# Agent Roundtable



## strangedaze (Mar 6, 2011)

came across this roundtable interview featuring some of the industry's sexiest agents and thought i'd share. quotes i found particularly interesting:



> You are all deep inside this world, but so many writers aren't. If you were a beginning writer who lived out in Wisconsin or somewhere and didn't know anybody and you were looking for an agent, how would you do it?
> STEINBERG: I would not worry about looking for an agent. I would work on my writing for a long time. And then when I was finally ready, I would ask everyone I know what they thought I should do.
> 
> MASSIE: I agree with that. I would concentrate on getting published in well-regarded literary magazines and, chances are, agents will come to you.
> ...





> Where are you finding writers, aside from referrals? Are you reading literary magazines? Are you reading blogs?
> MASSIE: No blogs.
> 
> RUTMAN: Not for fiction.
> ...





> STEIN: I don't even read synopses. Do you guys?
> 
> STEINBERG: I skip right over them. I go to the first page.
> 
> ...



discuss.

Link: Agents and Editors: A Q&A With Four Literary Agents | Poets & Writers


----------



## Edward G (Mar 10, 2011)

I think when it comes to fiction, a writer has better odds going the self-publishing route. They should write their novel, set up a quick publishing company (just a sole proprietorship), outsource for editing and cover art, learn to format for Kindle, and try to ride that wave. Agents are a joke.

The ones that don't handle big names are going out. The ones that handle big names don't need any other clients.


----------



## Ilasir Maroa (Mar 10, 2011)

Edward G said:


> I think when it comes to fiction, a writer has better odds going the self-publishing route. They should write their novel, set up a quick publishing company (just a sole proprietorship), outsource for editing and cover art, learn to format for Kindle, and try to ride that wave. Agents are a joke.
> 
> The ones that don't handle big names are going out. The ones that handle big names don't need any other clients.





I guess I'll tell that to all the new writers whose agent just sold their book to one of the bix six publishers.  I'm sure they'll jump at the chance to trade in their 20,000 copies sold for 20.



There are great reasons for some authors to self-publish, but right now, there are also good reasons to go the traditional route.


----------



## Terry D (Mar 10, 2011)

Don't take the drivel in that article too seriously.  Those agents, and the magazine which hosted the roundtable, belong to that rarified group of self-important snob who are firmly convinced that the bathroom always smells like gardinias before they flush, and that the writing worth reading is that which they deem literature.  Those snobs wouldn't touch a book that 95% of the reading public (those who actually pay for books and keep the industry alive) would read.

"Concentrate on publishing in well regarded literary magazines . . .", "A lot of my clients teach in MFA programs . . .", "I wouldn't relish the prospect of looking for an agent if I had not come through a program . . ."  Please, people, get over yourselves.


----------



## bysharonnelson (Mar 10, 2011)

That is 4 out of the thousands of agents out there. While I value their experience I do not think that any one person or agency is going to be the same. Every author/writer has to look at their options and make an educated decision for themselves. There are plenty of people who have made successful carriers out of indie publishing it just takes dedication and hard work. I for one would rather do the work and have my fate rest in my own hands than hope and pray that some agent will pull my needle out of the haystack someday. Every viewpoint is valuable but no one is right all of the time.


----------



## Ilasir Maroa (Mar 10, 2011)

First, keep in mind that these are agents for literary fiction.  That genre works differently than other genres in commercial publishing.  While I don't agree with everything said, most of the information is accurate as far as publishing literary fiction.

I'm also very disappointed to see the agent-bashing going on here.  Seriously, this thread is not about whether self-publishing or traditional publishing is better.  It's about some info for those thinking of publishing literary fiction.  Also, if you're going to bash, please cite come evidence for your claims.


