# normal



## Fats Velvet

a manner
of formalized
madness.


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## ned

like the insight and despair.
a mad form of manner, indeed.

cheers Ned


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## inkwellness

This rings clear with a simple, yet precise message: Normality is a society-driven approximation. 

Good stuff.


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## Bard_Daniel

So poignant and true.

Cuts like a knife. Nicely put!


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## escorial

fantastic piece...has everything I like about poetry....and more


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## Nellie

Nice and truthful. Thanks.


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## TL Murphy

This short poem begs for more.  What is the consequence of normalized madness?  Is there even such a thing as normal? What if the words in the poem revolved like musical chairs:

Madness

a formalized
manner
of normal


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## RHPeat

An interesting thought Tim

What if in madness, manner was normal. Then normal becomes something really twisted into a kind of madness. Which seems to be Fat's intent. 

Madness

a formalized
manner
as normal

a poet friend
RH Peat


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## TL Murphy

That's what I mean.  You could just keep these words rolling around to different positions.  They all spin a slightly different light on the original.

Manner

A normalized
madness of
formal.


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## audrey

I agree with TL and RHPeat--y0u could keep spinning this around --play with them a bit and see if anything tickles your fancy Fat--there is a lot to play with in these few lines


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## Fats Velvet

Uh, the problem with these reworkings is that they radically alter the meaning.


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## audrey

I see what you mean FV--there are a lot of possible permutations here--somehow, for me, the piece calls for permutations--maybe in addition to--it is as if there are so many different ways to be normal--or mad --


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## TL Murphy

Radical is relative. But yes, they do alter the meaning.  But these rewordings are not intended to substitute for the original or to change the intent of the original.  It's a way of playing around with the original to draw out the metaphor of how far normal can be pushed within the given form.


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## Ariel

As flattering as I'm sure Fats finds this imitation and discussion of his work the purpose here is to critique his poem--which these reworkings do not accomplish.  If you would like to continue playing with a poem like this then I suggest starting a game in the poetry games forum.  I would not suggest using Fats's poem as the starter unless you receive Fats's permission.

Keep all further discussion about the original poem.


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## Robbie

I wrote a very long poem on Madnees. I will edit it and post it soon. As I recall several great writers were indeed "mad." Emerson said that many writers and geniuses had to use laudanum and other drugs just to take off the edge off so they could write.  Maybe that is why I wrote better with a hearty or is it "Hardy" as in Thomas glass of wine. How does one spell "hardy."?


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## Fats Velvet

Everybody: Feel free to reorder the words as you see fit and call it your own.  Just don't claim that it says the same thing as the original.


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## RHPeat

Fats 
Are you saying there is no subjectivity to your poem at all? That there is no metaphorical content in the poem? That the poem is only denotative, and that it's not connotative in any way? In a way you suggest that a reader should not bring themselves to the poem at all? I'm only seeking to understand what you're saying about the poem and the interpretive process of reading words in general. I'm just wondering where the creator of art lets go of the personal creation to allow it to stand on it's own merit, and where the viewer/reader/listener picks something up and begins to respond to their own feelings about that art experience, whatever it might be? 

a poet friend
RH Peat


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## LeeC

Hadn't commented on this offering yet Fats, beyond Liking, because, as with some of es's pieces, it encapsulates an aspect of our subjective being so succinctly. 

That take is enhanced in seeing the rhetoric generated


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## Nellie

I liked this poem because it speaks volumes to so many in that there is _no_ such thing as "normal". I like the way Fats worded it. We all have our own quirks and even some have mental issues, suffer bi-polar, depression, etc., like Robbie suggested, but society says we all must behave in a certain formalized manner, otherwise we would be put away if not. I'm not saying I am crazy nor do I think we are all crazy.  Just that we need to deal with reality.


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## Fats Velvet

RHPeat said:


> Fats
> Are you saying there is no subjectivity to your poem at all? That there is no metaphorical content in the poem? That the poem is only denotative, and that it's not connotative in any way? In a way you suggest that a reader should not bring themselves to the poem at all? I'm only seeking to understand what you're saying about the poem and the interpretive process of reading words in general. I'm just wondering where the creator of art lets go of the personal creation to allow it to stand on it's own merit, and where the viewer/reader/listener picks something up and begins to respond to their own feelings about that art experience, whatever it might be?
> 
> a poet friend
> RH Peat



The experience is yours.  The poem is mine.  I have no problem accepting feedback.  What you have provided is not constructive feedback; it is a form of butchery.  



> What if in madness, manner was normal. Then normal becomes something  really twisted into a kind of madness. Which seems to be Fat's intent.
> 
> Madness
> 
> a formalized
> manner
> as normal
> 
> a poet friend
> RH Peat



You recognize the intent, and go on to discard it. 

"a formalized
manner
as normal"

This states the obvious, the idea that "normality" is regulated by laws and codes of behavior.   No shit.  Feel free to slap your name on that.  

Mine:

"a manner
of formalized
madness."

This states something different, the idea that the laws and codes of behavior regulating "normality" are a _codification_ of insanities, an irony that often escapes the "normal".

Nobody is telling you to subordinate your perspective to a set of words.  But you damn well better be prepared to meet those words on their own ground.


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## TL Murphy

Fats,
All of my comments on this thread derive from my first comment, which is, "this short poem begs for more." No one is trying to usurp the poem or change your words. It is absolutely your poem.  I am making leaps. The point is that there's an opportunity for you to extend the metaphore in this little gem by reordering the words in successive stanzas which would demonstrate in the wording itself how far from normal, normal can be. Isn't it interesting how such a large concept can be generated by so few words.


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## Darkkin

Fats,

Most of your work is way over my head, but with this one you manage to take chaos theory out of a linear, planed construct and make it elementally, fundamentally human.  Reality is a reflection of our own perceptions and our reactions to them.  Chaos as ordered by the individual.  Well done.

- D. the T. of P.B.


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## -xXx-

, anyone?
8/10, 'cuz FV chooses words carefully.


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## Cran

The posts about critique and forum guidelines have been moved to *Critique to Curiosity* in Poetry Discussion. We try to follow the protocol that the OP sets the topic, so in this instance, any discussion may explore any aspect or question about the poem that leads this thread. Tangential discussions do happen, but leaps to other topics are better served where other members will more likely look for them.


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## Donna Sbat

I agree, it's worded precisely. Any other arrangement of the same words would alter the meaning in to something entirely different.

"Normal
a manner
 of formalized 
madness"   

What society generally accepts as "normal" is lots of "formalized" behavior, that may seem completely odd in another society. Basically everything is normal, and everything is madness, depending on each individual's point of view.


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## Josh Colon

Fats Velvet >
normal				 a manner
 of formalized
 madness.​

>>>>>

I find it fascinating that so few words can generate so many comments.
Thanks.
Josh.


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## shedpog329

hey maybe im normal then huh? nice write fatz


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## kaminoshiyo

Fats Velvet said:


> a manner
> of formalized
> madness.



I don't like it when peopl know my secrets...


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## xtrmnitemare

Short but definitely not simple. Packs a punch in so few words.


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