even. There are very few original ideas floating around nowadays.



I agree with you on this- it's all been said and done. The difference is in the writer's spin on the story. Think about Shakespeare's works How many stories have been told that at their roots can be compared to Romeo and Juliet or A Mid-Summer's Night Dream?



> Second your idea really isn't all that original. Magic stones have been part and parcel of thousands of books, hundreds of PC, playstation, Gameboy, etc., games and other things for years. I am in the midst of playing Witcher 3 where there's magic stones [almost exact to those found in other similar games] and magic tablets [again easily found in different games.



I don't know about any of the things you've mentioned because I'm not into those sorts of things. You make comparisons that I have no reference to. You'll just have to take my word that I know nothing about Witcher 3 or similar games. Yes, I own a computer- but not a gaming console. And if I could afford one- I prefer games like HALO, Area 51, and Quake. 

To your remarks about my works not beingoriginal or new- I never once made that claim nor inferred that impression. ifthat is the perception you have then that is on you not me.



> I believe, and I'll have to look around, but magic stones amplifying psionic abilities was already covered in a book I read years ago. Or very similar. Items that amplified unique skills, magical skills, etc. [known as talismans] are again nothing new.



This is news to me- and just because one person wrote a book years ago doesn't mean that I can't write mine today.




> The only thing that maybe unique is the usage of constellations but given as constellations have been tied with magic and supernatural for years [centuries even] doubtful.



As far as the constellations go, each one is engraved on one side of its designated stone- that's all.




> As Red Sonja said get rid of your TV or at least stay away from related TV shows. Don't read books like what you are writing.
> 
> Otherwise you're going to be copying what you see because *that *sold expecting yours to likewise sell. You can't make something original if you're merely copying something - either subconsciously or not.



I'm way ahead of you on this one. I haven't turned my box on in almost a year.

This is the trouble with trying to communicate an idea- no matter how clear someone makes their position we cannot control the perception other people garner- no matter how accurate or skewed it may be. 

 The prime example is my own works. I say mysticism - posters here say magic.


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## MzSnowleopard (Dec 7, 2015)

It seems to me that we've strayed from the original topic or are starting to. Could we please return to the subject of the original post- 

has it happened to you and how did you handle it.


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## belthagor (Dec 7, 2015)

MzSnowleopard said:


> It seems to me that we've strayed from the original topic or are starting to. Could we please return to the subject of the original post-
> 
> has it happened to you and how did you handle it.



I got discouraged and gave up.


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## Crowley K. Jarvis (Dec 7, 2015)

It didn't happen to me. 

Using what I've read as inspiration, I come up with my own twists, and use it like building blocks to make concepts that are incredibly different. 

Will it work? Will I be famous? Maybe not.

At least it will be original.


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## TJ1985 (Dec 7, 2015)

It's happened to me. At this point in writing and with the sheer number of people who can create, it's inevitable that an idea will "come to me" even though it came to someone else and though I never read it, it's a mirror of my own work. I handle it by trying to write my "version" better if I can. If there's a critical error in logic in the other work and the the author opted to gloss over it or ignore it, I'll try to explain it to oblivion. If a character should do X and does X in the other version then I'll write it a different (better) way. 

There are only so many situations to be written. This doesn't mean we all have to write them the same way. Maybe write it realistically! In the end, the good guy watches the girl ride into the sunset with somebody else. Here in the real world, sometimes the hero dies, the bad guy gets the girl, and the bank robbers get away. There's nothing wrong with getting on the same road someone else traveled but I see opportunities lost when you stop driving and start following turn by turn.


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