----------



## strangedaze (Mar 10, 2011)

Terry D said:


> Don't take the drivel in that article too seriously.  Those agents, and the magazine which hosted the roundtable, belong to that rarified group of self-important snob who are firmly convinced that the bathroom always smells like gardinias before they flush, and that the writing worth reading is that which they deem literature.  Those snobs wouldn't touch a book that 95% of the reading public (those who actually pay for books and keep the industry alive) would read.
> 
> "Concentrate on publishing in well regarded literary magazines . . .", "A lot of my clients teach in MFA programs . . .", "I wouldn't relish the prospect of looking for an agent if I had not come through a program . . ."  Please, people, get over yourselves.


 
i dont know. id be more inclined to trust people who are firmly planted in the industry than . . . . whatever it is you are. which is not to say that what said agents contend is gospel. just that waving your rattle around and saying they have no connection to the reading public, when the reading public essentially accounts for their entire margin of profit, while at the same time offering nothing to support your 'claims,' makes you sound . . . well, i'm not allowed to say what it makes you sound like. 

clearly you don't need to come from a writing program to publish a great novel, or publish in journals, or whatever. i think there are, like, eight million threads on here about that. but pretending it doesn't help is ludicrous. 

i posted the article because i found it interesting and thought other people would find it interesting too. im happy you contributed to this discussion, even though i think you're wrong


----------



## MJ Preston (Mar 10, 2011)

I'm looking for an agent right now. For my book there are only about 25 in North America that handle the horror genre. My plan is to see if I can secure an agent, failing that I'll go directly to the publisher, failing that I'll look at self publishing.


----------



## strangedaze (Mar 10, 2011)

good plan. i wish i could help re: finding a horror agent, but most of my peers do literary stuff. one does memoir, another sci fi. but no horror. best of luck regardless! i think your plan - try to find an agent, then a publisher, barring that self publish, is the way to go about doing it. why not aim for the top?


----------



## Edward G (Mar 11, 2011)

Ilasir Maroa said:


> I guess I'll tell that to all the new writers whose agent just sold their book to one of the bix six publishers. I'm sure they'll jump at the chance to trade in their 20,000 copies sold for 20.
> There are great reasons for some authors to self-publish, but right now, there are also good reasons to go the traditional route.


 
I'm not saying books don't get picked up by agents and sold to the big six. I'm saying it's a lottery. There's no rhyme or reason why those books are chosen over others that are not (given the same standard of writing). But unless the bix six are willing to advertise all over the place to get those books noticed, the author might just as well have self-published. If a publisher is going to have a fiction line, they have to publish someone, that's true, but for the first time novelist, in this publishing environment and economy, they're better off seriously self-publishing. After all, they're going to have to do all the marketing anyway.

Let's say you get $50,000 dollars for a three-book contract from a name publisher. that means, when it's all over with, you get about $35,000 after taxes and agent fees--over three or four years, and god help you if you don't deliver those manuscripts. Yet, you can't even quit your pizza delivery job on that money. When you finally realize how bad you've been ripped off, and yet you still have to write and deliver. Well, let's just hope you have a prescription for Lexapro handy, because you're going to need it.

Oh, and those thousands of agents out there who after charging you a reading and editing and "postage" fee end up selling you on a contract with a small press who then stipulates you have to buy a hundred print copies if you want it published in anything but a badly-formatted Kindle edition--well, let's just say I'm not talking about them.

I know a woman, before the economy collapsed, who got a three-book deal with, I think Penguin. She couldn't come close to quitting her day job.

It is true, a big six publisher, if they want to can make a best seller out of anyone. But they don't do that. That's why I say an author is better off self-publishing and keeping the rights to their work. They're going to have to market the book themselves anyway, and if they want to walk away from it at any time, they can.

This isn't agent bashing. This is the reality of the situation. This is fiction in the Kindle era.

How many bookstores do you think are left? How many publishers do you think are left who are dishing out bucks to authors with no fan base? Oh, I'm sure it happens, but until you read their contracts, I suggest you reconsider whether or not they got a good deal.


----------



## strangedaze (Mar 11, 2011)

Re: Edward's comments  . . . 

your argument re: advances and quitting your day job is universal and doesn't really have anything to do with working with agents in particular. most writers will be doing other things to support themselves; that's just the way it is.

moreover, i would disagree with your comment about being a first time novelist. there has never been a better time for a first time novelist to get a big advance. and the writers i know who have gotten publishing deals with big houses for first books have been pretty happy with their advances. 

anyway, in light of everything you just said, assuming it's all true (and i dont think it is) i would STILL go with a traditional publisher, or try to. someone has to win the lottery. why not at least put yourself in the running?


