# How long can you follow someone for in a car, before that person notices?



## ironpony (Nov 18, 2018)

For my story, I want the villain to be followed in his car, by the main character, so the main character to see if he can catch him doing any criminal activity.  However, I also want the villain to be followed by another character as well, with his own motivations, cause I want all three of this characters to end up in the same place, at the same time, for something specific to happen.

However, if a person is a criminal and is probably naturally looking over his shoulder all the time, knowing that the police could be on to him since they are investigating his crimes, how long can he be followed without him noticing, especially if I want two characters following him, in order for three parties to all end up in the same place?  Especially when they have to follow him outside of town, which means on the highway, where there is less traffic?

What do you think?


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## Arachne (Nov 19, 2018)

That just depends how many turns are made. If 2 cars followed me on a motorway I wouldn't notice for potentially hundreds of miles, as everyone's going the same way, but if someone followed me through town, making every turn and stop that I did, then I might notice after 15 mins or so, probably quicker if it was night time and there were less cars.  

Arachne


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## bdcharles (Nov 19, 2018)

Try it and see.


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## ironpony (Nov 19, 2018)

Okay thanks.  Well this situation would take place at night for what I want cause some crimes and killing happens, and I do not want a lot of people out and about to see.  So I would want to it to take place at night.

As for how many turns are made, well I don't plan on showing the entire car following and would want to skip ahead in time.   But I would say they would be following the villain for at least a couple of days, before they spot the villain commit some crimes, and then some other killing and violence goes down.

But I would say this part would happen at night, cause I don't want additional witness characters around.  So I would say they would follow him for at least a couple of days, and then at night.  But I wouldn't show the entire process.

So if I skip ahead in time, would the reader assume the villain probably had time to notice?


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## Hill.T.Manner (Nov 19, 2018)

bdcharles said:


> Try it and see.



I gotta agree with this, education is the best tool for a writer when wanting to write factually, and the best education is experience.


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## Guard Dog (Nov 19, 2018)

Folks, in the age of gun permits and concealed carry, I'm not sure following anybody around is such a good idea...

...and ther's always the chance that you'll pick a paranoid gang-banger that isn't too concerned with any of that and just starts shooting the second he thinks he's being tailed.

And even if ya don't get shot, what are ya gonna tell the police if the person you're following catches on, and calls the cops, while keepin' you occupied?

So... maybe that's not such a wise experiment?

Also keep in mind that culpability can be a rough thing to contend with, should someone get hurt or killed, and a civil lawsuit is filed.

...just sayin'.



G.D.


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## SueC (Nov 19, 2018)

Give him a cell phone and he won't notice a thing.


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## Hill.T.Manner (Nov 19, 2018)

Guard Dog said:


> Folks, in the age of gun permits and concealed carry, I'm not sure following anybody around is such a good idea...
> 
> ...and ther's always the chance that you'll pick a paranoid gang-banger that isn't too concerned with any of that and just starts shooting the second he thinks he's being tailed.
> 
> ...



If I came across as serious it wasn't meant to be, hopefully he's not out tailing people right now lol


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## Arachne (Nov 19, 2018)

ironpony said:


> So if I skip ahead in time, would the reader assume the villain probably had time to notice?



Yes, even a slightly dopey person would surely notice after a couple of days. 

Arachne


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## ironpony (Nov 19, 2018)

Okay thanks.  And yeah I didn't think the idea of following a stranger around was serious .

So for my story, what if the main character and the supporting character, both planted tracking devices on the villains car to follow him around?  However, this creates the dilemma of how does a person build their own tracking devices, if they do not have access to professional ones?  Or where would you get one?

And also, is it too coincidental that if two people want to follow the same person around, that they would both place their own tracking devices on the person's car?


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## Ralph Rotten (Nov 19, 2018)

You assume that they would need line of sight to follow him.
If I wanted to track you, I'd throw a cellphone in your trunk and track it via the internet.
But if that phone rang during the process then the bad guy could hear it...
So be sure that when your hero enables TRACKING, he also turns off the ringer...unless you WANT him to be found out.