----------



## Terry D (Mar 11, 2011)

strangedaze said:


> i dont know. id be more inclined to trust people who are firmly planted in the industry than . . . . whatever it is you are. which is not to say that what said agents contend is gospel. just that waving your rattle around and saying they have no connection to the reading public, when the reading public essentially accounts for their entire margin of profit, while at the same time offering nothing to support your 'claims,' makes you sound . . . well, i'm not allowed to say what it makes you sound like.
> 
> clearly you don't need to come from a writing program to publish a great novel, or publish in journals, or whatever. i think there are, like, eight million threads on here about that. but pretending it doesn't help is ludicrous.
> 
> i posted the article because i found it interesting and thought other people would find it interesting too. im happy you contributed to this discussion, even though i think you're wrong


 
I also found the article interesting, but the entire slant of the roundtable was toward "literary fiction" whatever that means. The vast majority of people posting in these forums write 'mainstream' or genre fiction. The agents in that roundtable have no interest in genre fiction and I would hate for new writers to believe that such narrow views were representative of the entire industry. 

What "claims" did I make that you feel need support? It take little research to realize that most publishing authors have not "gone through a program", or taught in MFA programs. Of course such experience can help to hone the writing craft, I never said that it did not, but the statements you cut and pasted into your OP insinuated that it is prerequisite for success. That is far from true. As for my opinion that there is a class of "literary snob" who likes to believe they are superior to the rest of the writing world, I think your pair of not so veiled insults, "whatever it is you are" and " well, i'm not allowed to say what it makes you sound like", offers sufficent proof.

I may not work "in the industry", and I may not live in New York (thank God), but at least I know what the damned shift key on the keyboard is used for.

On edit:  I'm not bashing agents.  I'm taking issue with the elitist attitude represented in that roundtable.


----------



## strangedaze (Mar 11, 2011)

i think its pretty clear that those agents represent literary fiction. pouting about the fact that theyre talking about representing literary fiction - versus, say, thriller or whatever - is stupid. i cut and pasted parts that i found interesting, or surprising, maybe. its your choice how you read into them. 

re: snobbery, my veiled insults dont speak to your writing ability, just what seems to be your character. you could be a great writer - in fact i hope you are. that way your comments dont sound like someone who isnt talented crying about how the world doesnt accept your genius. what i take umbrage with is your reductive view of what agents do. i worked in a literary agency. the way you describe them and the business they do suggests that you only have the vaguest idea of how the particular side of the industry being discussed works.

pointing out that i dont use a shift key doesnt change the fact that the people in the roudtable probably know more than you do about their particular area of expertise. so in the interest of making this thread about something other than you thinking im an elitist and me thinking youre someone who's angry because he couldnt hack it in the publishing world, lets agree to disagree. my inbox is open.


----------



## MJ Preston (Mar 11, 2011)

I found the piece rather insightful.


----------



## Terry D (Mar 11, 2011)

strangedaze said:


> i think its pretty clear that those agents represent literary fiction. pouting about the fact that theyre talking about representing literary fiction - versus, say, thriller or whatever - is stupid. i cut and pasted parts that i found interesting, or surprising, maybe. its your choice how you read into them.
> 
> re: snobbery, my veiled insults dont speak to your writing ability, just what seems to be your character. you could be a great writer - in fact i hope you are. that way your comments dont sound like someone who isnt talented crying about how the world doesnt accept your genius. what i take umbrage with is your reductive view of what agents do. i worked in a literary agency. the way you describe them and the business they do suggests that you only have the vaguest idea of how the particular side of the industry being discussed works.
> 
> pointing out that i dont use a shift key doesnt change the fact that the people in the roudtable probably know more than you do about their particular area of expertise. so in the interest of making this thread about something other than you thinking im an elitist and me thinking youre someone who's angry because he couldnt hack it in the publishing world, lets agree to disagree. my inbox is open.


 
It makes me feel so much better to know that you were simply attacking my character, that says a great deal about your own.  If it is a character flaw to be direct and honest with my assesment of what those agents had to say, then that is a flaw I'm willing to live with.  I never spoke to what agents do.  My comments were restricted to what _those four agents_ had to say, not all agents, and my concern was that the many novice writers who frequent these forums would get an unbalanced view of the industry, and what it takes to succed within it.

I'm not the angry, failed writer you seem to picture.  I have a good, full time job.  I write daily.  I've published some, and someday hope to snag an agent and publish some more.  Most people actually consider me a jovial sort.


----------



## strangedaze (Mar 11, 2011)

in my defense, i was gesturing towards what 'seemed' to be your character. if you are in fact a jovial sort, then i stand corrected. now, back to the matter at hand . . .


----------



## Edward G (Mar 11, 2011)

Well, let's talk about the issue at hand, then. You seem to indicate that Terry Durbin couldn't hack it in the publishing industry, so he self-published. What does that mean? When is one considered published? When they are published by a certain house? Which one? Publishing through Create Space, as Durbin did, has probably left him far better off than the abhorrent results I've seen come out of small presses, and the disasterous contracts I've seen come out of large presses. 

He wrote a book. It's fairly good (which is better than I can say for most new releases on the shelves at Barnes and Noble). He's marketing it and getting it reviewed. So, in what way has he not "hacked" it in the publishing industry?

Those old notions of publishing only counting if the bix six published you died in November of 2006 with the release of Kindle and Amazon's Digital Text Platform. Those big six publishers are perishing, because they can't keep the price of books up. They are having to lower the price of hardbacks and raise the price of e-books, and those are both losing strategies. Eventually, the celebrity authors with their huge audiences that have carried over after Nov 2006 will be gone, and as it stands, no one knows a better way to market an e-book than the way Terry Durbin is doing it right now.

This is the Kindle Era. Terry Durbin is the future, so you better take a look at what he's doing. Given the old school, the way things are now, you might just as well say that a book isn't published until Paramount makes a hit movie from it.


----------



## strangedaze (Mar 11, 2011)

i was more referring to the severity of his response than the fact that he was self-published. in my experience, the people who have such a vehement response to articles like this are the ones who tried to get their work in an agents hand and failed. if thats not the case, thats not the case.

not to sidestep the things you bring up, but this thread isnt really about books going online, or in electronic format. it's about what agents are looking for. or, i should say - as terry pointed out - what these four particular agents are looking for. 

for what its worth, id rather have a publishing deal with random house or harper collins than do what he's doing. but thats just me.


----------



## Ilasir Maroa (Mar 11, 2011)

Edward G said:


> I'm not saying books don't get picked up by agents and sold to the big six. I'm saying it's a lottery. There's no rhyme or reason why those books are chosen over others that are not (given the same standard of writing). But unless the bix six are willing to advertise all over the place to get those books noticed, the author might just as well have self-published. If a publisher is going to have a fiction line, they have to publish someone, that's true, but for the first time novelist, in this publishing environment and economy, they're better off seriously self-publishing. After all, they're going to have to do all the marketing anyway.
> 
> Let's say you get $50,000 dollars for a three-book contract from a name publisher. that means, when it's all over with, you get about $35,000 after taxes and agent fees--over three or four years, and god help you if you don't deliver those manuscripts. Yet, you can't even quit your pizza delivery job on that money. When you finally realize how bad you've been ripped off, and yet you still have to write and deliver. Well, let's just hope you have a prescription for Lexapro handy, because you're going to need it.
> 
> ...


 

Wow, you seem to have some wrong ideas here. Even many best-sellers don't manage to quit their day jobs after one deal. You generally need five or six semi-successful books to have a chance at writing for a living. Publishers do not rip anyone off. When you sell a book, you're getting paid per copy sold. The advance is just a nice thing the publisher does where they give you money you haven't earned up-front.

As far as fee-charging agents, no one has ever supported those pratices.

A big six publisher cannot make a best-seller out of anyone. Nobody "makes" a best-seller. They can guess, and spend extra money trying to give a book a good start, but it's the readers who make a book a best-seller.

Publishers are not a rip-off, they are a service industry. Sure, I could do every single thing the publisher does myself, but I shoulder all of the risk, I won't be as good, and I won't be in stores. I could be on Kindle, sure, and there are many ways to market yourself on Kindle, but I still won't be quitting my day job for several books. I will have to market even more, and attempt to overcome the stigma of being self-published, all the while trying to not get fired from my regular job.