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## Guard Dog (Nov 19, 2018)

Ralph Rotten said:


> So be sure that when your hero enables TRACKING, he also turns off the ringer...unless you WANT him to be found out.



I dunno... having it go off, the ringer being turned all the way up, and the ringtone being "Stars and Stripes Forever" might be pretty damned funny. :icon_cheesygrin:



G.D.


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## ironpony (Nov 19, 2018)

Okay thanks, I was thinking some sort of tracking device perhaps, but how do you track a cellphone with the internet though?  I looked it up and you can use tracking services online, but wouldn't that leave a papertrail for the police to follow once characters turned up dead?

I don't want the police to ever know about this tracking, so would the internet be safe for that?


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## lonewriter (Nov 20, 2018)

I would look for someone who has a defensive driving background. I am lucky, I have had several relatives with either military or law enforcement backgrounds to talk to but you could look online for someone who is an adviser.


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## lonewriter (Nov 20, 2018)

Ralph Rotten said:


> You assume that they would need line of sight to follow him.
> If I wanted to track you, I'd throw a cellphone in your trunk and track it via the internet.
> But if that phone rang during the process then the bad guy could hear it...
> So be sure that when your hero enables TRACKING, he also turns off the ringer...unless you WANT him to be found out.


The cell phone could be placed on silent


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## ironpony (Nov 20, 2018)

Yep for sure, but I am worried about the cellphone running out of power.  Plus I want two characters to follow the villain, and neither of them know of each other, so does that mean they would both place cellphones on his car and use the same method then?


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## Jack of all trades (Nov 20, 2018)

If the villain has GPS, he's trackable.

If he doesn't, there's probably devices you can buy to place on the car so it can be tracked. I know that several years ago I saw such devices being advertised. The ad recommended them for checking to see if your SO was cheating. There were also kid trackers being advertised that year. Not sure if those kind of things are still available.


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## ironpony (Nov 20, 2018)

Well the main character does not know the villain's phone number though, so we wouldn't know is gps therefore, would he?

As for those devices you can get to see if your SO is cheating, the problem with those devices, is that they cannot be viewed live during the car following.  They have to be placed on a car, then taken off of the car later, and then plugged into a computer to view, it, after it is taken off the car.

Where as for my story, in order to get three characters in the same place at the same time, all of the car tracking, has to be live I think.


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## Bloggsworth (Nov 21, 2018)

Which chapter do you want us to write for you this time?


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## ironpony (Nov 21, 2018)

Sorry, you're right I shouldn't be asking other people to write it for me, I was just wondering how a person can be followed for a few days around, without noticing it.  I can do the cellphone tracking, but how does one track a cellphone exactly?  When I google cellphone tracking, it says that there is services that do that.  But I don't want my character to use a service cause that would leave a papertrail.  Is there a way to track a cellphone without leaving one?


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## Guard Dog (Nov 22, 2018)

ironpony said:


> Sorry, you're right I shouldn't be asking other people to write it for me...



Then *STOP* already.

It's not like researching this stuff is that hard.

And you _are_ on a computer, so have access to Google.

So do it yourself. Go look this stuff up, and look for reliable sources that might actually have some first-hand experience.

I mean, I found freakin' three-headed turkeys, without really trying, so how damned hard can anything else be to locate?

Asking for help is one thing, but what you seem to make a habit of doing is another entirely.





G.D.


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## Ralph Rotten (Nov 22, 2018)

Guard Dog said:


> I dunno... having it go off, the ringer being turned all the way up, and the ringtone being "Stars and Stripes Forever" might be pretty damned funny. :icon_cheesygrin:
> 
> 
> 
> G.D.





EXACTLY the point I was trying to make.
It would be funny for the villain to keep hearing this ringing sound before he finally investigates.



Okay, if I wanted to track you with a cell phone, the hardest part is getting the phone into your vehicle.
After that I'd walk into a pawn shop and buy a cheap laptop. I just bought a Chromebook for $50 the other day*.
The tricky part is actually the internet connection.
You could use free wifi all around town, but you would do it from the parking lot. Starbux has free wifi, but they also have cameras, usually 5 of them.
So you sit in the parking lot and make note of where the villain stops. You could later visit those places, or use the tracking to guide a second person to that location realtime.


Study up on the tracking features of an I-phone.









*I needed a new camping laptop so I can write while I'm in the mountains.


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## ironpony (Nov 22, 2018)

Okay thanks, sorry if I was asking too many questions and not doing enough research.  I did research on google and youtube, and after looking it up, the problem with tracking someone with the internet is that it leaves a record.  For my story, I don't want the police to be able to find out that the main character was tracking the villain, because if tracking is done using cell phone tracking websites on the internet, those sites can leave a papertrail or a record for the police to find, right?

So I thought it would be more simple, and less complicated for my story, if the main character was able to track a cellphone without using the internet, so it won't leave a record therefore.  But in my research I cannot find a way for a person to do that.  So therefore, is the cellphone idea, even workable for my plot?


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## Guard Dog (Nov 22, 2018)

Christ on a freakin' crutch...

Burner phone + proxy servers/proxy websites = a trail that leads nowhere, unless your the goddamn CIA.

No, you did not do your research, nor really think through what you were after. You just didn't dig far enough nor ask the proper questions.

Hint: A paper trail is useless to the cops or anybody else if it doesn't lead to the person that's actually guilty or that you're after.

You do not have the skills or knowledge to write the story you claim you want to, 'pony. And you apparently have no interest in trying to acquire them.

...and you're not going to get others to do it for you. Nor do you want to, unless you don't mind having to give a whole lot of writing credits to other people. Which is what will happen if it's not really your story.


G.D.


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## ironpony (Nov 22, 2018)

Okay thanks, but I do not know how all of this works.  For example, non of these websites say whether or not the police can trace the method the are talking about.  But now that you mention proxy server, that makes sense.  Thanks.  Sorry, it just didn't come up before in my research and wasn't sure if the police could trace the methods that came up.

So if I write it so that the main character, and the supporting character both plant a cellphone on the villains car, and track it that way, would that come off as too coincidental to the reader, that they both thought of the same method to follow the villain?


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## Guard Dog (Nov 22, 2018)

Damn... I never knew a story could be created like  a paint-by-numbers kit.

Just get someone else to draw out the thing, and add the numbers into the proper places, then all you've gotta do is... well, in this case, have someone hand you the brush with the right paint on it as well, and point to the correct space.

Unbelievable.




G.D.


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## ironpony (Nov 22, 2018)

Did I do something wrong?  I just was trying to ask for other people's opinion on if that would work.


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## SueC (Nov 22, 2018)

Ironpony, it's one thing to have a discussion about hypothetical situations, where a variety of ideas or solutions to a problem can be shared. It's quite another thing if a writer is struggling to put specific points together for a story and is looking for others writers to provide scenarios and answers. Having said that, we typically encourage members to ask questions, but when the point is consistently missed or misunderstood, it may be time to take a second look at what you are actually asking.



> Did I do something wrong? I just was trying to ask for other people's opinion on if that would work.



You are not really doing that. Instead, I think you are trying to get others to tell you, if it wouldn't work, what would? And that is not really something anyone else can do - only you.



> I did research on google and youtube, and after looking it up, the problem with tracking someone with the internet is that it leaves a record. For my story, I don't want the police to be able to find out that the main character was tracking the villain, because if tracking is done using cell phone tracking websites on the internet, those sites can leave a papertrail or a record for the police to find, right?



You say, "for my story . . ." you want to do something that, in your research, you have found will not work. Then you may have to change your story. You already have your answers and as long as you appear to want to write a fact-based story, you are going to have to accept the limitations of the line of the story that you have chosen.