More on rip-offs: Bookselling is not a high profit industry for most people. Publishers run on some of the lowest profit margins anywhere. To be honest, they see no more than 50% gross of what the books sells for in store, and they net a good deal less than that, after paying royalties, staff, etc.

Now, you can sell lower and earn higher in self-publishing depending on how you work it, but you have to find a reputable, _good_ editor, a cover designer, make your own contacts for any reviews and blurbs, set up your own publicity, convince book stores to stock your books, let you hold signings, etc. Some writers can do all that themselves and be very successful. Few actually have.

And I'm getting side-tracked again.  This thread is not about e-publishing, or self-publishing, or whatever.  It's about agents, for those of us who want an agent.


----------



## MJ Preston (Mar 11, 2011)

This thread is like sitting at a table with a bunch of agents.=D>

I know you are, but what am I?:cheers:


----------



## Terry D (Mar 11, 2011)

strangedaze said:


> for what its worth, id rather have a publishing deal with random house or harper collins than do what he's doing. but thats just me.


 
Trust me, so would I.

I'd like to thank Edward for his good words, they are appreciated.  In the context of the exchanges earlier, however, I wasn't even thinking about my book, and my experience with it.  The Legacy of Aaron Geist has been sitting on a shelf for more than a dozen years, after a couple of half-hearted attempts to present it to publishers.  At that time it was more customary for new writers to present their books directly to publishers -- to dive into the slush pile -- than it was to approach agents first.  Particularly in genre fiction.  Few people had even read the book until a writer friend of mine whose opinion I value, asked to read it.  His positive reaction rekindled my own interest.

I chose to self-publish the book as a test to see if others would enjoy it also, and as a way to preserve a copy of my creation between covers and not just in an old box.  Perhaps I should have gone the traditional route this time also, but I've moved on to a new book of a more mainstream nature, and wanted to focus my attention on that.  I fully intend to try and market the new book to traditional publishers, and this time I will be far more persistant and agressive in doing so.  I quit on my first book.  I now know that was a mistake.  I do not regret self-publishing Legacy; how can I, I already make a profit on every copy I sell, I had a book signing last weekend and another scheduled for tomorrow, I've been approached by the local newspaper for an interview and was interviewed last night by a decidedly non-local radio station.  These are experiences I may never have had otherwise.  And best of all, I'm getting feedback from people who enjoy my work in exactly the way I wanted it to be enjoyed.  This whole phase of Legacy's existance is still unfolding; the book has only been available for about eight weeks, and I haven't yet tested the e-book waters , so I'm excited to see where it goes.

Sure, I'd love to land a book deal with a major publisher -- I'm an opinionated old fart, not crazy!  But knowing that there are actually people out there who are waiting for the next book, however it may be published, is tremendous motivation.


----------



## Ilasir Maroa (Mar 11, 2011)

MJ Preston said:


> This thread is like sitting at a table with a bunch of agents.=D>
> 
> I know you are, but what am I?:cheers:





I know, right?  Every time you try to talk about some business aspect of writing, we all feel the need to argue about self-publishing.


----------



## Ilasir Maroa (Mar 11, 2011)

Terry D said:


> Trust me, so would I.
> 
> I'd like to thank Edward for his good words, they are appreciated. In the context of the exchanges earlier, however, I wasn't even thinking about my book, and my experience with it. The Legacy of Aaron Geist has been sitting on a shelf for more than a dozen years, after a couple of half-hearted attempts to present it to publishers. At that time it was more customary for new writers to present their books directly to publishers -- to dive into the slush pile -- than it was to approach agents first. Particularly in genre fiction. Few people had even read the book until a writer friend of mine whose opinion I value, asked to read it. His positive reaction rekindled my own interest.
> 
> ...




That's awesome.  Self-publishing can work, and if you really want to test the waters directly, it can be an effective measure.  Good luck with your interviews and events.


----------



## Edward G (Mar 11, 2011)

Ilasir Maroa said:


> Wow, you seem to have some wrong ideas here. Even many best-sellers don't manage to quit their day jobs after one deal. You generally need five or six semi-successful books to have a chance at writing for a living. Publishers do not rip anyone off. When you sell a book, you're getting paid per copy sold. The advance is just a nice thing the publisher does where they give you money you haven't earned up-front.


 
Publishers don't rip anyone off? Hmmm. I suppose that all depends on your definition. And I must say, even I didn't think it was that bad, needing five semi-successful books. 




> As far as fee-charging agents, no one has ever supported those pratices.
> 
> A big six publisher cannot make a best-seller out of anyone. Nobody "makes" a best-seller. They can guess, and spend extra money trying to give a book a good start, but it's the readers who make a book a best-seller.


 
Again, I suppose it's how you look at it. Yes, readers buy the books, eventually, but best sellers are based on books shipped, not sold. Secondly, if you put the book in TV ad spots, priority placement in Barnes & Noble, pay some newspapers by way of expensive ads to review the book, etc...you create the buzz. Even the _Turner Diaries_ got big after it was...ahem...advertised on the news.



> Publishers are not a rip-off, they are a service industry. Sure, I could do every single thing the publisher does myself, but I shoulder all of the risk, I won't be as good, and I won't be in stores. I could be on Kindle, sure, and there are many ways to market yourself on Kindle, but I still won't be quitting my day job for several books. I will have to market even more, and attempt to overcome the stigma of being self-published, all the while trying to not get fired from my regular job.


 
Self-published doesn't matter anymore. It doesn't. If a big publisher will advertise and push your book, then you definitely want to go with them, if they expect you to do the marketing, you might as well call yourself BS Publishing and publish it yourself. So what if a publisher prints up 5000 books and gets them into Barnes and Noble to sit spine out on a fiction shelf? They won't sell. All you get is your advance and getting one of those these days is a lottery. And how all this fits into the OP is this one simple fact: agents today are completely irrelevant to the new fiction writer. Unless that is you get one specifically to market the movie rights after the book is popular. Sure a well-connected agent might get you a deal, but you're only going to get that agent after you've made the deal for them by showing you have an audience. And if you have an audience--why would you need an agent or a publisher? Just like JA Konrath and Amanda Hocking.


----------



## strangedaze (Mar 12, 2011)

an advance is a lottery? agents are irrelevant? what planet are you living on? or maybe, what planet am i living on? i know a good half-dozen first time novelists who got agents and through those agents got pretty nice advances. hell, one even got a movie deal out of it (and the book thats being made into a movie was a novella, published by a small press, that the agent flogged relentlessly until it found 8 foreign publishers and the aforementioned movie deal). these are people i know and hang out with, who live in the same city i do (in Canada - not exactly a publishing hot bed). none of them had 'audiences' ahead of time, unless you count publishing in literary journals and the like. not all of these folks are best sellers - one actually is - but all of them have been reviewed nationally (and often internationally), which is near-impossible for a self-published book; one just won a big big big international award, which is near impossible for a self-published book; and i can go to any city in the country and find their books in stock, which is near-impossible for a self-published book. but i digress. self-publishing isnt wrong or bad or evil - i just think you're willfully ignoring some of the things Ilasir pointed out.

in summary: im having a tough time reconciling your claim that agents are not relevant to new fiction writers with what im seeing tangibly in the real world. maybe these people i know are exceptions to whatever rule youre implicitly citing. or maybe youre making sweeping generalizations about what an agent can do for you. in my own experience, ive published stories here and there, one of which won a national award. those well-connected agents who you claim are only interested in you if you have an audience have started emailing me, a young 'first time' writer with no real audience or internet presence to speak of. maybe im an exception too, but since ive seen similar things happen over and over again, i think maybe youre not giving the article a chance.


----------



## Ilasir Maroa (Mar 12, 2011)

Edward G said:


> Publishers don't rip anyone off? Hmmm. I suppose that all depends on your definition. And I must say, even I didn't think it was that bad, needing five semi-successful books.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Everyone always brings up JA Konrath.  At least site someone reasonable like Laura Resnick.

Despite what he likes to tell the public, there are a lot of factors influencing Konrath's success that new authors just don't have goin for them, and this thread is not the place to debate them.

I can name twenty new writers who I've encountered that were published with agents from the sluch pile and who have done reasonablly well.