I hope this helps, Ironpony. Good luck with your project!


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## ironpony (Nov 22, 2018)

Okay thank you for the advice, and thanks everyone else! There is one thing I would like opinion on, on whether or not this works, if that's okay.

I can write it so that the main character tracks the villain by laptop then, using a proxy-server so it can't be traced back to him.  However, there is still the matter of the third character who is also tracking and following the villain, since I want all three characters to arrive at the same place, at the same time.

So if the third character were to also put a phone on the villains car and track it as well, would that come off as too coincidental, that they both chose the same method?


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## Arachne (Nov 23, 2018)

Do _you_ think it comes off as too coincidental?


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## ironpony (Nov 23, 2018)

Yeah I think it does, but at the same time, it was established that the villain would notice if someone was following him with line of sight.  What if I wrote it so that it is not explained how the second character is following the villain as well, and it's just left up to the imagination as I skip ahead to the second character arriving having followed the villain all along?

Or will the reader want an explanation since the main character used a cellphone to follow the villain, would they want an explanation as to how the second character did it too?


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## Arachne (Nov 24, 2018)

You should follow your own gut instinct and write the story how you want it. Try not to worry so much about other people’s opinions and ideas. It’s your book so you get to decide all this stuff, that’s the beauty of it!


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## ironpony (Nov 24, 2018)

Okay thanks.  My gut instinct tells me if that if I show the main character and the secondary character both put cellphones on the car, than that will be too coincidental.  But if I tell it from the MC's point of view, he puts a phone on, and then follows the villain, but then the secondary character turns out to be following the villain as well and arrives by surprise, then the reader will not associate it as a coincidence so much, cause they don't know if the secondary character is using the same method.

However, how long can the longest cell phone battery last, cause the main character would have to keep swapping the phone out of the car, with another to recharge, won't he?


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## Arachne (Nov 24, 2018)

Then go with your gut.

I’m not sure about phone battery life, you could check google for that one.


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## Horsey (Nov 27, 2018)

It depends. A trained intelligence agent would be able to tail someone for quite a while as they would have the training to keep a certain distance and stay out of direct line of sight.  A detective would probably have some of the same experience, so I reckon if he were careful, quite a while.  A civilian might bung up the whole thing fairly quick.

Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk


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## ironpony (Nov 28, 2018)

Okay thanks.  But if the person already knows he is being investigated by the police, and therefore is logically looking over his shoulder, do you think detectives are still trained to avoid even those types who are aware of the police being onto them?


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## Horsey (Nov 28, 2018)

ironpony said:


> Okay thanks.  But if the person already knows he is being investigated by the police, and therefore is logically looking over his shoulder, do you think detectives are still trained to avoid even those types who are aware of the police being onto them?


Absolutely!

Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk


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## Newman (Nov 28, 2018)

ironpony said:


> For my story, I want the villain to be followed in his car, by the main character, so the main character to see if he can catch him doing any criminal activity.  However, I also want the villain to be followed by another character as well, with his own motivations, cause I want all three of this characters to end up in the same place, at the same time, for something specific to happen.
> 
> However, if a person is a criminal and is probably naturally looking over his shoulder all the time, knowing that the police could be on to him since they are investigating his crimes, how long can he be followed without him noticing, especially if I want two characters following him, in order for three parties to all end up in the same place?  Especially when they have to follow him outside of town, which means on the highway, where there is less traffic?
> 
> What do you think?



I'd say it depends on what's going on in the car.

If I'm arguing with my wife and having an affair with the babysitter who is watching the kids in the back seat, all of whom argue with me...it could be a while before I notice...

On the other hand, if I've just picked up ten kilos of cocaine and am driving to the border, my eyes are on the rear view mirror....


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## ironpony (Nov 28, 2018)

It's more like the second scenario, where you are going around committing crimes and are cautious.


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