A lot of people get fiction and non-fiction mixed up with that whole platform/audience thing.  You don't need either for fiction.  I don't know if that's you or not, but I thought I'd mention it.


----------



## strangedaze (Mar 12, 2011)

maybe we should bury the self-publishing crusade, or at least save it for another thread. i think the debate about whether or not you need a platform for fiction is interesting. im also curious about how the rules change with genre fiction. since i mostly work in literary fiction, and i only know one sci fi writer who found an agent, im curious to hear from horror writers and the like who can either go with whats been said by the roundtable, or refute. the friend i have was pretty well entrenched - her stories appear in all the big venues, including those best-of fantasy anthologies, so i think that helped in her case. and going to conferences too, which seems to me to be pretty important in writing in a genre that can be cliquey. however, her manuscript was picked through the slush and her first book is coming out from - i think - some imprint of macmillan or something. cant remember.


----------



## Ilasir Maroa (Mar 12, 2011)

If you're going to be publishing non-fiction nowadays, you have to have either a built-in audience, or a way to get one.  You need to be an expert in the field, and you need to be well-known for the most part.  A lot of newer writers came onto the internet looking for information, and they confused this advice which iis aimed at non-fiction writers for advice aimed at everyone.

That's not to say that having a fiction writer having a blog following of several thousand won't be taken into account.  Publishing is a business, so if the publisher is trying to decide whether a book is marketable, being able to say you already have a tons of fans willing to buy the book is going to work in your favor.  But that's not a platform, and you won't be turned down just because you aren't a blogging genius.


----------



## Ilasir Maroa (Mar 12, 2011)

As far as how what these agents said applies to the genre market:

Get an agent when you think you're ready. People have been picked up from short story markets, by agents and publishers. It happens. But agents ae busy. They have to sort through their own slush, work with their current clients, do all the stuff that an agent has to do. There are a million genre magazines. Agents don't have time to look through every single magazine, not even the big ones.

There are programs for genre writers. Not a lot of MFAs, but independent workshops like Clarion that cater to genre requirements. There are plenty of MFAs you can get into writing genre work, but the whole "professor lead me" thing is not very common.



Who you know matters everywhere. Contacts matter everywhere. But I don't know any genre agents who get as many referals as these agents seem to be claiming. You might pitch to an agent at a con, or you might go through the slush. Those seem to be the main ways. There isn't the whole network of MFAs going on. Also, tons of agents in genre fiction have blogs and read blogs. There's definitely a strong online community. But I would agree with the litifc folks that there aren't many people who get published because of a blog. The only one I can think of is John Scalzi, who first published his book on his blog and then got picked up.



Synopsis is an individual thing. Some agents like them. The point of the synopsis is to show you can plot a decent story. They are generally sent with a partial manuscript.

I think it's interesting that they say they don't think people worried about the business side are going to be good clients. All the genre talk is about getting your business side down. That doesn't mean you don't handle the creative stuff, too. At least as far as genre writing goes, the business aspects of publishing are very important. Queries live or die on professionalism, and all the agents and athors who blog talk about how to get that stuff right. Nobody sees your story if you can't get through the slush pile.

For most genre writers, writing is a business.  If you can tear open a gateway into the human soul, that's fantastic.  But the goal here is entertainment.  So what if you don't win the Booker Prize, or the Nobel, or whatever prize is applicable?  You can still be a massively successful writer.


----------



## Lakeside3533 (Mar 30, 2012)

Remember that that post was written a few years ago. Right now with the ebooks and self publishing, these agents are probably in a full court press. 

They were reacting the way they did in, I'm guessing 2007, because self-publishing and ebooks sales were really a small percentage. 

Right now, agents might be finding out that their population will be contracting very soon. (along with the brick and mortar outlets)

Now, they and publishing companies are desperate and going for the sure things. Judging from the trends, especially now that distopia has reared its ugly (Hunger Games) head you are going to see a real rush (by agents and publishers) to find the next Collins. Their advice for the writer in "Wisconsin" was hilarious.

Write not to the trend but to what is your passion because you are going to have to promote it!

I guess we all need to take MFA courses so our teachers (their clients) can recommend us. LMAO. I guess that was so 2007 for literary fiction agents.


----------

